Should final say be his or ours?

[mandylifeboats]

DS2, age 11, is moving up to secondary school next September, and looking forward to it.But.... his choice is between the local state comp (very good as they go) or the fab independant DS1 is at.Whilst he is not completely anti the latter, he is more for staying with his mates from primary.Academically would probably achieve more at independant but thats not the be all and end all, just want him to be happy and do his best. Have tried not to put too much pressure on, tho he knows we'd prefer him to go with DS1. Ultimately he has the power as could deliberately fail entrance exam, but think he's too nice to do that! Anyone else faced similar, and how did it go?

[Marina]

mandylifeboats, I think you have almost answered your own question where you say you want him to be happy. Is his overriding wish to go to the comp just because of his friends, or does he actively like the environment, facilities, teachers he met etc? Many children grow apart from primary transfer friends once in the bigger, very different secondary environment - do you think he has understood this as fully as a child can?
What made you NOT choose this school for ds1, out of interest? Was it because he didn't like it, or have you moved...? Has it improved lately (sounds very good).
Our ds is only six but I expect him to have a big say (within reason) as to where he goes at eleven - I think they have a right to. If your hunch is that your ds2 will do fine at the comp, and will be happiest there, and that the logistics will not totally do his parents' heads in, then let him go there.

[Blandmum]

Why does he think he will be happier in the comprehensive?

If it is because he will be with 'his mates' he may well be disapointed, as they may be in different forms and may not be together. They all make new friends quite quickly and that tends to happen withing the new forms IYSWIM.

Whilst I feel he has a right to a prefernce it is better if it is founded on fact, rather than wishful thinking.

[Kelly1978]

Hi, My parents supported my decision to go to a school that wasn't as good as the one they had hoped for me. It was for the same reason - I wanted to be with friends. I think it was hte wrond decision. I soon made new friends and didn't have so much to do witht he old ones, and I prob would have done a lot better had I gone to the better school. Your ds isn't totally against the independant, if it is the better school, go with it.

[homemama]

Mandy, Are there any boys in DS1's year who have younger siblings due to move up? If so, could you arrange a get together or something? Maybe he's worried about not having any friends and this could help that. Also, perhaps DS1 could have some mates round to wax lyrical about all the exciting things that await him.

Of course, if the comp has a good reputation and you're happy for him to go, then that's fine. Although remember the term times may well vary.

[mandylifeboats]

We have explained to DS that he won't be with his friends as he is at the moment, though they can choose 3 to be in tutor group with. Yr 7 intake is huge (270 in 10 forms) so lots of new friends to be made anyway, which is fine by him, he is very sociable. Also he knows 2 or 3 who will be at DS1's school next year so a few familiar faces there too. We actually moved to this catchment area to be near the comp 7 years ago, only sent DS1 to independant as he saw it, liked it and wanted it! Good decision tho, suits him to a t!

[Marina]

That is a very big intake mandy

[puddle]

I think as a parent you ought to have a more objective view of which of these schools would suit your ds than he is able to have. My sister had this situation with her ds and I think in the end his preference for one school did boil down to being with his friends and also not wanting to be different, rather than thinking about the schools themselves, their relative facilities, their strengths etc.

So my sister tried to discuss these things with him, taking the friends aspect out of the equation. She listened to his views and concerns but very very strongly steered him towards the school she preferred for him, making sure he was aware of all the good things about it - in the end he agreed and he has settled happily making new friends and doing very well. He still sees his primary school friends at the weekends by the way so they are not lost to him.

Don't know if this helps - of course your ds2 may be trying to forge his own path away from your ds1?

[frogs]

We are just doing secondary transfer with dd1. We have made it clear to her that, although we will take her opinions very seriously, in the end we will make the final decision, as I don't think 10yo are old enough to realise the full implications of the different choices. Clearly it would be pretty disastrous to force a child to go to a school they were completely opposed to. What I was aiming to do was to explain our reasoning to her with the intention of bringing her round to agreeing with our choices as far as possible. We also felt that choosing on the basis of friends from primary school was likely to be a red herring -- surely the whole point of going to secondary school is to branch out and meet new friends? Most secondaries aim to split up groups from the same primary anyway, as far as I can see.

In the end her preferences were pretty much in accordance with ours, so there was no problem (apart from getting into the schools!). But our choices were between different grammar schools with a good specialist comprehensive as second choice and a couple of private schools as backups (it's competitive here in London!).

I think the choice between a normal comprehensive and a private school is a more far-reaching choice, and in the end you are more likely to have a long-term overview of the implications than your ds is.

[mandylifeboats]

Another problem is timing- if offered a place at independant school (passed 10+ last yr so has provisional place already) need to accept in Feb, but don't get offer from comp till March.Also, if goes to independant and hates it, no hope of going to that comp later as v.v popular and oversubscribed. Basically, we don't want him to regret the decision when he is older and wiser, or to make a decision that he is not mature or objective enough to make at 11.

[mandylifeboats]

Frogs and puddle, feelings much with what you say. Have tried to emphasise good aspects of DS1s school, DS2 is familiar with it as visits often for open days etc, but also took him to comp open day to show both sides. Have been conscious not to 'put down' comp as if he does go there, will need a positive outlook from all of us to achieve the best. I do feel that we have the better grip on whats best for him as adults having researched both schools, but just want him to be happy. Why does it have to be so hard?!!

