They calculated annual leave incorrectly

[biscuitdunkerette]

I started a new part-time role in a large organisation a couple of months ago. The contact I signed had pro-rated the annual leave for the year, along with the back holidays but it seemed a lot. I queried this amount twice with HR and twice on an email they confirmed it was the correct amount of leave.

They are now saying it was a miscalculation and the amount of leave available for me to book on the HR system has almost halved.

Given the signed contract and the confirmation in writing, can anyone give a steer where I stand on this? I feel really annoyed.

Thank you

[mimibunz]

They made a mistake. Let it go.

[LIZS]

You thought it was wrong and now you are annoyed that you were right! As long as you have the same prorata as a fte I don't think you can complain. Have you overbooked? Maybe they would concede unpaid leave if you are already committed.

[lljkk]

I'm leaning towards YABU, but make your case.

Give us real numbers, OP.
Eg, they said you had 270 hours but now it's 130 hours and you only have 10 hours let now until April 2020.
Or maybe you turned down alternative job that offered 200 hours.

Has the change actually inconvenienced U - did you actually book a hol based on wrong understanding?

[biscuitdunkerette]

Damn right I’m annoyed!

It was originally quoted as 184 hours till end Jan 2020, now 104 hours. This includes bank holidays so I will need to take Christmas and Boxing Day etc out of it (even though the organisation is closed).

On the back of the 184 I had booked two weeks in summer and the full October mid term break. So six days remaining.

I’m interested to hear from a legal perspective, if anyone has one at this time on a Friday!

Thanks again

[flowery]

You are annoyed that you have ended up not having twice as much holiday as you should?

It’s annoying they made a mistake, but it’s not like they noticed three years down the line and tried to deduct for excess holiday or anything.

[flowery]

X post, but from a legal perspective there is no problem. It was clearly an error and you would not be reasonable to claim the 184 is your contractual entitlement. You have enough annual leave for the holidays you have booked.

[tanstaafl]

They made a mistake once , are you sure that 104 hours is correct ?

[VodselForDinner]

I’m interested to hear from a legal perspective

You’re two months in to a new job, and looking for legal advice on a matter relating to human error that hasn’t caused you any tangible loss?

I get that it’s annoying but surely you want to work in a company where you can make a mistake, rectify it, and not have threats of legal intervention because of it?

Good luck with your probation, OP- companies tend to dislike troublemakers.

[mrsm43s]

But what are you annoyed by specifically?

Presumably you can still cancel and rebook the summer/October annual leave if you like? But I would presume that like most people you would choose to use your leave and go away over school holidays anyway. Would you not have booked this time off had you been given the correct information? You still have enough leave to cover your holidays, plus an extra six days. Your new leave entitlement will start in January.

You're not actually saying that they need to give you nearly double the leave of everyone else this year or in future years because they made a mistake in your leave calculation are you? Because that would be unreasonable. Wanting flexibility around moving already booked but not yet taken annual leave or being allowed to use unpaid leave to cover booked holidays that you now don't have the a/l left to cover (although I don't think this is actually the case anyway) would be reasonable.

[WhatIfIHadnt]

How many hours a week do you work?

[RJnomore1]

Did you get terms and conditions of employment stating how they calculate leave or just a contract stating 184 hours?

[Nydj]

You could speak to them and say that you had book leave on the basis of being told you had 184 hours so for this year, would they please honour that or at least agree to a compromise of 150 hours?

[biscuitdunkerette]

Ok, I’m getting the message that my annoyance is unreasonable!

To answer the questions I work 21 hours a week. My contract states p/t hours will be calculated on a pro rata basis, and is 184 hours for the current leave period.

I’m not thinking of taking out a legal case or anything like that, or that I should be entitled to the full amount. Just that given their error (despite several opportunities to check and rectify) I am now ‘out of pocket’ for leave and could this, given the legal standing of a contract, be open to reasonable negotiation eg 3 or 4 more days to help cover school holidays a bit more?
If an organisation reduced the salary stated in a contract due to an error, surely that would be open to re-negotiation?

[dementedpixie]

How many days do you do the 21 hours over?

[flowery]

” I’m getting the message that my annoyance is unreasonable!”

I don’t think you are unreasonable being annoyed, but there’s a world of difference between being annoyed and wanting to know your legal position in relation to an error.

How are you out of pocket? Have you booked something you need to cancel which will incur fees?

[flowery]

”If an organisation reduced the salary stated in a contract due to an error, surely that would be open to re-negotiation?”

Not if it was a clear error and caught quickly, no.

[flowery]

If someone accidentally put a salary 77% higher than the expected/correct one in a contract, they would not have to negotiate to change it to the correct figure.

If the error was much lower, and had been going on for ages, you’d have a better argument tbh.

[NaturalBornWoman]

If someone accidentally put a salary 77% higher than the expected/correct one in a contract, they would not have to negotiate to change it to the correct figure.

To be fair if they put the salary 77% higher you'd notice straight away. It's a bit less clear with annual leave expressed in hours, especially since when part time they tend to include bank holidays in the allowance whereas for full time staff they don't. I think a lot of non HR professionals struggle with the calculations.

Having said that, it is an error and they are entitled to rectify it. I don't know why some of the responses are so nasty though, it isn't AIBU.

[mrsm43s]

As I said before, I think it is reasonable to as for flexibility to cancel and rebook leave, or use unpaid leave as necessary bearing in mind the situation. But as things actually stand, you have enough to cover your holiday commitments and have 6 days extra left over, yes? So I'm not sure why you think you are entitled to any extra annual leave.

You are not "out of pocket" with leave - you have exactly the amount that you are entitled to.

The situation could have been far worse. If the error hadn't been uncovered til later in the year and you had already taken more leave than you were entitled to, you could have been asked to pay back the extra leave that you had taken.

[biscuitdunkerette]

Thank you all for taking the time to respond. For anyone in this position in future, a friend in HR has messaged me her view, below.

NaturalBornWoman I’m not sure why some of the responses are so pointed either. Jealous of my potential massive annual leave? Knackered and cross by this time on a Friday? But I don’t take it personally, at least they took the time!

“There is no legal ground that you would have to get the higher amount. However, they should as a conscientious employer work with you to resolve this, not least just to keep their employee happy.
It depends on how flexible they are.
Having said that I think you have a case for negotiation with your manager and how this impacts you and your childcare arrangements that have already been put in place based on their written confirmation twice and see what they say”

[RainbowPanda]

My contract states p/t hours will be calculated on a pro rata basis, and is 184 hours for the current leave period.

Is 184 hours the number of hours it would be if you had worked the full year? But the 104 hours is because you only started two months ago?

[HobbyIsCodeForDogging]

Why do some people get so litigious about the slightest thing? And what does it say about your relationship with your employer?!

You're not out of pocket, you're in the correct position you should be. I can understand you being disappointed but all this talk of where you stand legally is a bit OTT.

Remember you can get unpaid parental leave if your plans for this year depend on having such a lot of time off.

[HobbyIsCodeForDogging]

I would guess 184 hours is for a 37 hour week pro-rata to whenever in the year OP joined. 104 is the 21 hour week equivalent.

[Applesandpears23]

YANBU My HR are incapable of getting my a/l right now I am part time. I have to do my own sum and then talk them through it. It is enraging.

[Todaythiscouldbe]

From what you've said I agree with Hobby
184 is the fte for starting on your start date, it says it will be pro rata for p/t so 104 is exactly that, pro-rata