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Is the GIFED & TALENTED system in schools a good thing or not??????

(60 Posts)
drosophila Sun 15-Jul-07 19:32:43

DS's school is about to introduce it next year. I got to wondering is it a good thing to label kids so young? DS has been earmarked to be on it but I am not sure what it means. What I did like the sound of was that his hatred of writing will be addressed in a positive way and alternative ways of getting him to express himself will be explored. DS will love that cos he sure hates writing.

Twinklemegan Sun 15-Jul-07 23:08:47

I think it's a bad idea. All kids should be stretched regardless of whether they have a label.

KerryMumbledore Sun 15-Jul-07 23:10:10

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

brimfull Sun 15-Jul-07 23:25:47

dd is in yr 10,they satrted it in her school this yr,can't see any difference at all .It's a great school already thankfully but unsure what the g&t was maeant to do.All it seemed to entail was a free membership to NAGTY.

portonovo Mon 16-Jul-07 15:44:55

Our school has had a G&T register for years but not explicitly told children. They would just make sure children were challenged in the right ways (as they try to do for all children). The only clues would be your children getting offered G&T courses in various subjects.

Now they have to actually tell parents and children, but like ggirl says, it doesn't seem to make much difference, the only difference I can see is being offered NAGTY membership.

TheCodDelusion Mon 16-Jul-07 15:45:49


katelyle Sat 21-Jul-07 08:00:49

But I really don't get this G and T thing. Surely the idea is that schools should provide appropriate challenge for all children - for example in my ds's year 1 class there are some still on the reading books with three words a page and some on Harry Potter - why would it be better for the Harry Potter readers to be on a "register'? I can understand that if a child is particularly gifted at some non academic thing - like music or sport-then they may need extra coaching, but I just can't see who benefits from labelling academically bright children in this way. Am I missing something?

portonovo Sat 21-Jul-07 08:43:49

The only benefit is that children on the register get offered courses specifically aimed at 'gifted and talented' children. So they might get offered a day or residential course in maths, philosophy, creative writing, science or whatever. Our county and the neighbouring one both hold lots of these courses at their county education centres.

But generally, I agree that schools should be catering for and stretching all children, and that seems to what has happened at my children's schools. I think the idea of the register is to get those schools who perhaps let the more able ones 'coast' to buck their ideas up a bit. That's one of the many disadvantages of league tables - some schools may be tempted to get as many as children as possible to the minimum level required for a particular age group, and not necessarily stretching them further. Our secondary school is vehemently against this - they say it is no good them just getting a huge percentage of children to C at GCSE level if actually many of those children should be getting Bs and As. So what they do is loads of tracking and target-setting right from Year 7, so they can pick up fairly quickly when any child seems to be slipping or failing to make the anticipated progress, and indeed where a child is making faster-than-expected progress.

PotterCandles Sat 21-Jul-07 08:55:56

You might as well ask whehter it's a good idea for SN children to be on a 'register' at school.

Of course all children should be stretched at school, but if being on a register helps to identify a child with a particular educational need, and therefore meet that need, then surely that's a good thing?

Being G&T is a special need as well. My brother and my dh were both nearly labeled by their primary schools as having behavioural issues and being educationally backward. It was only because the parents disagreed and got independent assessments that the schools changed their opinions. But even so they wouldn't treat the boys any differently, and so they suffered. Their special educational needs had to be met by the parents, without much support from the schools.

MaloryTowers Sat 21-Jul-07 08:58:48

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PotterCandles Sat 21-Jul-07 09:03:45

It's a definition: gifted means academic, talented means sport/music/art etc

PotterCandles Sat 21-Jul-07 09:03:45

It's a definition: gifted means academic, talented means sport/music/art etc

meandmyflyingmachine Sat 21-Jul-07 09:11:33

God yes. The expression 'gifted and talented' - sounds greedy...

wheresthehamster Sat 21-Jul-07 13:22:08

As has been pointed out many times - being on the register indicates a child is in the top percentage (10%?) in their school, it is not a universal benchmark.

katelyle Sat 21-Jul-07 22:35:19

How do they calculate the top 10%? My ds is in a year group of 62 - does that mean there HAVE to be 4 on the G and T register? What if a child is a brilliant reader and can't count? Does a child who is a less good reader but is also a good adder -upper goes on the register instead of the better reader? That is a rhetorical question, of course, but you see what I mean when I say I don't "get" the G and t thing. And what if the talent is for an out of school thing - does that count?

portonovo Sun 22-Jul-07 10:35:31

The 10% is obviously different for each school, the idea being I think that by pushing the top 10% you raise the level and the sense of expectation for the whole school. So yes, the top 10% in a very selective school would be widely different to that in a more socially-mixed, non-selective school.

However, things like NAGTY membership work on absolutes - they are aimed at the top 5% generally, not in a particular school, and use things like CAT scores and other benchmarks. So schools will offer some pupils application forms for membership, and will then put in the supporting data.

Bafreem Mon 23-Jul-07 21:10:01

Having a little know-how of the education system, I can say that the 'hat' of being a gifted & talented coordinator in a stae school, rests on those teachers that feel they can fill the position. This can be those who simply want to make their finacial ends meet.
I feel little is being done for this country's top 10%, unless the govenment relents on it's theory of continualy thowing buckets of money supporting the thicko's or those parents who can't be bothered, will never be bothered, & whose kids will always have a problem with authority. I see my G&T children as having special educational needs.
I would like the choice of off setting some of my tax bill against opting for private education - an option we can little afford,but have had to in light of our daughters+s IQ

Enid Mon 23-Jul-07 21:12:14

apprently dd1s school does not have it

(not that dd1 would be asked to join but her mate is good reader and mum is always bleating on about how bored she is getting with school library books, so I asked about a g and t shceme and apparently they dont have one)

Enid Mon 23-Jul-07 21:12:43

yes it is vile definition

Judy1234 Mon 23-Jul-07 21:25:31

They used to get assisted places at the best private schools in the land until Labour abolished that which is a pity. Top 10% equals 100% of children in the best academic private and presumably state grammar schools.

It does no harm. They need to be stretched otherwise it's a waste.

Enid Mon 23-Jul-07 21:28:21

they dont need to be stretched academically at 7 though


Elasticwoman Mon 23-Jul-07 21:39:45

Why not at 7 Enid? When do they need to be stretched, if at all?

coddy Mon 23-Jul-07 21:41:45

after a bath

Enid Mon 23-Jul-07 21:49:14

oh god dont get me involved

can they swim brilliantly?
can they draw amazingly?

if the answers to the above are yes then get back to me

if they cant, then they should work on that nstead of obsessing about reading more and more challenging books/splitting the atom

Elasticwoman Mon 23-Jul-07 21:56:33

But G & T includes being talented at sport or expressive arts. That's the Talented. Gifted is the academic side.

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