[puddle]

mandy - my sis did make clear to nephew which school she preferred and why, I think it helped him knowing that she favoured one for him over the other.

I do sympathise - luckily my ds is only year one so have a long time to go before this sort of dilemma faces me.

[grassland]

I would be wary of his preference if it's just about friends. As others have said, they make friends v. quickly in year 7. If you think the independent wouldn't suit him, then fine, but I think you have a perspective that he can't have at his age and I think it's part of being a parent to bring your experience to issues like this! My parents left me to make the decision at 11 and I think this was wrong. I wanted to stay with friends and I think it would have been better for me to go to another school.

[monstersmummy]

not read all threads(sorry i probably should) but what makes u think he will achieve more at a private school? he has equal opportunies to fail his exams at both schools.
NOT SAYING THAT HE WILL FAIL OF COURSE.
sorry caps

[albosmum]

My ds is 1 year younger - he wants to go to the non grammar - i have said he needs to pass the exam to have a choice! - if he passes the exam i will push him towards the grammar because i think it will better suit his abilities and he can see his mates at weekends. I think as the adult I will make the final decision.

Good luck - tell me how you get on

[skinnycow]

you should make hte final decision. He is after all a child and therefore has limited reasoning abilities - usually at this age wanting to go with friends. He will make new friends at the better school plus of course he will have his brother there anyway, making it easier all round. My dd went to an out of catchment school and was the only one from her old school but soon made new friends. Ds has recently moved (didnt really want to but managed to coerce him into seeing it my way). He's perfectly happy and has made new friends too.

[sunnydelight]

It's too important a decision to let your son make based on friendships alone. Friendships shift and change a lot in year 7, and in a big school it is quite possible that your son won't end up with the friends he wanted anyway. If you feel the school your older son is at has lots to offer, personally I would strongly push him in that direction. It would be nicer if he agreed with your decision, but not essential! At the end of the day you're the adult.

[IvortheEngine]

Ds moved up to secondary school last Sept. There was a choice of two schools, one Welsh medium and one English medium. He really wanted to go to the Welsh one as he finds working in Welsh easier than English and at the Welsh school the only lesson in English is English so to speak. We said that we would look at both schools and speak to his teacher. He worked very hard at his SATS and did pretty well. His teacher said that he'd be fine in both and both are very good schools but the Welsh one is much smaller. He chose the Welsh school and we agreed with his choice so he has gone there and is loving it. He is very much into Welsh culture things and is very well suited to the non academic opportunities there as well as the academic. Dd is close behind him and we've said that we'll look at both schools again and speak to the teacher. I'm sure she has the ability to do well in either. She really wants to go to the Welsh school even though most of her friends aren't going there. I agree when people say that children make new friends. Ds has lots of new friends and he's in a different class for each subject to most of his friends from primary school. HTH.

[roisin]

I've been gobsmacked this year when I've asked parents the reasons for their secondary school choices, and it has almost always been "because all his mates were going there and he liked the open day". My ds1 is only in yr4 but we have already made it clear to him that we will make the decision where he goes to secondary school, not him. Whilst (like Frogs) respecting and listening to his opinions and discussions, in reality it is our decision, not his. We have already started investigating the options; dh has been to two open evenings, and we will do at least two more next year. In yr6 ds1 will only be presented with options if we feel there are options, and he won't go to open evenings of schools we have already discounted.

[noddyholder]

We chose for ds although we manipulated things a bit to make it look like it was at least partially his decision.So glad we did now as all his friends who insisted they choose actually chose the other school where it has now emerged there is a serious discipline problem and they are all really disappointed.You know your own child and they are really too young to make these decisions IMO.

[jalopy]

Having gone through the secondary school process last year, I have to say that I believe wholeheartedly that it is the parent's decision.

[mummycan]

Although my situation is a bit different as DD is only in Year 1 I am moving her to an independent school. Lots of reasons but mainly it is avery good school, it will allow her to do alot of the things that she is interested in. She is an only child (not out of choice) and we can afford for one chikd to go private. She too sometimes says that she doesn't want to go and she will miss her friends. At first I was worrying about it but then I thought - hey I am the adult here and I am moving her in her best interests. As I say I know the situation is different as she is only 5 but just adding my tuppence worth. Also as a child I was desperate to go to the same school as my best friend but mum insisted I went to the school of her choice - thank goodness she did - all I would have done was follow around my best friend and mess around and probably be in a very diffeent place. Sorry didn't mean to hijack - will shut up now

[Blandmum]

and 10 year olds are amazingly bad at wanting things for all the wrong reasons. So we get kids not wanting to apply for the school because they didn't like the sports hall.

They also think that a performing arts school will all be like something out of 'Fame' and are a bit dischuffed when you point out that they will have to do all the other subjects as well. Budding footballers may well want to go to a sports collage, but in fact all schools will offer similar facilities.

[zippitippitoes]

I think it's definitely the adults' decision, tough but has to be done

one way of looking at it is that if you find it hard armed with careful research, life experience and adult powers of logic and reasoning isn't it impossible for a child of ten to make an informed decision?

Having the first child at independent school if the second doesbn't go there could be repercussions and resentment later

However, It depends on which school seems to mary up with the child best

[Blandmum]

Would you allow a child of 10 to choose their daily diet?

Would you allow them their choice of clothing?

Would you allow them to choose their bed time?

Should you allow them to pick their school.....