Andy Hayman : Christ of a bike - is this what passes for a senior police officer?

[Pagwatch]

Watching him in front of the select committee.
He is a shambling, dodgy guy with the persona of a slighty stupid Arthur Daley. I wouldn't believe him if he told me the time.

Really? We promote blokes like this?

[Pagwatch]

....so indignant I can't proof read... Christ on a bike....

[Callisto]

I agree, I've just heard exerpts on R4 of some of the grilling they gave him. He does not seem terribly bright does he, how the hell did he get to this level in the first place?

In fact he is either veery stupid or in it up to his neck. Either way he isn't exactly senior police officer material.

[Pagwatch]

He was talking about meeting up with news intl chums and knowing that they were under investigation and said 'well it's a classic I know something you don't know situation' - as if it was a joke.
He couldn't remember almost anything. And always wanted to be a journalist which is why he stepped down as asst commissioner of the met and straight into a job for news intl.

How cosy.

But he just sounds so stupid. Is it an act or can a stupid person be asst commissioner?

I have rarely been so shocked tbh

[TheCrackFox]

How did he even pass the entrance exam to become a police officer?

[Callisto]

I think he is this stupid. If corruption at the Met is as bad as it is starting to look it would be very convenient for NI and Murdoch to have a 'tame' police officer there. Murdochs influence seems to be so far-reaching that he could probably put pressure on for Haymans appointment. It is like something out of a James Bond film atm. Quite unbelievable and terrifying at the same time.

[chipstick10]

The bacon seem to take anyone these days.

[Pagwatch]

It's not me is it? It is really shocking isn't it?

[Pagwatch]

I enjoyed the guy asking a question along the lines of
' well we note that you are squeaky keen but supposing there was a policeman who was in your role and cosied up to an organization he is supposed to be investigating, and then accepted hospitality and eventually a job from them whilst over seeing a shambolic investigation which was so useless that we find ourselves here today - how could we tell the difference between him and you?'

[rainbowtoenails]

I saw him and thought the same thing. So much for living in a meritocratic society!

[niceguy2]

That's what happens though when you politicise the police force.

We'd like to think our coppers are all like DI Burnside but in reality those sort of coppers would have been fired for not completing their 250 page ethnic diversity and equal opportunities checklist.

So it's still a meritocracy but just not in a system most of us want. The likes of Mr Hayman get to where they are not because they are top thief takers but because they are good at politics and networking.

That's what we get though for inundating good coppers with layer upon layers of bureaucracy. The only ones who can excel are the bureaucrats.

[Pagwatch]

But soooo stupid. So shocking.

I am sure there are ways to explain how the system had created the situation where ability is not the main criteria for promotion.

But so thick. So inarticulate. So bumbling and foolish. So lacking in basic presentation skills. Awful.

[niceguy2]

The clip from BBC here says it all BBC News

No attempt to defend the fact he was too close to News International or refute any allegations other than he didn't get a bonus for this investigation which came across like he was merely deflecting. His body language showed he didn't believe what he was saying and he just came across as just another face saving self serving politician.

[slhilly]

niceguy2, What are you on about?? You've complained that the police force has been:

• overly politicised (ie the instrument of government policy)
  
• become too politically correct (though how this helps a middle-aged white man like Andy Hayman is beyond me)
  
• become too bureaucratic (ie too much paperwork)
  
• become too reliant on politics and networking
  

These are not all the same thing! Your logic is jumping all over the place. And you've not provided any evidence for any of it, either.

[niceguy2]

And this clip....BBC News Clip

I think the question which should have been asked is "Since you cannot remember such a basic fact such as how many officers were on the investigation, how can we be sure you've not forgotten if you've taken money from News International?"

[slhilly]

For the avoidance of doubt: I think Andy Hayman's a useless piece of work, as well. But I'm not convinced that it's incompetence, rather than malice, and I don't think the cause of his rise was the things niceguy2 says.

[niceguy2]

Slhilly

My point is that I believe (and you can either agree or disagree) that the police force has become too politically correct. They want to be known as the police service rather than force. They spend more time filling in forms than on the streets catching bad guys.

In that context we end up with top policemen who are not there because they are the best at catching criminals but because they have slimed their way to the top. Hence my assertion that that is why the likes of Mr Hayman come across more like a politician than a copper.

[slhilly]

niceguy2, I know that's what you believe. I disagree, because I think the logic doesn't follow.

You would have to believe that the majority of additional paperwork that the police complete now compared to your preferred period is due to political correctness, and not, say, providing useful operational intelligence about crime patterns or a secure chain of custody for evidence etc.

You'd then have to believe that a culture of filling in forms supports people who slime their way to the top rather than people who catch bad guys. Seems like a total non-sequitur to me.

[AwesomePan]

I don't think he came across as a politicain OR a policeman. He came across as a very naughty boy. Who didn't really care less about what he said.

who advised him to start off with the revalation he really wanted to be a journalist?

loved Keith Vaz's comment "more Clouseau than Columbo"!

[AwesomePan]

I think niceguy you are mixing up 'pc' for 'accountability'.

[AwesomePan]

or Andy Hayman and Paul McMullen possibly related??

[ashamedandconfused]

he comes across as a bit thick and a bit of a lad

would never have had him down as a senior copper

(based purely on that 1st clip above)

[Pagwatch]

Clouseau rather than Colombo was very funny.

I watched all his evidence live. The atmosphere in the room was one of incredulity. I think the select committee members kept lapsing into finding it funny then would remember the subject under scrutiny and get angry again.

Contemplate that this guy has terrorist related responsibilities....and then weep...

[noddyholder]

I was shocked at how stupid he is.Seriously when you couple it with everything going on it makes you very scared about the UK in so many areas.

[Purpleswimmingtiger]

He is just another puppet, no doubt put in place by his brothers at the lodge.
Filth that think are a threat to the PTB.

[chipstick10]

I too was shocked at the pomposity of Keith Vaz