Anna Kreigel murder case

[Betaboo]

I guess we can't discuss the trial, but the details coming out from the evidence is sickening, the poor child's death was horrific ! Her poor parents knowing how their daughters final hours were full of such suffering and terror.

[beanaseireann]

Heartbreaking
What has happened in society?

[Bythebanksof]

In cases such as these I always wonder about the parents and families of the accused. I know if I believed my son had done something like that then I would not stand by him. It's awful.

Thank God for DNA evidence in these types of cases. It is so important, and is a relatively recent development in determining what happened.

[MargieMo]

Yes, DNA is so important today. My story (from many years ago) is in this article www.irishtimes.com/news/education/students-and-sexual-assault-we-had-sex-well-he-had-sex-1.3643631

If DNA evidence technology was available at the time, I would have reported, since (at it turned out much latter) there had been a whole series of incidents that college.

[beanaseireann]

MargieMo
I'm sorry that happened to you.
I hope you have been able to overcome that awful experience.

[RedForShort]

It's very hard to read about how she was treated before, let alone any thoughts of the day the boys (i think i have to say allededly) assaulted and murdered her.

[animaginativeusername]

The poor girl, heartbreaking to even comprehend something like this could be done by 'children'. Just monsters,

[Deadringer]

It's heartbreaking. Not excusing those monsters, but I have no doubt that violent and degrading porn featured somewhere in those boys' lives. I can't even imagine what her parents are feeling.

[Betaboo]

MargieMo, so sorry for what you went through, that is just shocking.

Poor Anna, horrible what the boys had to say about how people viewed her and how she was treated.

What I cannot understand is why with all the DNA evidence there is a not guilty plea, it must be torture for Anna's parents hearing all of that, and then the defence trying to deflect it by bringing up the silly things she did while she was struggling with being isolated and excluded.

[Betaboo]

Oh my word, the evidence just gets worse, if that is even possible. Todays reporting from the court is absolutely harrowing. .

[beanaseireann]

My heart goes out to her parents having to listen to all that sh*te .
It's beyond belief.
A local politician came knocking on my door asking had I any issues I'd like to talk about - I said "crime"
He asked me was there a problem
Jesus wept. The governing party are truly out of touch.

[Betaboo]

Apparently some of the evidence is so gruesome it is not being reported, how can it possibly be more gruesome than what is being reported..

[RedForShort]

I don't know, being on the jury will lead to a them lifetime exemption I'm sure. Hideous.

[Bythebanksof]

There are some comments above about conflicting statements in evidence. For a single individual, that is a bad thing in that it raises credibility issues for the jury (and perhaps the judge) with respect to the defendant.

However strange it may seem, there are also situations where conflicting evidence from multiple parties less to confusion, lack of clarity, and makes it very difficult to parse the evidence.

An example was the Belfast rape trial. ALL the defendants gave conflicting statements, and repeated conflicting statements in court. From my perspective it certainly made it much more difficult for the jury to figure out what happened.

[LastChanceFinalOffer]

That poor girl and her parents. I hope they get justice. My heart breaks for them.

[Betaboo]

Are the two accused on bail and living at home or are they in custody? Where do they actually put underage kids who are found guilty of serious crime? Do they then go to an adult prison when they turn 18.

It must be just awful for Anna's parents to see all the opportunities, that Boy B supposedly ignored, which could have saved Anna. Hard to believe that kids that age discuss killing people, and just totally mind blowing that they could go through with it. Poor Anna and her parents and brother. It is just unfathomable.

[LastChanceFinalOffer]

Afaik they are in a juvenile detention centre. I doubt they are at home. It's a difficult situation. They're safer locked up.

[DuchessOfBallybrack]

Awful awful, I agree, her parents must feel so sick listening to it all.
I agree it's so hard to comprehend that boys of that age would sit around planning to kill.

[CharityDingle]

I hope and pray that justice will be done. That poor child and her poor parents having to go through all of this while grieving their loss, in the most horrendous circumstances. Nothing will bring her back, may her gentle innocent soul rest in peace.
At least let them have the comfort, as little as it is, in the face of their terrible loss, of knowing that justice was done. I commend the gardai for their work in this case.

[Bythebanksof]

The use of CCTV and DNA are crucial in these types of cases. This type of technology was not readily available in the past. As in other countries, it is resulting in faster and fairer prosecution.

See this recent wonderful example
www.google.com/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/slawomir-gierlowski-man-found-guilty-of-attempted-rape-of-woman-in-dublin-4660763-May2019/%3famp=1

[Bythebanksof]

Of course I should add, I'm heartbroken for Ana family.

[Betaboo]

Defence making their arguments today, is Boy A's solicitor trying to opt for a manslaughter verdict?