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Solely UK citizens post Brexit ...

(147 Posts)
LurkingHusband Mon 17-Oct-16 16:10:16

Is it possible that post-Brexit, people who only hold UK citizenship could be at a disadvantage when compared to people who hold UK and a.n.other EU citizenship ?

I'm vaguely considering a post-Brexit where visas or work permits are required for UK citizens to work in the EU, meaning employers (in particular US or Asian) would prefer a dual-national over a pure UK one.

Looking forward to a robust discussion grin

Chatting with some colleagues, they all felt it would be a situation which simply cannot develop. But at the same time, they also conceded it may be out of the UK control. (Which rather sours the whole "taking back control" mantra).

Peregrina Mon 17-Oct-16 16:15:28

For people who have absolutely no desire to work outside the UK, it won't make any difference.

Otherwise, I can't see how any EU employer would not prefer to employ someone that doesn't need the hassle of extra paperwork.

Motheroffourdragons Mon 17-Oct-16 16:19:06

We are currently in Brussels due to my husband's job. The only people on such contracts working for his company are other EU nationals who moved here because of the ease of it.
It will probably be the case that these types of contracts won't be offered to UK citizens in future if there is more red tape to get through.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Mon 17-Oct-16 16:23:45

Of course they would. It's be the international version of "driving licence required", why would anyone in Eu employ someone outside the EU unless they really had to.

prettybird Mon 17-Oct-16 16:35:51

I've ready looked into whether my German, Danish or Irish heritage could get me an EU passport: unfortunately they are all at least one generation too far removed sad

The other passport I could claim would involve even more visas when I travel than even a post-Brexit UK hmm

I still have one avenue of hope.....wink

Izlet Mon 17-Oct-16 16:36:20

It's already happening, people with UK only nationality are not being asked back for second interviews, and in one company I know of they don't even make it to the first.

His is for middle management positions in multinational companies in continental EU areas. For the top execs the situation is different but for anyone lower down a citizenship filter appears to have been applied.

allegretto Mon 17-Oct-16 16:38:59

I agree that it's already happening. I know British people who have already been left out of EU projects because it is unclear whether after Brexit what sort of bureaucratic hurdles they will face. I am applying for Italian citizenship because I don't want to be in this situation.

LurkingHusband Mon 17-Oct-16 16:46:51

So, post Brexit, we could be faced with the situation where some UK citizens - who hold an EU citizenship - might actually be employed over someone who doesn't ?

I wonder how that would go down, if it happened ?

TheElementsSong Mon 17-Oct-16 19:15:16

I assume most Leave voters won't give a shit?

scaryteacher Tue 18-Oct-16 14:16:10

We are currently in Brussels due to my husband's job, as are we, and his employer employs people from inside and outside the EU and that won't be changing post Brexit.

Mistigri Tue 18-Oct-16 20:35:59

This is certainly an interesting question. My employer rotates people in the senior management scheme round different EU plants - two European languages is an advantage for graduate applicants and pretty much essential for some management roles. We have a lot of EU employees because bilingual British chemistry grads don't grow on trees.

I'm not sure what will happen if it becomes much less easy to move people round the European sites for experience. Of course it's possible to get visas and work permits etc but it would be a hassle for shorter term postings.

ARumWithAView Thu 03-Nov-16 12:43:55

So, post Brexit, we could be faced with the situation where some UK citizens - who hold an EU citizenship - might actually be employed over someone who doesn't ?

Yes, absolutely. And, as you said, it's not just about EU companies operating in EU territories; many international companies see a clear value in recruiting staff who can operate in several territories without additional cost or legal complexity.

Anyone who's lived in a country which requires a visa or additional permissions for them to work can see how disruptive the loss of EU working rights is going to be for UK citizens -- just how many extra hurdles, time constraints and costs it throws up for the employer, and how it raises the bar for UK employees and applicants. Are you a good candidate? Yes. But are you good enough that I'll go to all this extra time and expense, when there are numerous other candidates with full working rights and similar skillsets? Well...

