Part time forced to go full time?

[mrscumberbatch]

If a part timer was told that their role was no longer available and that they had to move full time can they request redundancy?

[KissMyFatArse]

Effectively they're saying you that position isn't available anymore so if day that should qualify for redundancy?

I don't know for sure, so hopefully someone comes along who knows the facts but it's basically saying they don't have a role available for you anymore?

[mrscumberbatch]

The role would exist but only as full time...

I've had a good google but it seems to be a bit of a grey area

[chipsandpeas]

when this happened in my work it was redundancy that was offered or a different job role that could be done part time

[flowery]

Redundancy is diminished requirement for the work in question so it's not a redundancy situation. Employers used to say there was a diminished requirement for the part time position because the increase in workload required a full time position but that approach is now considered risky and not good practice.

My advice to an employer wanting to increase someone's hours is to approach it as a terms and conditions change.

What is your situation OP?

[mrscumberbatch]

Ahh bugger. It's actually a friend who works part time, has done for yonks (3 or 4 years) but bosses are getting shirty about it and asking when she will be returning full time.

It's my understanding that she doesn't have enough work to do as it is, and they're not nice to work for so full time really not within her interests. She was hoping to be able to request redundancy if she turns down the full time role.

Perhaps back to the drawing board on this one!

[flowery]

Well she can request it, of course, but they could say no.

Sounds as though they'd struggle to justify trying to force her to increase hours though so they may go for it if it gets them out of a hole.

[mrscumberbatch]

Thanks Flowery.

She's actually managed to evade ever signing any contracts at work. I have no idea how.

So regarding the terms and conditions of her role no longer being available- can she reject this on account of she has never signed to accept the t's and c's?

(Clutching at straws here!)

[flowery]

That wouldn't help her. She can refuse to agree to a change in her terms and conditions, so arguing that there aren't any terms and conditions would help them not her.

Evading signing a contract isn't an achievement, by the way. A contract is helpful to both parties. She will need to argue that her current working hours are her terms and conditions and therefore cannot be changed without her consent. If she's been working those hours consistently for a long time, then they are her terms and conditions, but obviously if she had a contract with those hours specified, that job would be easier.

As it is, with no contract, her employer might argue those aren't her terms and conditions anyway, in which case they don't need her consent to change them. Its not that they'd (necessarily) be successful in that argument, but it's easier all round if there's no debate about what the terms and conditions actually are.

[mrscumberbatch]

Thank you again Flowery. I shall relay to her.
I know she is having a meeting tomorrow so hopefully going in with a bit more info than she had will give her more confidence

[Timeforabiscuit]

I asked hr this, and basically they would be making the old role redundant - no one can force you into a new contract (but the choice may not be all its cracked up to be!).

Do you have any points of negotiation you can use? Do they simply want more of your time (forcing your hand) or do you think they are trying to ease you out?

[Timeforabiscuit]

Sorry - post wouldn't load last night and the threads moved on! I don't think my post will apply if she hasn't got a signed contract to negotiate from.

Good luck to your friend for today.

[maggiethemagpie]

Where I work we use the rule that if a job is changing more than 25% (up or down) redundancy applies.

We may be a little more old school than flowery but have never had any comeback (yet!)

The logic we use is that the old job has changed enough to no longer exist, but I can see flowery's point that the need for the work has not actually diminished.

Depends on what your friend's employer's stance is, whether they will see it as a redundancy or ts and cs change, if ts and cs then no redundancy pay unfortunately.