Anyone thinking of leaving the UK following the referendum vote?

[crazyhead]

Just curious really. Me and my husband believe quite passionately in the EU project and it feels as though we don't want to sit here and watch the UK leave. I watched my Mum die last year and I just can't bear the slow motion grief of seeing this as well.

So we're thinking of leaving the UK for a while. DH has an interview on Friday for a US job for starters (we'd prefer EU but fewer relevant jobs - and we've not got the ancestry for EU passports sadly).

Anyone else thinking of leaving?

[Nightofthetentacle]

Sadly yes, not in any great detail yet but keeping it in mind in case it becomes more challenging to keep my business growing. And also if nationalist feelings continue to swell, I don't think I want to be around for that.

With a very heavy heart though, I really don't want to leave despite the growing number of leave voters who've said "just leave then" recently and I know there is a decent case to be made for sticking around and trying to make an economically successful, peaceful, liberal United Kingdom.

A goodly number of people I know are actively making plans though.

[ManonLescaut]

Currently living in Europe, seriously considering not going back.

The Brexiteer mentality is an aspect of the UK I have always disliked.

[SwedishEdith]

But if Trump wins the US won't be much better, surely?

Can see the appeal of leaving though.

[crazyhead]

Yeah I know what you mean SwedishEdith. - Have been thinking about that. Guess it might not feel so personal? It's partly that working in US would help with further moves due to work experience.

[crazyhead]

Nightofthetentacle/Manon - i know lots of people in your circs too

[goose1964]

a friend of mine is considering relocating to Poland, she's been married to o Pole for nearly 30 years & lived here ever since, they got their Ids when on holiday there just before the referendum

[lalalonglegs]

It's certainly crossed my mind - and I was actively researching locations when it looked as if Andrea Leadsom might become PM. I have dual nationality with another EU nation so it is theoretically possible for me to live in any of the 27 countries but I'm struggling with what sort of schooling would be right for my children and whether I could run my current business out there. I'm tentatively thinking about visiting a couple of short-listed cities next year to see what the vibe is like/where is affordable etc but it's kind of a back-burner project as I have convinced myself A50 isn't ever going to be triggered .

[Nightofthetentacle]

shudders I had forgotten about that time about three bloody weeks ago when Leadsom might have been PM. Interesting times eh?

I think the US might be just fine, they seem to have a tradition of alarming (to the outside world) leadership, but still manage to be culturally and economically productive.

Will be looking out for migration stats over the coming months, anecdotally a lot of people seem to be thinking about going, but when and whether that translates into an actual emigration impact will be interesting. If I was in government I'd have it on my to do list to try and encourage people to stay, as I suspect it takes a while to encourage them back.

[ManonLescaut]

Yes the US has a record of economic prosperity withstanding nutty presidents (Regan, Dubya)...

If I wasn't going to stay in Paris - Vienna and Amsterdam would come high on my list of places to live.

[crazyhead]

I love Vienna and Paris, I agree. Amsterdam too but speak zero Dutch. Good sized cities and easy to get to UK tk see family and friends.

Me and DH were just laughing at 'Dr' Liam Fox's pronouncement that Eu UK negotiations would be sorted by 2020. Er... Based on what? It is really depressing sitting at the outset of this heartbreaking mess

[Nightofthetentacle]

YY to Paris, although I hear it can be fiddly to run companies there.

Berlin is a goer, has a strong tech industry and will almost certainly win from London in the short term. And it is such fun...

I've not been to Vienna, is it lovely? Aren't they about to rerun that nail-bitingly close presidential election though? I don't think me nerves would take it...

[JamieVardysParty]

We're actually looking to do the opposite - abroad at the moment and looking to move back.

[RageAgainstTheTagine]

How you feel now is how I felt watching the EU project slowly eat away the country I love. More than half the nation didn't love the 'EU project' and felt a growing horror at the way things were panning out.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

I'm hoping Scotland will leave the UK, does that count?

[MaliceInWonderland78]

I get that some people will be in favour of the European Project (I'm personally not) but I don't see how moving to the US would solve any of the issues you think might arise as a result of the UK leaving. If anything, the US will be worse.

FWIW I used to work for a US Investment Bank. They were constantly offering very generous packages to get some of us to relocate. I always resisted. I do not want my children growing up in a country where:

lack of Gun control is such an issue;
There is no NHS free at the point of use;
There still exists poverty on a level which would surprise many.

[ManonLescaut]

Vienna is to die for lovely. But Austria has its own far right issues. You'd be safer in Berlin from that pov.

