So I sold some coats... here's what occurred (minus the police bit)

[Corygal]

Evening all

1. Sold 6 coats and jerseys at auction, hence deliriously cheer for whole afternoon.
   
2. Coat 1 - buyer ran off without paying. Reading feedback reveals is serial non-payer. Ebay fails to take any action.
   
3. Coat 2 - ditto, but buyer then told me she will pay 'at some stage in the next fortnight'. No cash yet.
   
4. Coat 3 - buyer demanded I courier it overnight to her (complied). 10am next day get an email claiming it is 'worn and filthy' and demands refund. You can see the fact its unworn with labels in the pics, incidentally.
   
5. Coat 4 - buyer also demanded overnight delivery. 9am next morning sees the start of an abusive trail of emails claiming the jacket is 'ancient, smelly' etc etc. Again, you can see the unworn item with its tags in the pics. Insists on immediate refund, including heinous postage costs. Now is refusing to send it back and wants me to send a bike to collect it. She's in Oban. I live in central London, which she also mentioned.
   
6. Coat 5 - buyer paid after only 3 chasing emails. Now is demanding refund for leather scuffs, despite the fact its Allsaints and I drew attention to the hand-distressing in words and pictures.
   

Well, I should ask whether there's anything I can do, but the important point is that there isn't. Ebay won't force the buyer who ran off with the money and the coat, so I'll just sue Scammer 4.

[TheReturnOfBridezilla]

What a nightmare! I've sold a few bits and pieces now and then and have only had two awkward / idiot buyers but its put me off selling to be honest. I still buy a lot from eBay though.

[Corygal]

Oh, and scammer 5 is insisting on a return tonight, despite a) not mentioning actually returning this rather expensive, new All Saints Leather jacket and b) it only arriving this afternoon.

[BettyandDon]

Poor you there's a lot of scammers out there isn't there .

[fergoose]

ebay won't take any action against non payers unless you open unpaid item cases against them - then they will get a strike and you get your fvf refunded

you didn't refund buyer 4 before they returned the coat did you? If so you will never see the coat again, you should wait for the item to be returned before you refund - no exceptions

[Corygal]

I agree - being annoyed and out of pocket is bad enough, but being thieved from for over 300 quid is rather more than that, isn't it.

Of course, ebay effectively sanctions the actions of so many scammers. I am wondering idly when the police will tell them to get a grip, as it really can't be long now. And when the viable alternative site for sellers will take off, of course.

[fergoose]

£300? you refunded £300 and let them keep the coat??

[Corygal]

Buyer 4 told me she was returning the coat.....and was emailing me every -3 minutes or so demanding an instant bank transfer. As is buyer 5, right now...

[fergoose]

bank transfer?? - did they pay you by bank transfer or paypal - if paypal they can get another refund from you!

You must never, ever refund before the item has been returned to you. Threatening emails aside - sorry, but I don't think you can do anything now, except threaten small claims court

you must always refund via the way they paid too - if they paid by paypal you must refund their payment via paypal, if you refund via a different method they can still go to paypal and get another refund via paypal

[Corygal]

I refunded 120 on the assurance she was sending the coat, yes. (not all the loss was that coat.)'

Ebay were hilariously bad - I wouldn't be surprised if the operator was expecting a nice new jacket for Xmas. Operator just said 'We won't do anything'.

Luckily the court will take action, and buyer 4 paid from a business account.

[stillsmilingafteralltheseyears]

I don't understand why you would refund based on an 'assurance' alone?

[fergoose]

well - small claims is your only redress. You shouldn't have let the buyer bully you - no return = no refund.

so she paid you by bank transfer then?

[fergoose]

and I don't know what you expect ebay to do about it - they can't make the buyer return the item to you and they can't get her to give you back your money

[fergoose]

I agree stillsmiling - at best you have been very naive...

[BettyandDon]

I have sold a bit on eBay and the most recent impressions I have had of that site is that they are trying to wean off the non- business sellers (ie, joe bloggs, busy mum types). I just think soon all the stuff on there will be mass produced junk from China sold by 'businesses' that are making minimal profits by selling their worthless crap in reasonable volumes (I am thinking of the appalling quality window cleaning squeegee that I bought recently...).

I now prefer Etsy, Folksy, Amazon or Preloved for buying. If I am looking to sell I use Facebook, NCT sales, Gumtree or Netmums as its mainly kids things.

I would love to be a fly on the wall at one of eBays marketing meetings.

[PoppyWearer]

Oh my goodness, you poor thing!

I've sold a fair bit (lots of coats actually, have been on a quest for perfect coats and kissed a lot of "frogs" along the way, then sold them on!) on eBay but luckily only one or two issues.

Two non-payers recently were a bolt from the blue. So maybe it's getting worse?

[lisaro]

It's odd that a couple of people complained about the same thing, though. We're they filthy?

[Corygal]

Fergoose - blaming the victim isn't a defence for crime, in my view, and, luckily, that of the law.

Ebay could do a lot to get the item back - like what I'm doing, for a start. Even as an individual I can make an effort. This large firm could have a lot more clout. Despite their influence, vast profits and the ease with which they could pursue their users obeying the law, Ebay have proactively chosen to do nothing.

The organisation is sanctioning scammers on a huge scale. I appreciate doing this makes them money. But fergoose, ask yourself as long-term business plans go....?

Ebay now is just pickpocketing moved online - that's the site's one smart achievement.

[fergoose]

I am not blaming the victim!! - i do not understand what you expect ebay to do? I refuse to agree with you or give you any sympathy when quite frankly you have been stupid.

Anyway I am going to leave this thread now - I think ebay may not be for you. I think you were very foolish to refund a buyer before they returned the item to you. ebay is just a venue - you cannot blame them if you don't follow the rules - they will never make you refund a buyer without an item being returned.

[Corygal]

No, coats were boxfresh.

Yep, re business account - once she's got a CCJ (it's called something else in Scotland) it will be against her business, not her, which ain't funny. By the time I've sent a few emails, she will be another one who might find herself bemoaning the lack of an ebay procedure.

[Corygal]

You are blaming me, and calling me 'stupid' for acting in good faith makes me think our legal values are a little different.

Do you, by any chance, work for ebay?

[HarlettOScara]

Seems to me that you should be au fait with eBay policies and the procedures to protect yourself as a seller before you sell.

Yes, there are scammers a plenty in eBay but you have made it rather easy for them and they are excellent at spotting someone who's just ripe for the picking.

Good luck with seeking redress.

[alemci]

yes i have had a problem with a non payer this week. She has 100% good feedback even though people have left negative comments about her not paying. What is that about? You don't know what the customer is like.

package still sat here and have opened cases but why can't the person email me and say she doesn't want items.

still a bit puzzled Cory was this an auction online or a physical one. How could anyone run off with coat without paying? hope you get it all sorted out.

[ihearsounds]

erm so you didnt follow ebays advice - get item back and refund original cost, not the return post.. So now because the buyers are laughing all the way to the bank its ebay fault?
You gave bankers refund, not paypal?
Was the contact through ebay or private emails?

[ihearsounds]

oh and coat one, you sent that before recieving money?

[steppemum]

I'm afraid the only way to do ebay is to make them pay through paypal or pay on collection, and to make them pay for courier as part of price.
Then you have a no refunds policy, make that clear in the listing.

I am really sorry for you that you have been scammed, but I think there are ways to make ebay work for you, and ways for ebay ti be a nightmare

Hope you get some money/coats back