Aghhh

[mincepieprivateeye]

Just need to have a bit of a moan, sorry. Dear dsm moved into sheltered accommodation mid December. I'd passed over responsibly to my step brothers, her sons as I'd dealt with dads Alzheimer's alone from his diagnosis two years ago, he's now in care after a torrid few months which involved him going missing from both hospital and home and being sectioned. I'd supported dsm all through this us her diagnosis with Alzheimer's as well last January. Since Christmas the phone calls I'm getting from her are increasing daily, she just won't leave me alone. I had seven calls one after the next yesterday, each call came with a voice mail and she rang straight away after leaving the voice mail in the afternoon, this was on top of the five I'd had in the morning. Each message is more and more desperate, pleading with me to call her. It's heartbreaking but there isn't a particular problem. Yesterday afternoon was because wanted to go to the shop but as ever wanted me to tell her if there was anything else she had to do. Even after I spoke to her she called me another four times plus I get countless blank text messages. She only has a mobile as my step brothers don't think she needs a landline but she clearly can't use the mobile properly, often missed calls and if she doesn't answer it she can't retrieve her voice mails and always calls me to see if it was me who called.
I'm having a nightmare trying to get all the information I need for the court protection orde I'm applying for to become dads deputy as I don't have POA and this is down to dsm being difficult when dad still had capacity. I d already had two phone calls from my solicitor and had to call dads bank customer service but I've got to go to the branch tomorrow. All of this when I'm at work. By last night I was dizzy, the room was spinning, I was hit and cold tearful and shaking. My oh is threatening to bar her number so she can't keep calling me as he can see the effect it's having and if I'm honest I really wouldn'mund. I said yesterday for her to call my sb but she said he's at work but when I said so was I she just said yes but it says on this price of paper that it's ok to call you during the day!! I've never felt like I did last night, I've inly ever come close to fainting once but I thought I would pass out and I truly did feel dreadful. I do know I can't carry on like this with her

[mincepieprivateeye]

Sorry for the typos and for whinging but I'm hoping others have felt the same.

[Kirkenes]

Ohh dear you poor thing. I'm not surprised that you feel like a moan!

Does she have any other help? Or is it just you and the SB?

Is it something where you could pay someone to visit?

I don't know it's hard to give any meaningful advice as I suspect you've already had a good think. I suspect that your DHs suggestion might be sensible - perhaps not block her completely but for most of the day.

[CMOTDibbler]

Oh, that sounds so hard, and she obviously isn't coping. My dad will phone 7 times in a day and its just so draining

[Needmoresleep]

Decide what you are willing to do, then bar her number. Then email your SBs and say what you have done, in a factual sort of way. (Your husband might draft it and then you take out the angry bits, but don't add in any apologetic bits.) It is wrong if they have either given her a piece of paper with your number on, especially if it suggests you can be called when at work, or programmed your number into her ohhone so she calls you first.

Then make sure your consious is clear by deciding to visit once a fortnight or whatever. But on a personal level, and to someone who is important in your dads life and who is not well. You are not responsible. This schedule will depend on your other priorities. So if you are busy with your dads affairs and have January blues, then less for the moment. One of your priorities is a Sunday in bed with others bringing you a cooked breakfast.

Again she is not your responsibility. This is tough, given your SBs don't seem willing to step up to the mark, but so be it. You can decide what you do. You can't make them do anything, but equally you cannot do everything.

(You were wanting a bossy response?!)

[mincepieprivateeye]

Thanks all and NMS you're a star
She has carers going four times a day and there are things going on at the sheltered accommodation, coffee mornings etc but she doesn't join in, this isn't because of dementia though it won'take it any easier, she never really mixed that much with the neighbours she'd had for almost forty years and I only knew of one close friend and she moved away six years ago.
It will end up being a case of call blocking but without a shadow of doubt I will be painted as the devil for abandoning her by my sbs but for my own sanity it's going to have to happen. Thanks for listening x

[Needmoresleep]

You might think about why your sbs would paint you as the devil? I have something similar where my brother is clearly very angry with me despite me taking on a large part of the load. I suspect he is directing some of his own frustrations, both at our mother being ill and his inability, for whatever reason, to step in.

