Is anyone here prepared to say that they believe in anthroposophy?(144 Posts)
There's been so much conjecture about it/testimony from parents etc who had negative experiences of Waldorf education, or who say that they weren't aware of anthroposophy/the esoteric spiritual side of Steiner.
What I haven't seen (apologies if I missed it!) is someone come on and say "yes, I am an anthroposophist, come and ask me questions and I will clarify how it works"
Anyone? I would be really, really, interested.
Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.
KF78: I thought it was a philosophy. You guys always say it's a philosophy - what happened?
The British Humanist Association recently for the first time listed Steiner schools amongst the faith schools it's concerned about re Gove's Free School funding proposals.
Positive stories re Steiner Waldorf schools in the UK press have stopped, pressure from critical groups had intensified - in Australia, New Zealand, Norway (where a book by an ex-Steiner Waldorf teacher called 'What they do not tell us' has caused a scandal) Sweden, the US, Denmark, Germany ... and here in the UK.
'Spiritual practices' are the business of the adults concerned. When these self-described spiritual practices are played out to the detriment of children and vulnerable adults, it becomes a matter of public concern.
They have been. It is.
Anthroposophy is not a belief system, it is a spiritual practice and a series of insights derived from that practice, one of which is that the dogmatic adherence to anything, including Anthroposophy, is unhelpful and not advisable.
So, while there are people who 'believe in' Anthroposophy rather than studying or practicing it, this would be considered unfortunate and misguided by most Anthroposophists.
so Justine- Mills idea that we can never be sure that there isn't an element of truth in those who are silenced has a satisfying smack of logic to it then......
Thanks for the link to Butterflies and Wheels MyLovely
Interesting article on Anthroposophical doctors that's just been posted on my other favourite website Butterflies and Wheels.
Justine, is this ok as long as we don't link?
nlondondad, I barely scratched the surface of the prescribed reading list at Uni but JS Mill's On Liberty and Utilitarianism were, let's just say, seminal texts for me (probably accounting for around 50% of my entire primary source consumption during my 3 years).
Its a real pity this thread has provoked such difficulty for Mumsnet as I thought it a better, and more balanced discussion than many I have seen. It did not have too much tedious confrontational stuff.
But I think we really do have to accept the judgement of Justine and co as to what can be done on this site.
I believe firmly in robust and free debate, I am hugely influenced by J S Mill "On Liberty". But I think we are all guests here and must respect our hosts views.....
Nb YetMoreTech was (I assume) trying a diversionary tactic in order to diffuse our attackers. Hence the slight economy with the truth...
There was more than one reason for site problems last month MANATEEequineOHARA.
I can only repeat: we came under fire in a number of ways in the last month - hackers, trolls and in addition had some server issues.
You're right it was bizarre!
Meant to link to the first page not the 4th!
Hmm, I thought this explained the site problems, and seemed to suggest that it was nothing to do with anything linked to talk about Steiner/Anthros etc?
The whole situation is bizarre.
Why were my posts deleted?
What on earth did they have in them that warranted that?
They had name of some historical authors.
This is a total farce.
Justine, what exactly is it which makes you link some mothers talking about their experiences of Steiner to hackers?
There's something very strange afoot for sure.
I agree too with lovelyhorse that before people who are probably not mothers appeared, things were a great deal more...informative.
Lovelyhorse we came under fire in a number of ways in the last month - hackers, trolls and in addition had some server issues. None of which was pleasant. We can't be sure what the motivation for the attack was or how we attracted this particular group's attention but we think this subject might have had something to do with it.
We've explained fairly clearly, I think, what our position is re discussion of this topic but as always we will try to allow as much freedom of speech as we can so long as the MN overall doesn't suffer.
read Justines's post, I am not referring to the other posts, and the link in that post, the other stuff on that thread is bit of a red herring.
BoysAreLikeDogs, I thought the latest was the server needed attention rather than it being hackers?
Please please read justine's post from 18th may 2009 and the link she has posted too
If you want to dicuss S t e i n e r do it somewhere else, set up your own website, make it easily googlable, take the risk upon yourselves
Tizian, why do you link to the same websites?
Did you write them yourself?
So this thread was resurrected from when it died 7 months ago.
I don't see why people would find that annoying.
Surely it means only that a new batch of readers can access the fascinating information that we missed at the time?
I've learned some things here.
It would be good to see a civilised discussion about anthroposophy.
It isn't against the law not to believe in the supernatural!
Actually, I believe that many anthroposophists take on Steiner begin and end with The Philosophy of freedom, which was really written before he had formed most of the more outlandish anthro beliefs.
I don't believe a lot of what Steiner taught; I've read masses too.
I don't believe in spirit worlds existing, reincarnation or karma and I don't believe that clairvoyance is a "science".
If these central anthroposophical beliefs were presented to parents, in the information about the schools, there would be much less heartache.The schools very rarely mention anything about this. They talk about Steiner's "child development "theory- which is an anthroposophical theory, not development in the usual sense of the word, but that isn't explained.
I think one of the reasons parents in particular, get angry about the anthroposophists at their Steiner schools, is that there seems to be a concerted effort to keep Steiner's anthroposophical ideas and how they are used in the classroom, from parents.
I respect anyone to believe anything they like (strange anthroposophocical beliefs included, - the ones which are just strange, not the beliefs about incarnating into higher
But no one, however much they think their spiritual mission is above all else, no one has the right to inflict their beliefs on children without being honest and transparent about it. And that is what the schools do.
"Anthroposophy [...] evolved by drawing on other contemporaneous cultural and intellectual movements, such as eugenics ..."
Eugenics is "the study of, or belief in, the possibility of improving the qualities of the human species or a human population by such means as discouraging reproduction by persons having genetic defects or presumed to have inheritable undesirable traits (negative eugenics) or encouraging reproduction by persons presumed to have inheritable desirable traits (positive eugenics)."
In the view of anthroposophy, every human being possesses a healthy inner personality that is independent of our physical characteristics, including characteristics marking developmental or mental disability.
The Camphill movement was founded in the 1940s by the Austrian pediatrician Karl König near Aberdeen, Scotland with the establishment there of a small residential school for children with special needs. It was based on anthroposophy and Steiner's suggestions for a therapeutic education for children with such special needs, and he saw it as the the role of the school to recognize, nurture and educate this essential self of us as humans.
Anthroposophy did not evolve drawing on the contemporary cultural and intellectual movement of eugenics, but early, based on suggestions by Steiner, led to the development of therapeutic schools and homes for such children that later were viewed and treated the completely opposite way by the nazis.
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