School uniform

[Mumjane1971]

Dd14 and ds12 school wanted to change the uniform last year but got a 80%no vote including me. It just baffles me why the head thought there is a need to change uniform
Current uniform staying the same
School sweatshirt
School polo shirt
School trousers
Plain black school shoes plain plack trainers or plain black plimsolls as cheap alternative
No boots heels vans / converse trainers that arnt black
Proposed uniform
School blazer
School shirt and tie
Black trousers
Leather school shoes
No trainers heels boots vans or plimsolls

[MN164]

Proposed sounds like it would be "smarter" than the current.
Is that what the head was hoping for?

Of course smarter also means more expensive and less practical too.
Is that why you objected?

Are there issues at school with uniform?

[RiverTam]

Some schools have the misguided belief that the smarter the uniform the better, even though, as I understand it, there is no evidence to back up any claim that uniform improves children's outcomes.

I would object to the leather shoes bit.

[AmazonsForEver]

I don't see anything wrong with the proposed uniform, though I admit I thought it said leather trousers at first!

[AmazonsForEver]

Polo shirts are too casual for secondary school. They are sports wear.

[RiverTam]

Why? What on earth does it matter?

[Mumjane1971]

Shirts and blazers are to business like for me that's why I voted no think polo shirts and jumpers are smart enough

[Artandco]

The current uniform sounds like pre school uniform though. So compared to most other secondary's it looks immature

I think the blazer option is fine. Most schools want this as from 14/15 the do school work/ uni visits to places where they need to be wearing smart style anyway

My 4 year olds uniform is tie/ blazer style

[Mumjane1971]

Not where I live 2/4 schools wear polo and jumper and 1 of the 2 that wears tie and blazer might be going back to polo and jumper

[RiverTam]

No Blazers in my private school and we managed fine. Children in Blazers and ties is ludicrous, especially given the nonsense about them not being allowed to take them off in the hot weather.

I just don't understand uniform at all, this country seems to be enslaved to it.

[Mumjane1971]

I agree don't understand why some schools / heads insist on ties and blazers

[MidniteScribbler]

Why do you even care? It went to a vote, you voted no, so it's a non issue. Get over it.

[Bunbaker]

I don't think it affects outcomes at all. DD's school have been getting their knickers in a right old twist about skirt lengths and hauled about 100 girls (including DD) into the hall to be lectured about their skirts.

The problem is that knee length black skirts are as rare as hen's teeth if you are very slim.

Skirts in schoolwear shops are too short, unless you are a size 14/16 (DD is a size 8). Skirts in places like Next/New Look/M & S etc are too short or don't exist. If the school wants the girls to wear knee length skirts they should either provide them themselves or suggest outlets where they are available.

I finally found some on Amazon BTW.

None of the secondary schools in our LA have casual uniform any more.

[GnomeDePlume]

Congratulations on the 'no' vote.

I think that you are questioning why the change was even proposed?

IME there are a few things at play when a change in uniform proposed:

• a new head trying to look busy & 'in charge'
  
• a mistaken belief that uniform has impact on educational outcomes
  
• trying to create a fresh start for a declining school
  
  None of these things actually work. This article is interesting: Sutton Trust
  
  A polo shirt/sweatshirt uniform is actually fine if you look at the school activities (moving between lessons, art, technology, science lessons). A practical workwear type uniform makes total sense.

[Mumjane1971]

Thanks I agree polo and jumper is far more practical than tie and blazer glad most of the parents teachers and governors see it that way not just me

[MN164]

"Why do you even care? It went to a vote, you voted no, so it's a non issue. Get over it."

Such lovely people here .....

[MN164]

GnomeDePlume

"On reducing class sizes – “Overall the benefits are not particularly large or clear, until class size is reduced to under 20 or even below 15.”

On one-to-one tuition – “Pupils might improve by about 4 or 5 months during the programme, but costs are high as the support is intensive.”

That Sutton Trust report had a lot to say (other than about uniform)!

These two statements alone would be enough to light the fire under half the threads in the education boards.

[GnomeDePlume]

Exactly MN164, I think that it debunks an awful lot of educational myths.

Having read it and re-read it many times what stands out for me is that the thing that really matters is quick feedback.

If a school is not doing that then it should be wasting a nanosecond of time on what students are wearing other than making sure that they are dressed safely for the work being done.

Problem is that being on top of all feedback to students is just not exciting and glamourous enough. It doesnt create that nice photo for the school website/local press of students dressed in their smart new blazers.

I was thinking about this thread as I drove to work and looked at the students heading off to school. Blazers & ties were introduced a few years ago replacing the polo shirt/sweatshirt uniform. Do the students automatically look smart? No of course not, the blazers are now tatty, shirts hang out of trousers just as they always did.

[Mumjane1971]

Sweatshirts are more practicle and 1 of the other schools near where I live is converting to sweatshirts from blazers that why I didn't understand what the head teacher of my dd and ds school was thinking

[Mumjane1971]

I am grateful just don't understand why the head even thought about changing the uniform

[Mumjane1971]

He was the head who came up with this uniform policy a couple of years ago

[Mumjane1971]

It helps because I only have to buy £4 black lace up plimsolls 4 ds not £30 shoes etc

[Artandco]

But surely plimsoles are not suitable footwear to be wearing daily? They provide no support, and are useless in the rain, and thin and cold in winter

[GnomeDePlume]

But surely plimsoles are not suitable footwear to be wearing daily? They provide no support, and are useless in the rain, and thin and cold in winter

TBH seeing the shoes which are permitted at my DC's school and the shoes on the 'banned' list, the banned list shoes are actually the more sensible. In a toss up between permitted leather 'dolly' shoes and banned plimsolls I think that the plimsolls are far more sensible.

In my experience office type shoes just arent up to the rigors of the school day especially when students are walking a mile or so to school and playing football in the yard at lunchtime.

[Mumjane1971]

The school has always recommended them as a cheap alternitive to shoes my ds12 has worn them all year