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Death Penalty: Being considered bought back to the UK

(88 Posts)
Cocoflower Thu 04-Aug-11 13:06:26

www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iTqjnNzRM-TiIEv0rLTXb_zb8ITQ?docId=CNG.8f872789736d127ca37fde3925b5a5bc.51

Seems House of Commons is seriously going to be debating bringing this back.

It is minefield- who should get death penalty?

The over-arching concern for me is what if they get they kill the innocent?

Is this a budget-cut saving scheme- cutting the tax payers bill on keeping inmates?

zorgmoid Thu 04-Aug-11 13:12:32

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

Cocoflower Thu 04-Aug-11 13:19:44

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

noddyholder Thu 04-Aug-11 13:20:45

Ignore coco I agree with you this is a huge step back and very worrying sad

fastweb Thu 04-Aug-11 13:23:44

Wouldn't the UK have to leave the EU first ? Since abolition is a requirement to membership.

ShowOfHands Thu 04-Aug-11 13:26:03

I hope that even if they did end up debating it and subsequently voting on it, there's no way at all that it would ever be brought back. Please God we're a civilised society with enough people to oppose it.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Thu 04-Aug-11 13:26:34

it'll never ever happen. Just because the lowest common denominator have started a petition does not mean that it will become law, and even if they do bother to 'debate' it I very much doubt that any mp would come out in favour.

nocake Thu 04-Aug-11 13:27:10

If you actually read the article it doesn't mention anywhere that MPs are going to debate the death penalty. It simply says that any petition on the government's new e-petition website that gathers 100,000 signatures will be considered by a committee to decide if the issue should be debated. It doesn't say how many signatures the petition on the death penalty has raised.

miniwedge Thu 04-Aug-11 13:28:01

The views expressed by those MP's quoted are scary.

I think fastweb is right though, we would have to leave the EU and that's not going to happen.

Although....... is it true that we still have the death penalty for treason or is that one of those urban legends??

Memoo Thu 04-Aug-11 13:28:22

They're not actually considering bringing it back, somebody has just said that it should be debated.

Empusa Thu 04-Aug-11 13:31:12

What nocake said. It is actually about e-petitions possibly being considered if they reach over a certain number of signatures. Death penalty petition is just an example.

Honestly, even if they do decide to acknowledge e-petitions* then I can't see the death penalty returning.

*Bearing in mind how easily abused the e-petitions can be, I imagine there'll be a lot of opposition to that.

mousymouse Thu 04-Aug-11 13:35:03

should never happen, it is also a condition of beeing in the European Union (which is of huuuuge benefit to the UK, even if not everyone agrees).

adamschic Thu 04-Aug-11 13:35:22

Thie argument for debating it is that MP's voting against it as they did last time might not represent the general publics' wishes. It might not represent people opinions who vote on the websites but that isn't representative of the general public (and since when did MP's do as the majority wants anyway).

Fortunately the death penalty will never be brought back.

ShowOfHands Thu 04-Aug-11 13:36:19

miniwedge, no you can't be put to death for treason. It doesn't matter which individual laws were turned over or rewritten, the death penalty was abolished for all crimes. It's one of the protocols for the European Convention of Human Rights and covers every crime you can think of. I think in 1998 they amended the law so that treason officially equals life imprisonment too.

Empusa Thu 04-Aug-11 13:36:42

adams I agree. After the debacle that was the DEA, I'd like to see MP's have to acknowledge public opinion. I can see them fighting against it though.

Cocoflower Thu 04-Aug-11 13:38:25

Apologies I meant to say might be debating it dependent on what happens next (excuse me very pregnant and got about 1 hours sleep!)

However the fact its on the agenda at all was a little surprising to say the least.

sparks Thu 04-Aug-11 13:40:20

Other examples of e-petitions given in the BBC article are leaving the EU, withdrawing from the European Convention on Human Rights or limiting jail food to bread and water. How likely are those to reach the Commons?

strandednomore Thu 04-Aug-11 13:40:22

Funnily enough one of the other petitions (which needs 100,000 signatures to even be considered for debate) is for the UK to leave the EU...perhaps they should be debated together!
However, as others have said, I doubt this will get very far (although it might be a good idea to debate it to air the reasons why we shouldn't have the death penalty for those who don't know the arguements).
Another of the petitions is for Jeremy Clarkson to be PM...

VelvetSnow Thu 04-Aug-11 13:41:24

Bring it back I say!

Off with their heads!

EggyAllenPoe Thu 04-Aug-11 13:42:49

brought there by the e-petition campaign. to my mind this just shows that MPs are as a bunch, more liberal than the people they represent (generally speaking)
public support for the death penalty existing stands at 64% in favour - yet it wouldn't get that majority in a vote...

it callst mind the comment that we have 'an elective oligarchy, not a democracy'. fortunately.

Empusa Thu 04-Aug-11 13:46:37

"Another of the petitions is for Jeremy Clarkson to be PM..."

Ahahaha!!!

EldritchCleavage Thu 04-Aug-11 13:46:38

Perhaps it ought to be debated, at least. I'm firmly anti, but I am uncomfortable with saying anything like this is now outside debate and need no longer be discussed.

I don't think it would pass the House of Commons even if it were not the case we'd have to completely change our relationship to Europe. Most MPs are apparently against it. As they are representatives, not delegates, they are not obliged to vote in accordance with constituents' wishes (whether they should is another whole topic). Opinion polls apparently suggest mopst people in the UK are pro-death penalty, though the number of pros falls significantly when the safeguards needed to ensure guilt are put to them.

I wonder if the pro-hanging camp would be prepared to vote for lavish legal aid and forensic services and automatic appeals so we could be as sure as possible we'd bumped off the guilty, not the innocent? The US experience is a salutary one. It seems even very traditionally pro-death penalty states are finding approval rates falling as various initiatives (like the Innocence Project) expose the large number of unsafe capital convictions.

Cocoflower Thu 04-Aug-11 13:50:51

The idea of e-pettions having enough to status to be seriously considered in parliment is interesting though.

Wether the goverment actually listens is another matter. As a poster pointed out on the BBC website would their also be petitions for counter-opinion on say the Death penalty issue though? If so, wouldn't this just end up in stale-mate?

Whitershadeofpale Thu 04-Aug-11 13:51:36

miniwedge That was the case but it was the first act repealed by Tony Blair's government.

EldritchCleavage Thu 04-Aug-11 13:54:15

It is a gimmick, but a dangerous one. When the Coalition first tried it, the top suggestion on the Deputy PM's website was one calling for the repeal of the second law of thermodynamics. They had to take it off the website, to widespread hilarity.
I can imagine one or two examples that might be less funny than sinister, though.

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