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Good Night Rebel Girls - transgender included

(38 Posts)
Appraiser Sat 26-Aug-17 18:09:49

I brought this book for dd last month for her birthday. She's only just started looking through it (only 6 and it is probably a bit too old for her but she liked me reading some of them to her).

The idea of the book is that it tells the story of successful females from all over the world: Cleopatra, Amna Al Haddad, Jane Austen, Helen Keller and so on.

This morning DD came across a story of a transgender named Coy Mathis. Her response was "mummy, why is there a boy in this book, that's a bit weird".

All I said was that some boys feel like they're in the wrong body, and so present as girls. Her response was but if he wanted long hair, he could just have long hair, X at church has long hair and he's a man hmm

I'm a bit perplexed by that story being in a book about successful women and their achievements.

Anyone read the book?

Appraiser Sat 26-Aug-17 18:10:59

Here's a screen shot of the page

Showandtell Sat 26-Aug-17 18:11:05

No, but that would irritate me.

SayNoToCarrots Sat 26-Aug-17 18:20:42

I think I've seen that book on Amazon, and lots of the reviews complain about the "Coy liked pink, so he was a girl".

Appraiser Sat 26-Aug-17 18:23:11

Irritated is a good word showandtell, that's sums up how it made me feel.

I hadn't heard of Coy but a quick google shows that he was the first 6 year old to win the right to use girls toilets at school

Showandtell Sat 26-Aug-17 18:24:47

I won't buy that now. Not for the trans boy but the Coy liked pink bullshit.

glenthebattleostrich Sat 26-Aug-17 18:26:01

And that's why I didn't buy this book for DD.

Showandtell Sat 26-Aug-17 18:27:37

I think that would give dd nightmares. If you are not ok with being a girl you are transgender. confused

RhinestoneCowgirl Sat 26-Aug-17 18:28:46

Yes, I've crossed it of my list for DD too. Ordered 50 women in science instead.

RhinestoneCowgirl Sat 26-Aug-17 18:29:53

And DD is 8 and currently hating pink. And she has short hair. Maybe she's not a girl after all hmm

Appraiser Sat 26-Aug-17 18:29:54

It's such a shame because the book is actually really good.

Dd discarded it on her birthday for all the Disney princess dolls grandparents had brought her but she's picked it up on her own today and brought it to me to read a couple of pages. It still tells the story "once upon a time..." and then the background to each female. It's brilliant really but this one has irritated me! Especially as I've been very mindful of bringing up DD in a world that distinguish between pink / blue and girl/boy.

TipBoov Sat 26-Aug-17 18:30:36

Glad I've seen this - I was planning on buying a copy for DD as a keepsake for we first birthday. I will look for something else!

Appraiser Sat 26-Aug-17 18:32:47

Thanks for replying. I thought I was going off on one and being sensitive to it when I mentioned to DH.

If anything, it's sparked some interesting discussion with Dd and I'm impressed with her maturity and understanding towards Coy.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Sat 26-Aug-17 18:32:57

It's actually a really good book (apart from that, and the fact it has Maggie Thatcher in). The transgender boy story is a good way to bring it up and discuss it I think - but yes, I don't think it should be in there.

MargaretCabbage Sat 26-Aug-17 18:33:06

I was going to buy this for my children but I won't bother now, what a shame.

Appraiser Sat 26-Aug-17 18:36:13

@ItsAllGoingToBeFine 😂 to Margret Thatcher. Not got to her yet but saw she's in there. Ultimately, she was the first female
Prime Minister so understand her being included.

I might secretly remove that page or accidentally spill coffee on it

Ollycat Sat 26-Aug-17 18:36:51

Sorry to hijack the thread - I'm looking for something for my 12 year old dd (about to be Year 8) - would tge 50 Women in Science be too young for her? Is there anything else anyone could suggest? (She is a voracious reader and quite clued up an involved in feminist issues at school).

Playmobilpeacock Sat 26-Aug-17 18:38:10

It's a really good book and DD and I have loved reading it together.

Don't let this put you off. Rip out the page. I actually printed out another story and stuck it on top.

I'm not entering into this debate with my 5 year old.

Babieseverywhere Sat 26-Aug-17 18:38:52

Why didn't they include a story about a trans identifying female instead ? Then they would be keeping the book all about women.

Coy should be in the male version as he was born a boy (as the book says)

AgentCooper Sat 26-Aug-17 18:43:08

So fucking regressive!! Why can't people see that stuff like this effectively tells wee girls that if they don't like pink, have short hair, hate dresses etc then they're not actually girls? Can they not see how alienating and isolating that could be for young girls, this suggestion that their gender is somehow wrong when they've been quite happily inhabiting it?

