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Why do rich people want no deal/ to leave the EU

(70 Posts)
Jimjamjooney Fri 09-Aug-19 17:35:44

I'm not looking to start an argument. I didn't vote in the referendum as I was unsure of which option was for the best and struggle to get my head around everything tbh.

I am aware of the stereotypical reasons some people voted leave (immigration etc.) but I also know lots of well off people who want to leave/ remainers that have changed their minds.

Why do some wealthier people actively want Brexit?

Sarahlou63 Mon 19-Aug-19 15:27:18

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_newspapers_in_the_United_Kingdom

Check out who owns the main UK media outlets. Then look at how the anti tax avoidance legislation will affect those owners.

Helmetbymidnight Sat 17-Aug-19 14:17:56

good, as i said, try reading more about cambridge analytica or Aaron banks, farage, cummings, or JRM or disaster capitalism etc etc.

MeganBacon Sat 17-Aug-19 14:09:05

Well thanks for relieving me of my political naivety. I look forward to further enlightenment through your highly articulate posts.

Helmetbymidnight Sat 17-Aug-19 13:51:16

i dont think its articulate- i just think that apart from when you are stating the bloody obvious 'poorer people worry more about the day to day' you are talking nonsense.

MeganBacon Sat 17-Aug-19 13:47:54

*the point you are trying to make here is unclear"
says the person who thinks "riiiight" and "yeah...." is articulate

Helmetbymidnight Sat 17-Aug-19 13:24:42

poorer people DO obviously worry more about the day to day than the long term- other than that the point you are trying to make here is unclear -
your post of 10.41 was just nonsense.

MeganBacon Sat 17-Aug-19 12:03:06

There are distinct groups of voters - yes at the bottom end many uneducated people probably swayed the vote because they listened to the rhetoric. This doesn't mean there wasn't more nuanced debate at the higher end of education.
In any case, in your anger you have hijacked the point I was making which is that poor people worry more about the day to day than better off people who can afford the luxury of thinking longer term, etc. A point which I am happy to repeat having lived both situations.

Helmetbymidnight Sat 17-Aug-19 11:48:53

yeah, i really dont know what you mean. wealth and education are certainly not interchangeable - and the stats show that wealth was not a key indicator in how people voted. education was. the higher the education the less likely to vote brexit...

MeganBacon Sat 17-Aug-19 11:12:52

I was including wealthy people like doctors and successful business people in that group Helmet. Anyone well-off, people with successful careers and high incomes. Perhaps "wealthy" was not the right word because it implies inherited wealth.

Helmetbymidnight Sat 17-Aug-19 11:02:39

people from hugely privileged backgrounds like jrm, boris, gove, farage, lawson have wider horizons and longer timescales than educated or working people like doctors, scientists, business people, trade unionists academics, civil servants etc?

riiiight.

Helmetbymidnight Sat 17-Aug-19 10:50:40

they dont see it as wrecking the economy - they see it as a better way to run the economy.

and yes, arran banks and other wealthy donors have far far more power than 'one vote' - look into Cambridge analytica.

one thing these debates constantly throw up is naivety. people really need to study politics more or at least open their eyes.

MeganBacon Sat 17-Aug-19 10:41:56

I really do not believe that disaster capitalists are out there in any significant number trying to wreck the economy just so they can benefit. If there are one or two of them, they may have the power to do serious damage, but they are still only a few individuals with one vote each, so they were not key to the result.
I do believe the Russians and the US have an interest in seeing the EU weaker so may have been involved behind the scenes - not sure but willing to be convinced.
I think generally wealthy people are just unfettered by the daily stress of making ends meet or keeping the same job, so can afford to think in broader principles with wider horizons and longer timescales.

Fraggling Wed 14-Aug-19 12:28:56

Great thread

I think this

'The new EU tax avoidance regulations plus disaster capitalism plus deregulation of industry.'

jasjas1973 Wed 14-Aug-19 12:14:14

The only people who can genuinely say that are people with money.

