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If the European Court for Human Rights upholds this...

(16 Posts)
pointythings Mon 26-Sep-11 21:42:49

Where does it end?

Sorry, story is from the Daily Fail here.

Call me dim, but when is it ever acceptable to refuse to do a part of your job?

Don't get me wrong, I think it's ridiculous to ban people from wearing crosses/turbans/karas and although I am very uncomfortable with burkas, I think France has gone too far in banning it.

But refusing to do the job you are being paid to do? Sackable, and should remain so.

Mind you, if I were gay I wouldn't want to be counselled by someone like this...

<dons flameproof suit>

StealthPolarBear Mon 26-Sep-11 21:45:20

Oooh that's interesting
He's claiming discrimination because of his discriminatory behaviour!
But I agree - surely counsellors need to be non-judgemental

cookcleanerchaufferetc Tue 27-Sep-11 09:19:05

Absolutley ridicuolous ... our country is becoming a bloody joke. Headlines today, based on human rights as the masis, include a poor man who had to live apart from his wife and baby as (he a teacher) a pupil falsely accused him of several sexual attacks - he has since been completely exonerated, prisoners demanding sky sports, and convited terrorists remaining in our country.

We are a joke. Hats off to France for actually protecting their own people. I would rather be like that that be walked all over, kicked and robbed, like we are in England.

cory Tue 27-Sep-11 09:35:15

Sadly (well at least sad to me as a Christian), a lot of Christians do seem to expect special treatment and for their beliefs to prevail because they are Right. And they are very quick to shout discrimination if they don't get their own way. They can't see that they are in exactly the same position as a Muslim or Sikh trying to impose his beliefs on the wider community.

I think my beliefs are right, too. I just don't expect other people to see it in quite that way. And I have a choice not to take any job that would conflict with my beliefs.

cory Tue 27-Sep-11 09:37:59

It's got nothing whatsoever to do with Human Rights: it is about insisting that the rest of the nation has to share his own particular brand of Christianity and/or be prepared to act as if they did.

cookcleanerchaufferetc Tue 27-Sep-11 09:52:23

"Lobby group Christian Concern confirmed he was among tens of thousands of people writing to David Cameron, calling on him to support Mr McFarlane in his action at the European Court of Human Rights."

"And he is one of four Christians taking legal action at a landmark hearing because they believe British laws have failed to protect their human rights to wear religious symbols or opt out of gay rights legislation."

"Campaign and lobby group Stonewall was "shocked and deeply disturbed" when the Equality and Human Rights Commission announced in July its intention to intervene in Gary McFarlane's case."

"It was similarly concerning that the EHRC appeared to suggest that any public servant might have the right to pick and choose who they provide services to."

Oh yes, it is nothing to do with human rights .....

fastweb Tue 27-Sep-11 09:54:28

Can you immagine how unworkable this is in practical terms?

Organising adequate staffing for all potential rejected clients would be an impossibility due to workplaces not being willing to leave themselves open to unfair discrimination cases by trying to work out how many potential clients an interviewee could potentially refuse to serve.

And what would happen if employers did start asking "are you a christian, right ok you are, so would you still be willing to work with our gay clients" at interview ? (ditto for all other potential"I do not approve of this client, I'm downing tools" contexts.)

Round 2 of the "oh woe is me and my human rights being violated in the workplace at interview stage, turned down for my FAITH!" in a very "have cake, eat it and then make trifle out of it" fashion.

All that on top of the slight ethics issue of setting in stone the legal right to discriminate whilst going about your job.

mayorquimby Tue 27-Sep-11 10:44:47

Have there not been accomodations made for members of other religions which have been protected by the courts? Such as Muslim check-out assistants not being placed on tills which serve alcohol etc? or where they just individual companies making private decisions?

cookcleanerchaufferetc Tue 27-Sep-11 10:52:43

There was a Muslim man who worked in catering and years later decided to sue because he had to handle bacon .... he lost.

If you apply for a job you must be able to do it. Is it really necesaary to have to advertise jobs detailing every aspect? Supermarket cashier wanted, must be able to handle all types of food and drink 365 days a year, no exceptions. Or would that be discriminatory?

FFS ....

ilovemydogandMrObama Tue 27-Sep-11 10:59:31

wasn't there a case a few years ago where a doctor didn't want to refer women for abortions based on religious beliefs?

JeremyVile Tue 27-Sep-11 11:09:42

I quite like that people have the ability to ask that their little foibles are catered to. So what, really? Most people just get on and theres no problem, the odd person will feel aggrieved about something and want to use the available channels to plead their case.
That kind of works out ok, doesn't it? It's like a real life Aibu.
I never understand what is so utterly outrageous and threatening about it.

"We are a joke. Hats off to France for actually protecting their own people. I would rather be like that that be walked all over, kicked and robbed, like we are in England." Really?

JeremyVile Tue 27-Sep-11 11:13:04

Ilove - as far as I remember doctors don't have to reefer for abortions if it is against their beliefs, in that instance the woman just sees another dr who makes the referral. Fair enough IMO. I don't really get "pro-lifers" but hey ho, takes all sorts.

JeremyVile Tue 27-Sep-11 11:15:37

Oh and my "Really" was at the "kicked, robbed, walked over" stuff, not the bit about wanting to be more like France. I'd love to be more like France, my hair would be swishier for a start.

kerrymumbles Tue 27-Sep-11 11:19:24

why wouldn't he just say, i'm not qualified to give such advice and pass them onto someone else in the office who was?

i'm not qualified to give advice on gay sex - being a straight woman and all.

mayorquimby Tue 27-Sep-11 11:21:42

Yup I'd agree JeremyVine.Whenever people complain about human rights or use the term as though it's a swear word I never fail to be perplexed at how someone could actually think human rights are a bad thing.

MrsTerryPratchett Sun 02-Oct-11 16:22:59

There are doctors who not only refuse to refer for abortions but refuse to prescribe contraception on the grounds of their religion. We all still use taxes to pay them though.

However, it is interesting as mayorquimby says that this was even an issue. I would also wonder about my abilities to advise a male, gay couple on their sex life since I am working with a different set of equipment. Unless the Relate office in question didn't have an appropriate worker. 'In the business' we have all worked cross-culturally, -sexuality and -gender etc. since you can't 'match' people to their peers (even if you could, you might not get on with the person grin ). I wonder if he had said he wouldn't work with any gay couples and was sacked on this basis rather than a specific incidence.

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