I hate to think of trans people being made to feel uncomfortable or persecuted but women and girls are repeatedly at the bottom of the pecking order in this debate.

RhinestoneCowgirl Sat 26-Aug-17 18:44:40

@Ollycat this is the one I've ordered:

It's illustrated so a yr 8 may think it's a bit young.

Ollycat Sat 26-Aug-17 19:01:51

Thanks Rhinestone I was looking at that - it might be quite nice for her to flick through at bed time ..

glenthebattleostrich Sat 26-Aug-17 22:28:27

We have this one, the women in science and great women of the world.

VestalVirgin Sat 09-Sep-17 14:04:44

Why didn't they include a story about a trans identifying female instead ? Then they would be keeping the book all about women.

A girl who identifies as boy is not a rebel, she's submitting to patriarchal values, so would disqualify because of that. (Though of course that's also somewhat true for Thatcher.)

A butch lesbian who has short hair and wears trousers and is proud to be female - that would be rebellion.

A female detransitioner would perhaps be a good addition, though.

genderresearcher Mon 02-Oct-17 19:36:26

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rosareine Tue 03-Oct-17 12:51:48

I bought this for my seven year old... wouldn't have bought it if I'd realised

Copperkettles Sat 23-Dec-17 21:12:45

This is horrendous. It's so regressive.

Humpsfor20yards Mon 25-Dec-17 20:56:51

Just reading this now, dd got it for Xmas- it's a wonderful book but...


Coy didn't like wearing boys clothes?
To celebrate using the girls bathroom coy wore a sparkly pink dress and beautiful pink shoes?

Such a surprise to see such stereotypes in a book like this.

IamNotDarling Thu 28-Dec-17 21:18:08

I’ve just read it with my 6 year old tonight. She was incredulous. “But that’s a boy! Boys can like pink. Why did his mummy take him to a doctor?”

If my six year old gets it, why is it so fucking hard for others to see through this fiction?!

Humpsfor20yards Thu 28-Dec-17 21:23:44

It really took me by surprise. You've got women who've overcome massive obstacles to achieve and then you've got a page where a boy likes pink and sparkly things and is this a girl.

It's quite...bizarre.

I hear there are calls to remove ang San Sui chi from the book.

IamNotDarling Fri 29-Dec-17 00:04:29

Her inclusion shocked me too!

KarlosKKrinkelbeim Fri 29-Dec-17 00:08:55

I bought this for dd and was very disappointed to find this story included. Dd has not yet remarked on it; I may rip out the page. She had lately entered a pink hating phase and the last thing she needs is to read that liking pink is a part of being a girl.

bigmouthstrikesagain Fri 29-Dec-17 00:16:34

I think most children actually are sophisticated enough to challenge assumptions. Dd age 9 has the book, she loves it, we read the page about Coy, she liked reading about her but challenged the idea that liking pink made her a girl. I agreed, we moved on. No big deal imo and a big overreaction to boycott the book. Dd was inspired to do a project on Nina Simone and we learned about women from history who did important and interesting things. It anything it was the inclusion of Mrs T that put me off!

ThinkAboutItTomorrow Sun 31-Dec-17 21:18:20

I wondered if there was a thread on this. Bought for my DD and she loves it but I'm refusing to read Coy's story. The rest of the book is so great, reinforcing brilliant messages about fairness, equality and the power of women to overcome in a man's world. Then this load of bilge about a boy who liked pink and dolls and so therefore was a girl. Ffs.

Callmekaren123 Fri 15-Nov-19 09:55:10

Trans women,are women.
Thats it.
Its nor rocket science..thlconfused

Callmekaren123 Fri 15-Nov-19 09:55:37

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theflushedzebra Sat 16-Nov-19 20:50:57

DH worked with a South African who was part of the team that sent the first SA satellite into space. Want to know what he said to DH? "Rocket science isn't rocket science, you know." grin

TWAW is certainly nothing like rocket science. Nothing like rocket science at all. Rocket science has to make scientific sense.

theflushedzebra Sat 16-Nov-19 20:58:53

Re: the Rebel book for girls - my DSis bought it for my DD a couple of years ago - I sincerely love the book, but did do a cats bum face on the Coy Mathis page - and even considered gluing the pages together, because a young male deciding he identifies as a girl is no role model for my daughter.

In the end I used it as an educational introduction to the trans issues she will grow up dealing with... and to talk to her about the tragedy of gender stereotypes.... so it's all good really.

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