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Key Stage One SATS query - Year 2 son made to do Year 3/4 paper today and upset

(19 Posts)
FIMAC1 Thu 26-May-05 16:32:18

Can anyone explain the Key Stage One STATS to me? Ds has just got in and was very upset over his Year 2 SATS paper today - apparenly it was really hard, and his teacher said it was a Year 3 (or 4) test and not to worry about it. He found it really difficult and is upset - am going to ask his teacher about it but wondered why they have done this. The rest of the SATS have been really easy, according to him.

Hate to see him so upset

Starmummy Thu 26-May-05 16:51:39

Lots of hugs to your DS.

I'm not really sure, but could it be that he has done so well that they tried him a harder paper to see how he coped? I would think it was meant to be a good thing for him.I'm sure the teacher will explain all and it will be because she thought he could cope. Maybe she should have explained it a little better to him?

Keep us up to date

pindy Thu 26-May-05 16:53:27

He is probably a bright child and they wanted to make sure they were giving him the correct standard of work. They will have done it to see what he knows, so sorry that he got upset, but he should feel proud of himself they gave it to him.

tarantula Thu 26-May-05 17:02:55

yes Id say they are trying to stretcha bright child to see how well he is doing. It is sometimes difficult to judge brighter childrens understanding of things as intellectually they understand but emotionally they havent if that makes sense. I think the teacher judged that he would be able to do quite a bit of the paper but didnt realise that in struggling to do it is might undermine him. Its a very difficult balance to maintain esp when trying to get kids to achieve their potential. Id ahve a word withte teacher about it and shell prob be able to reassure him. Im sure lots of the other kids were very stressed too. Its a very difficult time for them all.

FIMAC1 Thu 26-May-05 17:31:19

Oh thanks for all that - will be able to go in prepared tomorrow -
He is very young in the year (bar one other boy) and was very prem, so ended up in school year before his due date one - I always worry over him! although the school have always said he is bright - We tried to hold him back a year before he started Reception but as the school is always oversubscribed they wouldn't let me.

I would agree over the emotional immaturity, is quite a sensitive lad

Thanks again - will let you know what they say, but it seems you MN'ers have already answered my question

soapbox Thu 26-May-05 17:33:53

My DD is the same - apparently they did a test run doing both the Y2 SAT papre and the Y3 one and on the basis of this about 6 children did the harder papers.

Perhaps try and give him a confidence boost by saying that the teacher wouldn't have let him do it if she didn't think he could manage it?????

Marina Thu 26-May-05 17:35:24

Or they were trying to boost the school's results
Obviously I do hope not in your case Fimac1 but a friend's child's experience of being blackmailed into doing KS 1 SATS year 3/4 papers "for the school's sake" was instrumental in our considering and opting for independent education for our children. Yes she was SIX at the time and yes the teacher was that blatant about it. Our borough is struggling very badly in the league tables but I thought this was totally unacceptable behaviour. Her parents were absolutely livid when they found out.

marbeth Thu 26-May-05 17:52:01

HI FIMAC1

My ds is in year 2 as well.They did their sats two weeks ago.What we were told before hand was if the children got a 2A in either there reading comprehension or numeracy.Then they would do the level 3 paper.However teacher said that level three is much harder.To achieve a level 3 you dont need to get lots of it right.A lot of my ds class did level 3 reading comprehension and all of them found it very hard.

bee3 Thu 26-May-05 17:52:46

Your poor ds
I may be completely wrong, but I wonder if what he meant was the 'level 3' paper, rather than the 'Year 3' paper. When I last taught Y2, and it was a while ago, and things have changed bit, a child who came out with a L2A in the reading or maths paper had to then do the Level 3 ones to see how far they went. I often felt awful doing it, as I knew through my teacher assessments that the child was indeed working at 2A level (the top end of level 2), but would struggle with the L3 papers, and probably feel disheartened. Now the tests take a back seat and teachers assessments can override what happens in the tests, but I think some schools will push the L3s anyway, because of the pressure of results.