You'd hope, if/when it comes down to UK citizens needing a visa to live or work in the EU, there'd be some watered down, fast-track process... but that seems pretty optimistic in the current climate. For all we know, it could end up with the equivalent of America's H visa tier: thousands of dollars' cost to the employer, highly detailed requirements, a long inflexible timescale of application, and no real guarantee you'll actually get the visa at the end (most years it's oversubscribed and goes into a lottery system). You have to be pretty high level or possess unique skills to make that worth anyone's while.

If UK citizens also end up with no 'young person's working holiday visa' or equivalent (in Europe), then Brexit will have managed to curtail the international employment opportunities at almost every level of UK society -- except the rich, the highly accomplished and the upper levels of management. So that's awesome.

HyacinthFuckit Thu 03-Nov-16 18:35:00

Yes, very much so. I am potentially entitled to citizenship from another EU country which I haven't bothered applying for previously and won't if we remain in the EEA and/or keep free movement. But if we hard Brexited, I would most definitely acquire it. I'd advise anyone who might be entitled to another citizenship to take it sooner rather than later.

jaws5 Thu 03-Nov-16 18:35:24

ARumWithAView, totally agree. Also, many more young people in London and other cosmopolitan cities can access dual nationality through a EU parent or grandparent from a EU country than young people from Leave voting areas. Many young people I know through work in education, and many of my children's friends, are bilingual and have dual passport, and others are in the process of obtaining it through Irish ancestry or other means. Guess who won't have a hope in hell and will be stuck in an increasingly little island?

InformalRoman Thu 03-Nov-16 18:38:29

International recruiters are already looking at this in our experience - having a non-UK EU passport is definitely a plus point.

Motheroffourdragons Thu 03-Nov-16 18:44:05

It can hardly be a surprise though, surely.

InformalRoman Thu 03-Nov-16 18:49:10

It can hardly be a surprise though, surely.

It probably will be to those Leavers that forgot FOM is a two way street.

HyacinthFuckit Thu 03-Nov-16 18:49:13

Bet Farage's kids have got the German and Irish passports they're entitled to #imalrightjack.

jaws5 Thu 03-Nov-16 18:52:08

HyacinthFuckit I am 100% sure of that...

EleanorRigby123 Thu 03-Nov-16 19:01:45

@scaryteacher - if I remember rightly you are a committed Brexiter and your DH works for an International Organisation in Brussels. Obviously anyone working for NATO etc is not going to be impacted by this. But the rest of us will be.

It would of course be illegal for any employer in either UK or the wider EU to discriminate on these grounds until such time as the UK leaves the EU. So any of you seeing evidence of this should be contacting your own or your companies' lawyers.

EleanorRigby123 Thu 03-Nov-16 19:03:59


...and Nigel will no doubt swallow his hatred of the EU just enough to continue to collect his MEP salary and the gold plated pension deal to which he is entitled.

HyacinthFuckit Thu 03-Nov-16 19:25:24

He's such an inspiration. I shall think of him as I acquire my dual citizenship.

bestcatintheworld Thu 03-Nov-16 20:21:56

I got my children their shiny red (non-UK) EU passports a couple of months ago.

They're not going to pay for this misery.

Shetland Thu 03-Nov-16 20:35:49

I wonder if my vaguely possible avenue of hope is the same as prettybird's
It's not an outcome I want but I could benefit if it did happen.
I am unlikely to make use of FOM myself but I could find a way to make it possible for my kids I would.

Motheroffourdragons Thu 03-Nov-16 21:20:26

Its really funny. I am 50 years of age, and never in a million years thought I'd be living in Brussels even 3 years ago. But that is what being in the EU has allowed us to do. I never thought I'd be using FOM, but here I am.
It was so easy to move to the continent, and the experience that my son is having is incredible.

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