Have you ever heard this before?

[yawning801]

I've been told that it is a MASSIVE SIN to put a comma before or after the word "and". However, I'm struggling to follow this rule because there's only so many hyphens that you can put in a book without it looking silly! Is this BS or have you wise MN-writers heard this too?

[LucyPevensie671]

Never heard this before!! I would never put a comma after 'and' but I would definitely put one before. Who's told you this?

[Rainyboooooo]

This makes sense to me, why would you pause before or after an and?

[EggysMom]

I did this, and then I did that.

[Lozmatoz]

It’s BS. Have you got an example?

[MongerTruffle]

Compare:

1. I invited the ballerinas, Queen Elizabeth and Barack Obama to the party.
   

1. I invited the ballerinas, Queen Elizabeth, and Barack Obama to the party.
   

The Oxford comma can be used to avoid confusion.

By the way, hyphens are used in compound words eg:
daughter-in-law
Dashes are used instead of brackets or commas eg:
I went to the beach—it was very sunny that day.

[DubaiismyBlackpool]

I was told the same thing when I was at High School in the 1980’s.
My DC think I’m making it up, I’m relieved I’m not alone!

I don’t know if it really IS a heinous sin though, sorry.

[MongerTruffle]

You could also use a comma after the word 'and':

I liked the design of the car and, of course, its colour.

[SpareChangeDownTheSofa]

Recently graduated high school (within the past five or so years). We were taught never to use a comma after an and.

[BordersMumNow123]

It's a myth, you absolutely can, where appropriate, use a comma before and after 'and'! See attached from my nearest grammar book to hand

[BeyondThePage]

A man is painting a sign outside the Dog and Duck and the landlord comes out and says to him: ‘I’d like more space, please, between ‘dog’ and ‘and’, and ‘and’ and ‘duck’!’

just becomes a load of ands if there's no comma in there.

[HarrietVane99]

I was taught at primary school not to use a comma with 'and'. But it depends on what type of writing you're doing. What might be ok in fiction wouldn't necessarily be acceptable in academic writing.

there's only so many hyphens that you can put in a book without it looking silly!

Can you give an example of how you're doing this?

[IHeartKingThistle]

English teacher here.

Using a comma before 'and' used to be considered incorrect. I wasn't allowed to do it at school. It is absolutely acceptable now.

I don't know how you're using hyphens - do you mean dashes? You wouldn't really use those with an 'and' TBH. They don't do the same job as a comma.

[BordersMumNow123]

harrietvane you definitely put commas before and after 'and' within academic writing too. Actually, it's very common within that style. I have written and read a lot for academia. Academic writing actually contains lots of 'Oxford commas'

The pic I posted if from a grammar book aimed at all writing styles and not just creative. Rules are generally the same for all, apart from a few stylistic conventions. But generally grammar rules don't change for 'different' audiences. Correct grammar is always correct grammar

[yawning801]

Thank you everyone!