[whataboutbob]

Was going to suggest barring her number but nms beat me to it. I have been through the manic phone phase with dad and it was exhausting. FWIW I think you have discharged your debt to your SM, you are now dealing with the fallout of some poor decisions she made (not getting POA) and you need your energies to care for your Dad. Don't feel bad barring her number, she is stuck in a loop and no matter how much you answer the phone it won't change that. that phase will pass, she won't remember it, you can go and visit her again later. A letter to step bros also sounds a good idea.
I would also suggest counselling, which I had for 18 months after dad was diagnosed, it slowly reduced the crippling sense of guild I felt at not doing absolutely everything for Dad. You can't let SM and Dad's illnesses drag you under.

[Needmoresleep]

My mother does not phone often but I have had a few weird sundowning calls. One reason is that she forgets my number so will ask reception for it, write it on a piece of paper which will eventually get lost. The last time I was in her flat I noted the current piece of paper had a couple of numbers transposed. I did not say anything. I hope though that the number she is dialing is a deadnumber and not someone who is already plagued by PPI calls.

[mincepieprivateeye]

I had a non too fruitful appointment at the bank today. The chap was trying to be helpful but their hands are tied, I'm needing to know information that can't give without the court protection order but I need the information to get the order. The bank said I need to apply for an interim order so that's the next step. Dsm is well and truly stuck in that loop of needing constant reassurance. A couple of weeks ago when I spoke to one sb he was saying she had kept asking him what she needed to do while he was visiting her. He was obviously finding it quite frustrating but it was the first time he'd experienced it, he was telling me as though it was the first time it must have happened but I told him that it had been going on for months and that I couldn't keep up with the calls but nothing seems to have changed.i
In all honesty dsm has really made things so much more difficult than they needed to be over the last twelve months from denying she needed help with her and dads meds, bring as difficult as hell when dad first had carers going, to the point where they were stopped after a few weeks, POA for dad plus much more. It had been a real uphill slog to get her to accept help until he ended up in hospital in late summer. I m finding now that the more problems I have in sorting dads affairs the easier I'm finding shutting her out. That probably sounds harsh and as though I'm. blaming her for all that's wrong. She was so bloody minded when it came to being told what to do by anyone, she would fully agree to help if the GP said it but would then refuse point blank as soon as I tried to put it in place. The chemist would only give her one days meds at a time for long enough because she couldn't follow the weekly boxes for her and dad but she would blame it on something else and no matter how much I explained that dad needed his Alzheimer's tablets regular as clockwork or it could make him worse she just saw it as me interfering. She would have been happy for me to go to give the tablets but not outside help. Now she can't wait for the carers to go to her. All so sad.

[Kirkenes]

That sounds like a frustrating day. Although it sounds like everyday is frustrating for you at the moment.

[Needmoresleep]

Sounding really harsh, but if a person has capacity to make their own decisions they also have capacity to live with the consequences.

Or put another way if you don't have the ability to make decisions for someone you can't be expected to put right the consequences of bad decisions they make.

The financial maze is awful. Even with POA it took me a year to sort stuff out. I wish AgeUK or the Alzhiemers Society would make strong representations to the FCA to help ensure a simple one-stop process. I hope you get it done before probate. My main consolation was that by getting everything in order I will be able to present everything to the very expensive solicitor my mother has chosen as her executor and so give her no justification to charge large fees. (I discovered that as excutor she had not closed several acounts belonging to my late father even though she had a clear list - it was no picnic getting the money transferred to my mother's accounts and then consolidating them.)

One awkward question, but do you know what the Wills are. It would be very dispiriting to discover that your fathers assets were left in the first instance to his wife, and thus by default, should he predece her, to her sons. (It happens.) If this was the case it would put a very different complexion on how much time you would want to spend on sorting out the future estate.

Otherwise you seem to be doing well. Expect a whole gamut of emotions. Anger is one of them. Indeed the five stages of grief are listed as denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance. Sounds about right, except they can all come at once!

[mincepieprivateeye]

I have the wills. Dad estate to dsm and vice versa, if the spouse is dead it is then split between the three of us. That's not to say that a new will won't or hasn't been done for dsm when my sb took her to do her POA a few weeks ago. Both sbs knew about the wills as I'd told them when I found them stuck in a wardrobe whe I was looking for something else.
I've not had much luck with the building society either so I'll just have to wait for the interim order.
NMS your mums affairs sound complicated and expensive too! I did discover how many account dad has both sole and joint which is not the same as my sb told me, the joint savings weren't mentioned at all by him. I assume he knows about them all as he took dsm to the bank to sort some things out with her.
It's a good point about the estate though. but do long as I can get my dad the best of everything while he's still here then I'm happy. His money is what he worked for he has never inherited anything and though I'd be annoyed if dsm will has been changed id have to let it be as far as I'm concern an inheritance is a gift not a right.