Ask the teacher to explain it all in full, and stress how upset he was. One of the few ways to stop the testing at this young age (as they have in Wales) is for parents to be more vocal. Good luck, and I hope your ds regains his confidence quickly

bee3 Thu 26-May-05 17:53:59

Marbeth - I need to type faster

FIMAC1 Thu 26-May-05 18:11:58

I think you may be right about it being a level 3 paper, thanks. He said he left loads out (Maths paper) but she still seemed pleased with it.

I don't agree with the whole SATS thing anyway and told him from the start they didn't matter and it was the Govenments way of seeing how the school was teaching, rather than how well they were all doing - he seems fine now and is chilling out in front of the TV

Thanks all

roisin Thu 26-May-05 18:19:47

This is one of my (many) objections to SATs and 'standards-driven curriculum and assessment': more able children get used to always getting practically everything right, and generally finding it very easy. Then when they are faced with a challenge it's hard to cope with.

It is important that children are stretched and challenged to the point of failure, in an emotionally safe environment. I hope your school do better for providing this for your ds in future.

FWIW the boys seem to have found the following phrase very helpful: "If you're not making any mistakes you're not learning, you're just practising". And we talk to them a lot about enjoying a challenge and how this is actually more interesting than an easy exercise, and that the satisfaction in achievement is greater when they've had to work hard and persevere.

I do think it's vital for all children to be able to push themselves, and it's best to learn this at a young age. But SATs and the NC-culture don't tend to support this.

swedishmum Thu 26-May-05 19:24:53

Dd and a couple of others were always given tests a year or 2 ahead as well as their own, but told very clearly what they were for. Must say I was never asked but as my dd is the kind who likes tests (100% in Verbal Reasoning in 11plus etc) I never bothered.
The school should explain to the children what they are doing and why. The joke is, they would all get the same questions the next year!
The sooner SATS are done away with the better.

roisin Thu 26-May-05 20:19:12

I still don't see the justification for having to do extra tests. The teachers have a very good idea of the children's ability, so why don't they just do the level 3 test in the first place? Why is the reward for doing well in the first test, the privilege of doing a second test?

Like Swedishmum my ds1 (fortunately) enjoys doing these tests, but not all children do!

singersgirl Thu 26-May-05 20:41:47

I believe this year that for reading they were able to put more able children straight into Level 3 if they knew they would get a 2a; but for maths, they still had to do the Level 2 paper first, which seems daft. In any case, this year the teacher assessment grade is the only one that has to be reported to the parents, and the test result 'on the day' is supposed to assume less importance. It seems a complete waste of time to me honestly, and an unnecessary hijacking of a term of school. Sorry that your son was upset by the test - I think it's all really unreasonable at this age - my DS1 isn't even 7 till August.

FIMAC1 Thu 26-May-05 20:47:17

Thanks for the explanations of SATS, I really had no idea about the different levels of papers and how they decided on who did what, very interesting -

Singersgirl, ds will be 7 in July -he is small for his age but catching up

swedishmum Thu 26-May-05 23:13:42

The first time I was approached re SATS was when ds (no 3) was to be put in for level 3 - he's dyslexic and I said no. School agreed. He'd done his bit by then. In one way I was pleased they thought he was up to it, but had no intention of giving him unnecessary grief for some government statistics. Just so I can boast (as many mums at school do ) in the playground!

FIMAC1 Fri 27-May-05 09:03:13

Spoke to ds teacher this a/m - as others have said it was because he had got a 2a in his Maths SATS, but then went on to say that this years level 3 paper was really hard, in her, and other teachers opinions, and felt awful giving it to him as he was still only 6!

She also said that the paper was done for Government stats, and is fairly irrelevant as the teachers assessments overide any SATS testings - apparently he had done well in the level 3 test - so sounds like he is going to be more like his Dad in that department as I am hopeless at it

nutcracker Sat 28-May-05 22:28:29

I am getting very confused with all this.

Last week Dd1 (7) came home and said the teacher had said they had all done very well and someone had even got a level 3a.

Then a few days later she said that the teacher had given them a sheet of paper each with their results written on it. Dd reckons that hers said that she got a 3a for english a 3b for maths and a 3a for reading.

I am confused now because as far as I knew they were sitting level 3 but the result would just say level 3 and not a b or c.

I really think that if they are going to give the children bits f results here and there that they should send the results home as dd was most annoyed because she thought I didn't believe her.

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