Suzanne Moore in the Guardian re Jimmy Saville

[GetOrfAKAMrsUsainBolt]

I am very sorry as I am on my phone and can't link useless.

But I think it is a very good article - gets away from the media arguing with itself and the whole 'deputy heads must roll' at the BBC, and discusses that the key point about all of this is the fact that children have been abused.

Anyway I think it sums up a lot of what I have seen on Mumsnet.

[ParsleyTheLioness]

Haven't seen this yet, will try and look.

[GetOrfAKAMrsUsainBolt]

m.guardian.co.uk/ms/p/gnm/op/shPi_HLLErcTR-DQO91AOkg/view.m?id=15&gid=commentisfree/2012/oct/24/savile-scandal-children-overpaid-executives&cat=commentisfree

Does that work? (Doesn't want to be lame and make excuses for not being able to link)

[ParsleyTheLioness]

Yes, its worked. Going to have a looksy.

[GetOrfAKAMrsUsainBolt]

Oh it turns out you CAN link from phones.

I was getting quite annoyed yesterday - ys it is important that there was some kind of cover up at the BBC, but how bloody ridiculous that this has seemed to displace how the hell JS was able to infiltrate not just the bBC but also mental institutions, childrens homes and hospitals. This is a massively wide scandal imo, so why are people so focused on George Entwistle's performance at the select committee. It's just seemed to turn into an introspective media circus.

[ParsleyTheLioness]

Ok. Haven't had much sleep. Was blogging, and referenced to this about midnight last night, so I would need to read it again, and analyse it. Initial thoughts.
It is a bit unclear in its arguments. I believe the victims are now NOW being ignored. I think they obviously were, for a long time, and this may be too little too late, but the Police are investigating. The effect of that is obviously neutralised or even obliterated by the fact that this Predator is now dead, but at last someone is acknowledging that there is a case to answer. So I don't agree that no-one is thinking of the victims. They are, it is just very late in the day, and untold damage has been done by this.
The sheer misogny of the culture that allowed the Old Boys Network to cover this up is astonishing. Many agencies were at fault here, not just the BBC. The DPP also decided not to go ahead, as recently as 3 yrs ago I believe.

[ParsleyTheLioness]

Victims now NOT being ignored, having been ignored previously, should have read...

[VenusandJuno]

Yes I totally agree getorf
I was starting to cringe and stomach turn every time another report described the "stain on the BBC" and the fact that the BBC needs the trust of the viewers/listeners.

I mean.....the Newsnight thing is not exactly the issue here is it.....This is something so much bigger. I think it's a huge disgusting can of worms, judging by the reaction of the nation (a massive increase of calls and contact with abuse charities etc) and the reaction on sites like this. It's not just that one foul man who has been allowed to get away with it. I'm so sorry he is dead and never got to feel the rush of hatred and disgust just before he died.

By the way, getorf I saw you posting on a different thread recently and wondered if be interested in This thread here

It might not be relevant but I thought that the way JS had made you feel so upset was what caused me to start that thread. X

[VenusandJuno]

And I've just read her article. The best things I've read or heard on this thing yet. Made me feel sick. Some brilliant points.

Exactly, the disgusting leering faces of that foul person. I don't want to see him either.

I told my husband I was so bothered by the whole thing because I even felt dirtied by being allowed to watch him on TV as a young child. It was like his total of respect for girls/ boys and his really creepy nature seeped out of the TV And something in my heart and very being as a young girl wondered "why?" "Why is he meant to be nice and funny and nice to children? He is like a dirty old man" but he was allowed to seep into home in the land insidiously telling young girls that old men could molest them and talk about them as "long legs" and nothing but pretty faces and long legs.....


I am sure I knew he was wrong when I was a girl . Why the fuck did anyone think different? The culture of the 70s we're told.

Oh yes, we've changed now. That was the 70s. Now you wouldn't get away with grooming young girls and raping them and the police being well aware of what was going on but ignoring it (ignoring it especially because these girls are young and working class and vulnerable) would you? Oh wait. Rochdale....

We kid ourselves we are civilised.

[MrsjREwing]

This was available in the four JS threads, people dismissed it as tin foil hat nonsence. The necrophelia, ex pm, MB, TH, KC and more etc all on those threads.

