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Is it easier for a Child to join the English system in Y5 or Y6?

(24 Posts)
scottishmerlottish Fri 19-Jun-15 11:59:41

My child has been in the Scottish system.
Repeated a year (age 5) so sitting one year 'out of age group'.

Now showing as dyslexic, dysgraphic, dyspraxic and anxious.

Not thriving in current system so considering move to English system in rural area with 3 tier system and small school.

Potential new head suggests he goes into his age group (he'd be oldest in year) but that would mean he had 'lost' a whole year between Scottish and English systems. He is already behind, due to the dyslexia and the fact he has been in a rubbish school in a rubbish system and his confidence is very low. Head feels that for him to join Y5 might be odd as he would be almost 2 years 'out' with some children (he is nearly as far 'out' in his class currently).

Am aware that he would have SATS (?) at end of Y6?
Are these brutal?
Also, he doesn't really cope with homework (current school basically don't bother...) and I am worried about this too.

I am reluctant to keep him where he is for a number of reasons so don't just want to hang around here BUT:

Would you:
push for Y5
hope for the best re SATS
delay for a year (just putting off the prob, imo?)

Owllady Fri 19-Jun-15 12:02:05

It depends where you live as a few areas are still three tier. In a three tier I would say either year would be fine.
In a two year, I'd personally say yr 5

ReallyTired Fri 19-Jun-15 12:06:46

In England there is usually very little choice about which year group a child goes into. I would be asking the head what he/she plans to do support your child. I am assume that he would be joining a middle school. I realise you said it will be a small middle school, but how small? Will there be any setting? If your son is taught at a level that is appriopiate for him then it should not matter if he is put into year 6.

Personally I would put in his correct year group and ask the school to put in extra support. SATs get very hyped up, but life does not come to an end if a child does not do well.

My DS with SENs is coming to the end of Year 6 in an English primary, so he will be moving onto secondary this year. He has really flourished in Year 6, they have had to work hard for the SATS, but the only children who appear to have endured any SATS-related stress are the very high performing ones who have been taking the Level 6 papers.

However. I'd be a little wary of a very small school, as it is harder to break into friendship groups when joining part-way through the year IMO, and it is possible that it won't be as easy to provide SEN support in such a small environment.

I would also look very carefully at senior schools in the new area if you are moving (or are you on the border?).

scottishmerlottish Fri 19-Jun-15 12:20:23

I think on balance I would prefer correct year group too (he is tall, deep voice, and 'stands out' with his current cohort).

But, am worried about 'losing' the Year from Scotland (I cant tell you what a bad school we are in atm) and the exams at the end of what would be his first year.

I don't want my experience to intrude but I remember failing the 11+ and we were just 'written off' at a rubbish Comp. I clawed my way back up but it took years and years and I didn't have dyslexia and dyspraxia to contend with, so it all makes me a bit twitchy.

scottishmerlottish Fri 19-Jun-15 12:22:42

WhoKnows - Yy re High Schools. Can I pm you pls? as I don't want to say exactly where I am?

What if we delayed for a year, so he went into Y7 next Sept?
(don't want to but house situation might force it?)

What happens if he 'misses' SATS?

ReallyTired Fri 19-Jun-15 12:28:11

English secondary schools tend make their own assessements and ignore primary school SATs for lots of reasons. Not all English primaries are good and secondary schools realise that SATs results don't always show a child's true potential. My son's school had classes in mixed ablity for the first half term to give everyone a chance. If your son misses SATs he would be in no different position to a private school child who transfers to the state sector.

I know they are hyped up, but primary school SATs really don't matter.

No problem, but I would say that I am a long way from the Scottish border, so no local knowledge here, and no experience of the three tier system.

I would also add that you may want to be thinking of applying for an EHCP in the English system (I think it's different in Scotland) and that it can be a very long process, in my experience 6 months minimum, can easily be 18 months. So it's best not to delay in that sense.

scottishmerlottish Fri 19-Jun-15 13:11:31

Ah, it's the 3 tier system that I'd be aiming for...

What is an EHCP please???

Owllady Fri 19-Jun-15 13:13:38

If you are anxious 're 11+ I would avoid a county with that system smile
I wouldn't worry 're sats

ReallyTired Fri 19-Jun-15 13:15:12

EHCP: education health care plan

England no longer has statements, instead the idea is that disabled children are given a pot of money hmm and their carers can decide what services to purchase. Being cynical its complex system and maybe the tory aim is to reduce the SEN budget.

Owllady Fri 19-Jun-15 13:15:21

So if you are moving to a county with lower, middle and upper you really don't worry with regard to sats or what year he goes in. They are reassessed for upper school at the end of year 8

Owllady Fri 19-Jun-15 13:18:25

They don't seem to be rushing to roll out the ECHP though. I'm coming from two different perspective as I have two NT children in the three tier system and one statemented (at 15) in a special school. There has been no rush to swap and this has been the experience of people I know too. It's all being done in stages.

scottishmerlottish Fri 19-Jun-15 13:55:47

Owllady - that is interesting, thanks! Are you in Northumberland, by chance, or down SouthWest way? (pm me if you'd rather not say here, sorry, don't mean to be nosey)

Really - yes, I can well imagine the aim is to reduce the budget. It is the same in Scotland, but with a different slant. Here they just don't assess kids as having SEN at all (unless it is really really gross) - saves loads of money but leaves loads of kids in horrible situations.

mrz Fri 19-Jun-15 17:11:04

Owl lady children with existing statements are slowly being converted to EHCPs but new children are awarded EHCPs in statutory assessment process.

SuffolkNWhat Fri 19-Jun-15 17:12:55

Which 3 tier system are you moving into? Y4-Y7 or Y5-Y8?

mrz Fri 19-Jun-15 17:14:25

Northumberland are gradually moving to a two tier system ...many middle schools have closed.

letsghostdance Fri 19-Jun-15 18:20:15

We don't have statements, we have staged plans which say what should be put in place for a child. Stage one is just to watch, maybe a wee issue at home, a little bit unsettled. A child might only be on a stage one plan for a month or they might be on it their whole time at school. Stage two is undergoing diagnosis, or possibly behaviour and one agency involvement. Stage three is multi agency involvement.

mrz Fri 19-Jun-15 18:36:14

We previously had similar
1 would be school monitoring
2 other agency involvement
3 statutory assessment

letsghostdance Fri 19-Jun-15 18:40:02

In Scotland an assessment could take place at any stage, but would be unlikely to be done on stage one.

mrz Fri 19-Jun-15 18:45:01

Statutory assessment is the process for awarding a Statement /EHCP

momtothree Fri 19-Jun-15 18:52:36

Hr should be in the correct year as they have to go to high school in the correct year. Also year 6 tends to have trips and cycling etc which he will miss .... not true of all schools so worth asking.

scottishmerlottish Fri 19-Jun-15 22:47:33

Sorry, going into Y6 or Y7 (depending re repeat year).

The issues are dyslexia, dysgraphia, dyspraxia and poss asd type social difficulties (well behaved but rigid about rules and gets bullied a lot)

mummytime Sun 21-Jun-15 10:04:14

I would just move him, ignore the year thing. Get him in his correct year group, and then push the school to support him and put the appropriate "accommodations" in place.

Lots of schools have children arrive with "no English" and a very very different education system. They often do very well.

Year 7 is nice as lots of children change at that age. My children all thrived at secondary school compared to primary - the routine and stricter rules often help children.

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