Why on earth would you go state if you could afford private?(1000 Posts)
This thread is for Maisie and happygardening . I like dares!
Naranji - I can never understand people who make the social mix argument.
Granted, parents with kids at private schools are all above a certain income level but DC1 and DC2 friends are Indians, Africans, Oriental (China, Japan and HK) Jewish and obviously Brits. DC3 is at a state primary where the kids are predominantly white MC. Hardly a 'social mix'.
seeker - given the number of posters who think you talk bollocks I'm surprised that you can spot an individual in the crowd
Like I said, from our initial exchange a few days ago I realised that engaging you is a waste of time but I couldn't resist. I will try harder next time.
Mine are all at a village primary in a very MC village - having looked at the private independents I would say that there would be hardly any difference in terms of social profile.
What I would buy and will buy when I eventually bite the bullet and send them independent is all the things the others have described; less carting around, less stressing about progress/levels or holes in their education, less of me being a pushy parent and more of a relaxed parent - can't wait....
Naranji - you put it much better than I did! Being at boarding school they have 2 hours per night homework (if they dont do it - its litter picking around the school and such like getting worse if repeated).
And yes, it is a little old fashioned, there are reports every half term with grades for all to see. Not for everyone but it suits us and has been the making of my son.
Only a few more to get to 1,000!
FWIW, plumbers earn a pretty decent amount of money.
And carpenters, too...
And as I said before, if you really make the most out what you've got, you canmake £££ being a hairdresser. I had a colleague once who went to private school, and his dad was a hairdresser (with no inheritance, may I add). So he obviously could afford it...
slip - I don't think that a red brick grad with a thick scouse accent called Shane is going to beat some Eton/Oxbridge grad called Angus to that coveted place on the admin trainee fast path stream that feeds into the upper eschelon the Foreign Service. But maybe I am naive despite my protestations.
Anyway, MN is full of people posting evidence of schemes meant to encourage more WC kids to apply to Oxbridge but hey ho, here we are discussing the reasons behind the bias towards MC privately educated kids.
If these schemes work then we wouldn't be having these discussions.
Summarising them to bollocks, Tiff!
exaggerated rolling of the eyes and a loud tut..... just for you.
Ah. You've changed your name, I see. What fun. Well, al least you're easy to spot . Oh, you do make interesting discussions boring.
With the private school kids I feel that I have bought time - no more driving the kids around to endless sports clubs as they do almost everything within school. No more having to supplement homework or worrying about them falling behind as the school is on that and as soon as grades start to slip they get extra help. Its fab I have to say. Its not perfect though, there isn't the social mix which is a shame, and it is old-fashioned sometimes.
... and before you twist it around and accuse me of looking down on WC people, I am summarising your views as opposed to endorsing it.
seeker - I told myself that engaging you is a waste of time but it's like a flame to a moth. I just can't resist .
You want your DCs to go to a MC GS school so you obviously know the answer to your surely question (and don't call me Shirley). I mean you complain that your DS isn't being challenged at his WC SM and that he is streets ahead of the other WC kids and that his equals are only to be found at the MC GS.
So <exaggerated rolling of the eyes plus loud tut!> by all present
I am sort of laid back but one of the things I feel I have brought is a school that will do some of the ground work for me.
I am not an expert in university destinations or work placements. I will need some guidance and the school assists with that
And the pushy parents in a middle class state school are infinitely worse than the parents I know at private school who seem MUCH more laid back!
I have two at private and one at state. The one at state primary is staying there because she is in a lovely class of kids and doing very well. The two at private are staying there because it is a lovely school and does the kind of sport that my two oldest excel at which does their confidence the world of good. Also its quite a geeky school where the girls stay less sophisticated for some time and I like that :-)
I am not that naive that I believe a posh accent doesnt help to land you a job in the Foreign and Commonwealth Office
I guess you haven't read the FCO diversity and access schemes, a small extract from which is copied below.
*In 2012 we significantly increased our work experience schemes, in order to meet our diversity and workforce objectives. Our 2012 programme featured the following schemes:
1.The FCOs Future Talent Scheme (FTS): a 4-week summer placement for 20 students (10 undergraduates studying economics or hard languages, and 10 female students)2.The Fast Stream Summer Diversity Internship Programme (SDIP): an award-winning work experience scheme targeting undergraduates from BME and low socio-economic backgrounds. The FCO hosted 9 SDIP interns for 6 weeks 3.The DWP/Job Centre Plus scheme for young jobseekers: the FCO offered 3 placements from this scheme
4.The Whitehall Social Mobility Internship Programme for college age (16-18) students from low socio-economic backgrounds: the FCO hosted 3 interns from this scheme for a period of two weeks over the summer
5.The DWP/Social Mobility Foundation scheme for Year 9 (13-14) students from low socio-economic backgrounds: a one-day programme which took place at the FCO over the summer
6.The BIS Graduate Talent Pool for recent graduates: we offered 41 interns 11-month placements across a range of FCO departments from October 20127.The Economics Unit scheme targeting Economics students: we offered 7 placements in 2012*
Around here (south Bucks) its the grammar school pupils who are really pushed. Lots of tutoring, pushy parents etc...
I think plumbers are wonderful people, they make you warm when it is cold. When water is leaking from somewhere they stop it! I try and ask them questions but what they do is literally magic. One showed me how to go to the front gardern and dig around in a hole to turn off the water for the whole house (we only have an inside tap for half the house - dont ask!). He also told me to keep the large key in a very visible place just in case it was needed.
And I go into London to get my hair cut. Its expensive but definitely worth it I believe. Based on what I paid £90 for a cut and blow dry that equates to over £700 per day.
he is pretty bright don't get wrong but no genius.
Since geniuses are pretty thin on the ground, Henry is perhaps representative of a lot of Oxbridge students from whichever school and sector. The stereotype of the over-pushed independently schooled Henry is paralleled by the stereotype of the maintained schooled Kevin who is overwhelmed and over-awed. Neither is representative of the majority of students although there will always be some young people who experience difficulties as they grow up and try to adapt.
Maisie, that's one thing we agree on - valuing technical skills/vocational skills etc.
Thing is, until we as a nation lose some of our age old snobbery and stop valuing academia more highly than other sectors of society, no one will want to go to technical college.
We need to get to a place where people don't say 'not everyone can be a banker/doctor etc' and start saying 'not everyone can be a plumber/teacher/engineer/craftsperson'.
Happy, sounds like you did your best at your ds's primary. I have had a very different experience, and my dds are hugely happy at their state primary - I know we are lucky. It's a shame you had a frustrating experience, but it is a question of critical mass: when there are enough people wanting positive change (that is, positive for most) then change is possible.
My point certainly isn't aimed at you as an individual
I have the Times University Guide and yes, it is interesting regarding the drop out rates. I think with Labour's view of everyone being able to go to univ was wrong. The mickey mouse degrees and the number of drop outs just confirm that uni is not for everyone.
Bring back technical colleges where a trade can be learnt. We will need the trades just as much as we need the academics. Not everyone can be a doctor or vet. But I would definitely be calling a plumber when there is water pouring through the ceiling.
Oh there's bound to be a few who go mad at uni for whatever reason, but most do just fine. The drop out rates from the most selective universities is pretty good. Better then from the less selective universities actually.
If the local state school is great why wouldnt you use it. However for some it isnt and they need a rethink.
One could move house of course and buy our way into a great catchment area which IMHO is the same as buying private. But moving house can be very expensive and with our buying system in this country it is a wonder any houses change hands!
Only a few more responses and we will get to 1000's. Wow. And I only made the comment which is the title of this thread in jest......
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