[womblingalong]

Think she is absolutely spot on, we should be addressing why he was able to get away with this scale of abuse for so long, and how to stop it happening again, not on the BBC issues.

How do we as a nation value what women and girls say, and ensure victims are believed is crucial.

[marshmallowpies]

Absolutely right. We need to know what is being done to protect vulnerable young women and girls NOW, in the care system, in schools, wherever.

The way the girls in Rochdale were treated is very telling...compare the dismissive attitude of the police there with the Newsnight email which says the evidence is not strong enough because it's 'just the women'.

Specifically, though, the BBC and other organisations in the media need to demonstrate that children now are looked after properly when in this situation eg NOT going into dressing rooms alone, not being taken off into people's cars...that sort of thing should be belt & braces.

Same goes for the NHS although I can't imagine the circumstances now where a celebrity & non-medical professional would have the level of access that JS had to Broadmoor & Stoke Mandeville.

[GetOrfAKAMrsUsainBolt]

I agree venus - thanks btw for the link to the thread, I will have a look. This is all enormously upsetting, this news.

Yes those deleted threads - all seemed like tinhat a few weeks ago, and now look how those stories are starting to be corroborated, I agree mrsjr.

[GetOrfAKAMrsUsainBolt]

And it does sum up the way that girls and women are viewed.

Fuck the people who suffered at this man's hands, let's all get ourselves frothed up in glee at the BBC's misdemeanours. It's typical.

[hackmum]

Completely agree with everything that's been said here! The canning of the Newsnight programme is a side issue. People are using it as an excuse to bash the BBC. The fact that children and young women were being abused in, not only the BBC, but places like Stoke Mandeville, Duncroft and Broadmoor, ffs, all places where they should have felt protected, is the true scandal. Why aren't we hearing more about that?

[MrsjREwing]

I had to take a break from the subject, it was so distressing. I have accepted it now, how corrupt, how high, how many colluded and percured. Nothing I have read since those threads has shocked me now, I feel weeks ahead if the general population.

I don't understand why those threads were dismissed at the time, as the majority of links were to respected news sources, with massive hints going back years.

[MrsjREwing]

Please don't forget the boys, including the poor souls from NI.

[RinderThrillerNight]

Brilliant article. Since this broke, I have this overwhelming urge to tell people that we must listen to children, and to believe what they tell us. Sometimes, like Savile hid behind the truth, children sometimes do so too. It can be blindingly obvious when a child is suffering, yet we (as a society) choose to ignore it.

And I agree with Suzanne Moore, please media no more photos of Savile's gurning face. We know what he looks like, we do not need any reminder.

As an aside, why where the 4 Savile threads deleted? I have been offline for a few days and am only just catching up.

[MrsjREwing]

Thread 4 apparently went due to a DI forum invasion. I didn't know the previous three went.

[RinderThrillerNight]

Oh sorry, misunderstanding on my part.

[GetOrfAKAMrsUsainBolt]

Yes agree re the boys - sorry for that oversight.

And also am very relieved that the article doesn't have that fucker's hideous face all over it.

[Mrsjay]

fantastic article getorf it is what we have all been saying on here children we have all said children were abused, IT is now all about whos fault it was lets sack people, no sympathy or interest in any of the children anymore even in interviews on tv , and I am sick to the back teeth of seeing his fucking bug eyed face ,

[JakeBullet]

Fabulous article.

[Levantine]

I'm so glad you posted this. I read it this morning and it almost made me burst into tears. She is absolutely right. Brilliant article

[squeaver]

Yes, she's got it absolutely right. The victims here are NOT a Newsnight producer and reporter being a bit peeved because their report wasn't shown. The whole story is disappearing up its own arse as the BBC's rivals line up to give it a kicking and the BBC itself self-flagellates.

Where is the Panorama investigation in what happened at Stoke Mandeville? Or the girls' home? Where is the Commons Select Committee investigating how he got into a position of such authority at Broadmoor? Broadmoor, ffs!

[squeaver]

Suzanne Moore has just tweeted that she's had a letter from Jonathan King telling her how kind Saville was....