Any leaver who needs to work to pay bills, rent or mortgage will not be quite so keen on brexit if they lose their job as a result of this stupidity.

Oranginna Wed 14-Aug-19 12:05:36

No it's not always about the money.

Sarahlou63 Wed 14-Aug-19 09:51:31

ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/business/company-tax/anti-tax-avoidance-package/anti-tax-avoidance-directive_en

It's always about the money.

Helmetbymidnight Wed 14-Aug-19 09:44:11

I do appreciate baby boomers were more likely to vote for Brexit but some of us didn’t and appreciated what the EU could do

yes, when i was on the remain march earlier this year, i was deeply moved by seeing so many older and elderly and disabled people there- the efforts they had made to join was fantastic- testament to their passion.

BubblesBuddy Tue 13-Aug-19 18:03:26

I do appreciate baby boomers were more likely to vote for Brexit but some of us didn’t and appreciated what the EU could do.

Why do we now think we are a superior nation and want to pull up the drawbridge? What’s wrong with working with others? We mostly make our own laws, rule in our own court cases (and win the vast majority that go to the EU courts) and have a sovereign parliament. We are now going to be alone and truly “Little” Britain. Being on the outside looking in is never great and I remember it in the 1960s. We were desperate to join the EU. We wanted to bring our views to the table and be listened to. Our industry was poor back then and we have improved so much by collaborating with others. Yes, there are things we don’t like but that was never a good enough reason to Leave. Too many people were persuaded by simple rhetoric and slogans. It’s shameful how shallow we are.

Helmetbymidnight Tue 13-Aug-19 08:59:18

i know lots of comfortably off brexiteers, not that many well educated ones.

some no dealbrexit type fella is on twitter this morning: @StanleyisWhite (yup) causing great hilarity with his thick 'fuck academics and scientists, they didnt help us win the war etc.

Helmetbymidnight Tue 13-Aug-19 08:53:40

nigel lawson lives in france, farages kids have eu passports <shrug> no one ever said wealthy brexiteering elites werent hypocrites.

jasjas1973 Tue 13-Aug-19 08:49:22

Oranginna

If they are well off and well educated, how on earth don't they understand how the EU commission president is elected? its not rocket science! or believe the rubbish that the EU was responsible for car emissions scandal.

Sounds like they are rich but dim.

Dieselgate was covered up by the car companies themselves, not the EU, rules set in Brussels were supposed to be enforced by national bodies, who colluded with the manufactures/governments... it was the EU that has changed the rules so this shouldn't happen again....but even then, the member states have managed to water down some of the EP proposals sad

Yet another reason why the wealthy don't want the EU, they often shine a light on poor practice, the most recent, tax evasion.

Mistigri Tue 13-Aug-19 08:31:18

The error being made is thinking that all rich people have the same motives and interests.

Age, financial interests, business interests and ideological leaning also matter.

ChardonnaysPrettySister Tue 13-Aug-19 08:21:01

Avoiding the EU's crackdown on tax avoidance? Just a thought. Is there a Venn diagram of people mentioned in the Panama Papers and prominent wealthy leavers?

Lots of wealthy people have relocated to Portugal, which is part of the EU, so can’t be that.

berlinbabylon Tue 13-Aug-19 08:18:00

people are too fat etc etc

well they're right, but Brexit is a bit extreme a measure for dealing with that. Investing in cycling and public transport, disincentivise car use, and stopping sales promotions on junk food might help more.

it means a massive loss of control

Yes, EU laws that we influence are terrible, WTO rules that we largely don't, are great.

People are very strange.

Helmetbymidnight Tue 13-Aug-19 07:09:58

its extraordinary logic when you think about it- i dont like this system so im going to clamour for a system much worse and with much less control, which will bleed my country dry and threaten gfa etc- but hey. at least its not the EU.

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