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"We need elitism in schools" Do you agree with Dave?

(205 Posts)
Pantone Fri 09-Sep-11 12:18:27

www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/8751220/David-Cameron-we-need-elitism-in-schools.html

What do you think of this?

Ormirian Fri 09-Sep-11 12:23:38

How odd.

IME no schools shun winners hmm Every school I know would be delighted to get a whole year full of As and A*s from their pupils. But recognising that some children won't be winners is simple common sense. And if you are a school with a mixture of abilities and potential, you can't simply disregard those who aren't destined for greatness.

Heap of soundbite bollocks if you ask me.

HandsOffOurLand Fri 09-Sep-11 12:24:12

I agree with him. The whole lowest common denominator thing is why people end up paying for school.

LorenSorensen Fri 09-Sep-11 12:26:07

One size fits all. Yeah, right Dave.

Cock.

Malcontentinthemiddle Fri 09-Sep-11 12:27:30

His kids are at state primary - does he think they're adopting a 'one size fits all' policy there? Because I'd be surprised if the evidence in front of his own stupid piggy little eyes didn't tell him otherwise.

Hullygully Fri 09-Sep-11 12:28:45

Quite right. We need an Empire too. That's where it all went wrong, when the demn woggies insisted on destroying our greatness.

<Stands up and bellows Rule Britannia all misty-eyed>

Maisiethemorningsidecat Fri 09-Sep-11 12:30:28

Seems like common sense to me.

Oh bugger it, I've tried to write a reasoned reply to this for the last 5 minutes, but can sum it up in one sentence.

"Its such meaningless bollocks I doubt even he knows what it means".

mrsruffallo Fri 09-Sep-11 12:37:47

I agree with him. The well behaved, hard working pupils should be the role models for the other kids at school. Instead, they are ignored and have to sit by and watch whilst the disruptive ones recieve a string of accolades for sitting still once in a while.

Malcontentinthemiddle Fri 09-Sep-11 12:38:31

That's just actually a pile of crap, mrsrufallo.

Ormirian Fri 09-Sep-11 12:40:33

mrsr - but most schools I know are not ruled by mobs of mini-thugs. In fact they are the exception to the rule and are usually sorted out fairly quickly. The well-behaved hard working kids are perfectly able to get on with it.

I think our Dave has been reading the Daily Mail grin

Ephiny Fri 09-Sep-11 12:42:35

Not sure whether I agree with him or not, as it sounds like a collection of meaningless soundbites and I'm not sure exactly what changes he's proposing.

I do wonder though when 'elitism' became a bad thing, it only ever seems to be used in a negative way these days, which is quite odd!

CrosswordAddict Fri 09-Sep-11 12:43:13

I agree with Handsoffourland No-one in their right mind would pay for education if they could get the same thing for free. That's just human nature and that's the way it is.
But if DC thinks education will make a difference to the rioters he might be barking up the wrong tree. After all, Charlie Gilmour had the best education money could buy but ... Another point is that many of the rioters were reasonably educated and not teenagers.
Don't think it's education so much as ethics, morals, code of behaviour or whatever and I don't know how you legislate for that. smile

Malcontentinthemiddle Fri 09-Sep-11 12:43:17

the well-behaved hardworking kids get credits/merits/commendations, and there is a definite reward structure in place for that in every school I know of. Similarly, bad behaviour (or even just not enough good behaviour) has clear results and sanctions and loses you privileges.

Only someone who had never been inside a school in the last 15 years would say that disruptive kids get accolades for sitting still, and that this is to the detriment of better behaved children.

Pantone Fri 09-Sep-11 12:43:34

I think I agree with him. I suppose I must do as I pay for my children's education wink BUT the thing I most love about the private school that my children attend is the BREADTH of education rather than the focus on academic results - all children are valued for what they can do REALLY well, that might be academically, but there are certificates and awards for endeavour, kindness, music, art, sport, languages, reading and even being tidy grin.

crazynanna Fri 09-Sep-11 12:44:49

I just saw him on the news,where it reports that if a child truants,the parent/s will have their benefit docked.

How is it that he thinks only children with non-working parents' are the ones that truant,and,if the parents' are working,how will he penalise them? Or is it just the poorer kids' families he will force to struggle financially?

It's scary the way he is whipping peoples' benefits away at the drop of a hat hmm

Ormirian Fri 09-Sep-11 12:46:16

Yes pantone, also at the state secondary school my eldest 2 go to.

mrsruffallo Fri 09-Sep-11 12:48:38

Malcontent, I have two children at school and the parents at my school would agree with me. Are you always so rude to people who disagree with you?

Malcontentinthemiddle Fri 09-Sep-11 12:49:08

And yet, Orm and pantone, ironically state schools also get slammed for rewarding things like tidiness. When they do it, it has to be because they won't praise academic achievement (except that they do), and are only willing to reward bland attributes like tidiness. Yet when a private school does it, it's because they care about the whole person and focus on each child as a positive person and bring out his or her strengths and all the rest of it.
Most unfair!

Malcontentinthemiddle Fri 09-Sep-11 12:50:08

I'm rude if people make stupid sweeping assertions which I know not to be based in fact. I suppose it just brings out the worst in me.

mrsruffallo Fri 09-Sep-11 12:51:39

I have never heard of any school being criticised for rewarding tidiness. Where are your children at school?

Malcontentinthemiddle Fri 09-Sep-11 12:53:00

What, you want city, area of country, what? To what end?

mrsruffallo Fri 09-Sep-11 12:55:12

I can assure you my statement is based in fact. How presumptiuos to suggest I am making this stuff up. You have no idea who I am or where my children go to school. I think you are the one making stupid sweeping statements.

chill1243 Fri 09-Sep-11 12:57:40

Dave Cameron is a professional headline grabber. He does opinion research and tries to ride populist bandwaggons.

The daftly named "free schools" are experimental. Dave C is opening one today. I am not still sure of how the Academies are progressing.

I was not academic at school. People say I am a university of life bloke.

"Prizes For ALL" was the title of a book written I believe by a Mail/femail
journalist.

I would have called my book on schooling "Rejection For None" I am not sure that David Cameron with his "elitist" talk today would agree with me.

Its a complexc subject and the PM is using it for trivial headlines.

mrsruffallo Fri 09-Sep-11 12:57:54

Any information would be interesting as you seem to think that your experiences are exactly the same in everyway as evrey school in the country.

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