[Nightofthetentacle]

Rage at the risk of a derail, what specifically did you see as eating away at the UK?

I have very specific fears now (rise of nationalism; rise of racism; lack of skilled people to employ; reopening the Good Friday agreement, Scottish Indyref2, loss of financial services passporting, loss of protections through the ECJ; loss of science, research and innovation funding; uncertainty affecting investment; social unrest when noone gets the Brexit they want; the sheer expense of making this happen and who will pay...) that I just did not have pre-referendum.

I don't think it is fair to say half the nation felt growing horror at the way things were panning out - it was half the turnout on the day, and according to this set of vox populi, some voted against Turkey, competition (perceived) for jobs and housing, asylum seekers being given houses, lack of Westminster attention to the North of England, loss of traditional industries, lack of apprenticeships, not feeling European, the credit crunch... I am sure a Home Counties version would show different, but perhaps overlapping, themes for a Leave vote.

If there is research that shows why people voted Leave I would love to see it - the picture seems to me to be that the EU was a scapegoat for whatever losses people felt they had suffered since about 1955.

[Zorion]

We are currently in the EU. We left because we graduated into the recession and couldn't get work, we got work in an EU country, and just as we were planning to come back home the referendum happened and so I think we're going to cling on here for dear life. We are one year away from being entitled to permanent residency here anyway.

Unfortunately, our host country doesn't offer dual citizenships, so I don't know what to do about DS. He was born here and I really want him to have EU nationality for all the benefits it entails. I do too, I feel very emotional at the prospect of losing those little stars on my passport.

My strength of feeling has surprised me. I am disgusted with the UK at the moment (even though luckily my home town was a remain town) and can't see myself moving back soon anymore, even though we're not properly settled here either due to having expected to soon move back! I feel stateless.

[MissMargie]

I've lived abroad and am extremely happy to be back in the UK.

[ManonLescaut]

Rage at the risk of a derail, what specifically did you see as eating away at the UK?

I wondered that too and figured I cba to go there.

Was it the EU business and manufacturing investment, the university funding, the scientific and medical research funding, the job and growth creation, the exports, the charity funding, the environmental clean up, the support for deprived areas, the workers rights, the European arrest warrants..?

Ironically Tees, the area featured in your voxpop stands to lose £726 million in EU projects investment, £82m funding for NE universities and 770 jobs boost from EU students, a £7m European Social Fund and Youth Employment Initiative funding, designed to support NEETs.

Given that the NE pays £496m to the EU, it loses far more than it gains by voting out.

[ManonLescaut]

I've lived abroad and am extremely happy to be back in the UK

In the words of Ricky Gervais' mum:

'What d'you want to go abroad for, there's bits of Reading you haven't been'.

[papayasareyum]

the UK is one of the very best nations on the planet and it's amusing and bewildering that remain voters want to leave the UK to live in poorer, less democratic, less tolerant nations. And ironic.

[Oliversmumsarmy]

"770 jobs boost"
I think the reason that they voted leave was because when you live in an area where the powers that be say jobs are coming to an area, the majority of those that had the vote think because of past experiences, those jobs would be filled with EU migrants and only a small percentage would go to current residents.

There is a double wammy of not only not getting a job but the influx of more people into an area puts a strain on the public services.

Iyswim.

[Nightofthetentacle]

Whence the irony papaya? I've listed a good few reasons I am fearful (genuinely, shitting it) about the UK's future. Manon had a good number too, not least that we now have to hope that the current government will honour and expand support given to areas like Tees.

What's your answer for these fears?

[RageAgainstTheTagine]

Our fishing industry, control of borders (not just looking at passports, which is all the border staff can do with European migrants) our government being made to give work to foreign companies over our own even though nobody else in Europe does this. We follow the rules, nobody else does! Why can you buy insane pyrotechnics in France but not here?? (Like cherry bombs, fire crackers and fireworks that could reach the moon)
Butchers being banned from selling in pounds and ounces, the near miss over the euro being taken on here, talk of a euro army, and tax. I wouldn't be surprised if the next thing would be maki g us drive on the right. I jest slightly, but.....honestly, I really wouldn't put it past them.
Now, before anyone jumps on me, this is the EU as I see it. Every 'crazy eu' law headline, every time a judge overruled our judges, the disgusting attitude of the EU bigwigs towards us made me hate them....they have brought this on themselves, they never wanted to be partners in this project, they despised us for fighting them on issues, and for trying to keep our identity.