[Needmoresleep]

Not mentioning joint accounts is naughty. Is it likely that you will need access to these in order to finance your dads care? If so you might ask a question on the legal section of the Alzheimers Assn forum or here about how best to safeguard your dad's share of these assets. Especially given your DSMs diminshed capacity and the potential infuence from others. Certainly, if you can, keep a record of what the balances were.

This sounds a little threatening. However sufficient money makes the whole care thing so much easier. If your dad has worked for it, he should benefit from it.

More positively if he needs money now, given it is going to take a while for the money in his accounts to be available, a first step might be to suggest to your DSB's that half is transferred into an account in your name but in his interest. Records would be kept and any remaining would form part of the estate should he die before the money is spent.

I too am not particuarly worried about inheritance. My mother could well live another decade. My problem is that most of her assets are in property, which needs managing. Its not just tenants, though this has been bad enough as the properties were virtually unmaintained for two decades, but weird stuff. The roof on one building blew off, and it took 9 months to sort, I wrestled with building control and the management company for almost as many months on another simply to put in a new bathroom and kitchen, whilst neighbours and I have been fighting a "right to light" case on the third for the last two years. I am picking up a lot of arcane knowledge, but would prefer to sell. There is more than enough for DM to live on. However DB thinks property is a "good investment". Hmmm. That was my rant!

[mincepieprivateeye]

You've certainly have had a difficult time with your mums affairs and it's a shame when everyone doesn't sing from the same hymn sheet. The interim order should only take around three weeks and having spoken to the bank today they examined they have a vulnerable person policy so I can ask them to freeze dads accounts including joint ones to stop anything untoward happening so that's a positive. Because if dads mental health issues he is on continued care at the moment so I don't need to fund his care for the time being but he will be reassessed in a couple of months for this so its more his personal things, he lost quite a lot of weight so I've bought new clothes, his glasses have been broken so he needs new ones plus day to day things toiletries hair cuts etc. plus the home like the residents to have a monthly allowance for any extras. I've funded this so far but wouldn't be able to pay his care fees.

[whataboutbob]

Mincepie you do know you cannot be made to pay for his care? Assuming the worst and he loses the continuing health care (and obviously that may not happen), he would pay for his own care until he has £23000 in assets or less, then social services step in and picks up the bill.

[mincepieprivateeye]

Sooy Bob I didn't mean it would be down to me only that I couldnt afford to pay then reclaim it from his money later, his care fees are over £6000 a month!! It's a case of wanting to get it all sorted asap so if he needs more than I can give them it's not a problem

[whataboutbob]

Got you! In case a person's funds are not immediately available, I think SS usually pays and recoups the money later. Try not to worry, he can't be put out on the street and they'd wait for you to get deputyship before claiming the money.

[mincepieprivateeye]

Everything takes so long and to be honest it doesn't seem that the banks are that clued up. Even though I'd explained the situation over the phone and in the branch along with his dols report and psychiatric report I was still asked if dad could sign a form to put me on his account! the branch advisor I was dealing with kept disappearing to check with his manager and eventually they had to google what to do, I kid you not, he said that no one knew how to deal with it. Don't get me wrong, I didn't expect to walk out of the meeting with what I needed but I thought they would have some procedure in place for such events but it would appear not. All this could have been avoided, thanks dsm , but it's too late.
I've no worries regarding dad and his care home at the moment but I'm pretty sure that if his care costs can be reduced by the nhs/council they would move him in a flash, he'd only been in there three weeks when they reviewd him last time to see if his needs had dropped.
Hopefully the interim order forms will be ready to send off early next week and should be through in around three weeks. All this is just to get the information for the full application!!

[whataboutbob]

I have found that most bank staff are not confident with POA/ deputyship etc. And they are likely to not have a clue about DOLS/ sectioning etc. One 19 year old girl at NatWest tried to be helpful but I found out when trying to log on to Dad's account she'd done it all wrong. Took more visits to the bank and finally dealing with someone who understood the system to sort out. I'm afraid persistence and teeth gritting are often needed, but it will come together eventually.

[mincepieprivateeye]

It's funny you mentioning POA. While I was waiting to be seen, a man approached an advisor near me regarding POA, he'd said that despite him having taken whoevers POA in to the bank and being assured a bank card would be sent to him that he had been waiting over four weeks and still couldn't access the accounts he needed to. There must be loads of people in similar situations having to deal with banks that aren't very effective in dealing with such issues.