don't know what to do

[cheeryface]

have to send form in for ds1 secondary school choices on thursday and i actually don't rate any of the schools i have looked at.

i have looked at all the ones in my area.

it just brought back my own memories none of which i would want ds1 to experience. nothing terrible happened to me but i didn't enjoy it iyswim.

i guess it's a bit late but i am now even questioning the whole state school thing (have been on the steiner thread!)

but, i have to choose aaaaaaaaaargh

[fortyplus]

The Steiner thread is interesting, isn't it? What does ds1 think? My 2 are in yrs 7 & 8 and although I wasn't struck on local state schools, they were dead keen to go there and have been really happy and are doing well so far. Several of my friends have kids at local State Secondary (not the same one that mine go to) that only gets about 40% of pupils with 5 A-C GCSEs. My friends kids both got 12 each - 10 of which were As or As.
I was privately educated and I don't think I was any better off academically than any of my friends who went through the state system.
Send ds1 to whichever school he will be happiest at - especially if he will have a few friends there. If you can afford the private route you can always send him there at 13 if he's not getting on well in the state system - private schools invariably have places available at 13 after some of the kids have done their common entrance exam & moved elsewhere.

[HenniPenni]

Oh Cheeryface, we were in exactly the same situation last year, DD wasn't really happy at primary and the thought of secondary bought back some really horrid memories for me.

However, we bit the bullet (not that we had any choice) applied for the school that she wanted - not our first choice but it's her who's got to go there, and I can honestly say how much she is enjoying it! her confidence has improved enormously and academically she is doing very well.

The school that she attends was in special measures prior to her going but the alternative choice was a sports college-she is not at all sporty. The school is now out of special measures and has just put in a bid to become a science and arts centre of excellence. HTH

[cheeryface]

the school ds1 wants out of the 4 in the area seems like it has good teachers that are really trying to get down to the childrens level and are sort of all cool and trendy, but, i don't know if thats a good thing or not. it seems a bit run down and is in a rougher area than the others even though they are all fairly close proximity.

they have all visited this school from his primary a few times already (think it's a bit of bribery) and ds1 has taken a liking to one teacher and got himself a position as lighting assistant for their annual show.

but, the other schools have better results and facilities etc and might even be easier for him to get to.

i am worried anyway as he doesn't mix. he's quite a funny character. this is very difficult!

[Judy1234]

Pick the one in the better area may be with the best A level results.

[cheeryface]

.

[nearlythree]

Home ed?

[fortyplus]

Why are people so hung up on the school with the best academic results?
I've already told you about my friends whose kids went to the school with 'poor' results but they did brilliantly. Well - conversely my middle class, motivated brother bent over backwards to send his step daughter to an excellent selective school getting over 90% 5 A*-C GCSE's. She managed 3 - and that was with loads of expensive home tutoring.
You need to chat to other parents with kids at the various schools and try to determine which one has an ethos that will best suit your child.
Have you seen the schools working on a normal day - not just at the open evenings? That's what will give you a better idea of the atmosphere within the school.

[cheeryface]

last year i thought my cousin was crazy sending her child to the school that the child preferred, rather than the one my cousin thought was the best school with the best class of people attending and results.

now, i think i am about to do the same.
it's not the nicest looking school, in fact a bit scruffy, and the head has just resigned aaaaahhhh .. but ds1 seems to feel he fits there...
i haven't wrote it on the form yet, hope i don't make a big mistake.

[fortyplus]

Good for you cheeryface - we all want what's best for our little darlings but there are far too many control freaks out there (eg the walk to school thread)

[nearlythree]

Our local secondary school is one of the best in the country esp. for its A level position in the League tables. But we are trying to scrape the moeny together to send our dcs to a Quaker school even though it doesn't have such a good academic reputation. It seems that their reputation (ie league table position) is the only thing the state school cares about, whereas the other one takes a 'whole person' approach. People are coming from all over to get into catchment for the state school, but it doesn't feel right to us.

[Judy1234]

Lots of reasons you might pick the best results school and may be the best is that other parents also regard that as a good sign so the better parents with the nicer children probably go there. If a child isn't clever enough to get in then so be it. But results are a tiny part of why I picked our children's schools. I like schools that do a lot more than exam results for a child. Sadly I fear the state sector is going for a raw exam results thing that academic private schools veer away from, where the whole child, hobbies, experiences and social skills are very important too. I like them to speak properly as well.

[fortyplus]

'better parents' with 'nicer children' ho hum. I think I'm very motivated - we're reasonably well off and my children are well spoken and have good manners. Their secondary school happens to be the one with the 'best exam results locally, but there are still some right little thugs there. Funnily enough, that's just the way I like it - I want my kids to learn that not everyone is like them and they need to build relationships with all sections of society - that's what the real world is like. Their school has a more affluent catchment area than some of the others locally, and I know for a fact that lots of the middle class parents are paying for extra coaching outside school, so it's not necessarily the school that is achieving the results. Also... have you considered that some schools will not enter children for exans unless they are certain to pass - that keeps up the percentage of A*-C grades for the league tables.
My bil's daughter has just started at the very 'nice' St George's School in Harpenden - the uniform & kit costs about £400, which is a pretty underhanded way to keep out the 'ruffians' isn't it? Appearently they've just excluded 3 yr 10 girls and suspended several more (about 10 I think) for drug use. So our kids will encounter problems with the not so 'nice' kids anywhere - the important thing is to support them in dealing with it.

[nearlythree]

The 'best' schools tend to have the pushiest parents IME. Nightmare. And as dh and I are Eastenders our dcs pick up our way of talking as well as talking 'nicely'.

[fortyplus]

I CAN'T STAND pushy parents and promise faithfully that I'm not one. I suppose by talking 'nicely' I mean that mine talk standard English when visiting Grandparents, talking to teachers etc - when they're wiv dair mates fings slip a bit. I don't have a problem with accents apart from wincing if people say 'ain't'. Sorry if that offends anyone.

[nearlythree]

fortyplus, I wasn't getting at you, please don't think you have to explain yourself to me! I was shocked though once when having lunch with a friend I hadn't seen for a while who was talking about taking her dd out of nursery because a child there used slang. My dh is a proper cockney (my accent is less noticable as my parents went to grammar schools - I just have a bit of esturary in there) and dd1 used to say things like 'I'm going for a jimmy'. I find it funny and dh is good about correcting himself, but to think anyone would want to remove a child from nursery because of something like that is shocking. I really didn't know what to say to her. Presumably parents like us aren't 'nice'.

Actually I'm most schools' worst nightmare, I refuse to get dd1 to do her homework and don't give a stuff about SATS or league tables. Think I'm still stuck in my rebellious phase! I should home-ed but dd1 adores school and dh wants to give each of our dcs a go at it.

[miljee]

fortyplus, I'm with you! I like my kids (is that a bit chav??!lol!) to speak properly- or more to the point KNOW when it's appropriate to speak nicely and when it's OK to talk 'street' with their mates. As a parent you rarely get to hear the 'nice', you hopefully hear about it second hand from a school mate's mum! And I too am so fed up with this equating of A level results with 'good education' and 'better' parenting. I want 'appropriate' education for my boys. I want discipline, I want commitment and enthusiasm at all levels in the school. CAN this only be achieved where an 11+ has got the child into that school?

[miljee]

I must add that by speaking 'nicely' I don't mean rounded vowels or crisp 't's necessarily- I mean being able to find alternatives to the 'F' word in conversation, or not responding to every remark with "wotevah.."!

[nearlythree]

My children are all under five so have yet to encounter talking 'street' - now that I probably woudl have a problem with, but mainly because it strikes me as an attempt to look cool rather than actually being an expression of identity.

As for oexams being the best way to judge a school, forget it. We all know that the current exam system has been distorted - the poor kids seem to work so hard for qualifications that mean little. I have a great book called 'Guerilla Learning', it's a US book but you can get it from Amazon. It's written by home-ed experts for parents like me who have little faith in the system but who atm, have kids going through it. It's really opened my eyes to so many possibilities as to how I can improve my children's education, and says that we should see schools as only a small part of their learning.

[fortyplus]

nearlythree & miljee you sound like my sort of people!

[miljee]

nearlythree, thanks for the recommendation. I'll have a look at it! Isn't it sad how these days you're almost made to feel like a negligent parent if you don't regard schooling as purely the pursuit of results, results, results! I have a friend who put her yr 3 boy into an academic prep- and for 9,000 quid a year, SHE'S supervising an hour's homework, 20 mins spelling and 20 mins music practice per night! The child HATES it! Why, why, why? Will he REALLY thank his parents when, at 35 he's developing the same stress ulcers his father has in his hated high pressured, but never-home (but well paid...)job?! Makes me want to go build a teepee in the woods!

[cheeryface]

lol
feel o.k about my choice now as i aggree with lots that has been said and i will have a lookmat the recommended book, thanx

[fortyplus]

miljee I was sent to St Albans High School for Girls instead of going to local comp with all my friends. I didn't know a soul - in those days half the class had country estates so I felt like a pauper. Looking back I feel that we were encouraged to believe that we really were better than everyone else. Took me YEARS to get over it - I under achieved in exams and refused to go to University much to my Dad's disappointment - he was living his dreams through his children. So my 2 are very firmly in the State System unless I ever feel it's failing them