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Do you know many people that will vote to keep the 8th?

(31 Posts)
BrandNewHouse Thu 12-Oct-17 00:33:25

I’m surprised how many keepers I know. God it makes me pessimistic for the referendum.

It amazes me that so so many people are comfortable with Irish women having access to the UK system, but don’t want them to have the same at home.

What about you guys?

OkPedro Thu 12-Oct-17 00:36:56

I don't know brand I'm wondering if we should wait for the older generation catholic hangover ones to die off sorry not sorry

A lot of people I've spoken to are undecided. They want to know what the 8th will be replaced with. There's so much misinformation and scaremongering from the anti side.

chipmonkey Thu 12-Oct-17 00:48:02

In my extended family, I think the generation before me who range in age from 63 upwards, with the exception of one or two aunts, will vote to keep it.
My generation, 48 and younger will mainly vote to repeal it.
Not all my kids or my siblings/cousins' kids are old enough to vote but all of them who are are voting repeal.
But I am not finding that many people in RL are discussing it. They are discussing it on Twitter etc but not in RL. I feel that people are afraid to have an open discussion in case it causes a row.

dementedfraggle Thu 12-Oct-17 01:13:09

I agree Chipmonkey.... I don't think people are having open conversations about this in RL. I'm also worried that we have a lot of people who are vehemently pro life , and won't admit it, except in the ballot box. It's a hugely contentious issue. Personally I want the 8th removed entirely & not repealed or replaced .....however I am genuinely fearful that the pro choice movement are vastly underestimating the sheer number of people who say they are pro choice but won't vote that way when it comes down to it.

Another thing I've noticed .... on any pro choice article online where there is a "comments" section, at least 90% of the comments are from men, and a huge amount of those are pro life? And the terms they use to describe women who want to access abortion are horrific! Has anyone else noticed this?

chipmonkey Thu 12-Oct-17 21:47:47

Oh God, yes, dementedfraggle. Huge number of horrible misogynists who think they should have a say in what goes on in a woman's uterus! And use horrible slut-shaming language.

OkPedro Fri 13-Oct-17 00:57:31

The men I have seen on line who are "pro life" I hate that term surely we are all pro life confused
are usually ime, older deluded and bored.
I always struggle to understand their point of view. I can understand people who are against abortion for themselves but would not deny a woman that choice

ThoseCowsAreFarAway Fri 13-Oct-17 07:31:37

A lot will depend on the wording of the referendum but I think my in laws will all vote against any possible introduction of abortion to this country. The same way they voted against same sex marriage. Rural area, decent people but lacking in understanding in anyone's life's but their own.

ThoseCowsAreFarAway Fri 13-Oct-17 07:36:43

Also I go to a few parent and baby groups and am shocked at some of the stuff that has popped up on my Facebook feed - I had to unfollow a Mum who I really liked as she kept putting up really graphic pro life stuff. I would never have thought she would have been like that from chatting to her. And I suppose the fact that I unfollowed her makes my Facebook feed a bit of 'an echo chamber' as I don't want to hear that side of it... I think they need to word the referendum very carefully.

TizzyDongue Fri 13-Oct-17 07:49:28

Mostly pro-choice. Small number of "prolife". Age profile of those I know thier opinion are 30-50.

Mind you I don't speak to many about it. Will assume my Pil will keep it.

The husband thinks abortion is terrible but doesn't think it's his place to judge others. Plus thinks as a man he couldn't have an true opinion.

I won't get a vote.

MarDhea Fri 13-Oct-17 11:15:54

Re comments on online articles, don't forget the ant-abortion brigade in Ireland are heavily dependent on big American "pro-life" organisations for both money and campaigning.

A lot of comments on IT and Indo pro-choice articles from users with names like SeanMurphy and CorkDad (making them up now) are actually written by Dwayne in Texas. There are also several anti-choice Twitter bots pretending to be Irish voters. It's a campaign tactic to normalise anti-choice rhetoric, to make undecided Irish voters think the anti-choice position is the silent majority, and to waste the time of pro-choice campaigners who try to engage them in reasoned argument. sadangry

Such people do exist in Ireland IRL, of course, but just not in the numbers and homogeneity that online comments or Twitter bots would suggest.

dementedfraggle Fri 13-Oct-17 11:37:25

MarDhea, I never considered that & can certainly see how that would be possible. I still think though that there is an alarming number of anti-choicers out there who are staying silent for the moment.

I heard a comment yesterday in my local shop ... 2 older gentlemen discussing the Ryanair debacle when one said it was karma as Ryanair have always facilitated the baby murderers! hmm

My family have banned me from answering the door in the run up to the referendum. I nearly lynched 2 Youth Defence idiots about 3 years ago smile And don't get me started on the Iona Institute

OkPedro Fri 13-Oct-17 13:25:01

demented I have never had the pleasure of a knock at my door from those types.. I really hope they come knocking soon!

dementedfraggle Fri 13-Oct-17 13:49:37

OkPedro it's great fun ! At least once per year, youth defence will come a calling & i love them dearly. I'm actually surprised I haven't been black listed yet and their members told to avoid my address at all costs.

I haven't had my besties from the Iona Institute in a while hmm so I'm really looking forward to welcoming them back

gabsdot Sat 14-Oct-17 17:06:52

I would consider myself compassionatly pro life. I don't really agree with abortion but I realise that it is the best option in some cases and I have no judgement to anyone who has gone down that road. It must be a difficult decision. I hate the kind of pro lifers who protest outside abortion clinics and who hand out horrible pictures on the high Street.
I'm a bit unsure as to how to vote. I think protection of the life of the unborn probably doesn't belong in the Constitution. It would be better dealt with in good legislation. But can we trust the powers that be to make good legislation.
Im going to see what the wording is before I fully decide.

honeyrider Sun 15-Oct-17 01:08:00

Fianna Fáil has passed a motion at its ardfheis opposing any effort to diminish the constitutional right to life of the unborn.

chipmonkey Sun 15-Oct-17 13:09:58

That is exactly what I would expect from Fianna Fáil.

TriJo Sun 15-Oct-17 22:57:06

FF continue to prove that they're first rate scum.

MIL is the only person I know who would probably vote to retain the 8th, pretty much everyone on my side is pro choice to at least some extent. I'm from a working class area in Dublin though.

dementedfraggle Fri 20-Oct-17 12:22:34

Just thought I’d share this .... this group of men, most of them over 60, canvassing on behalf of Pro Life groups, going door to door the other evening confused

AndrewJames Fri 20-Oct-17 12:28:07

I'm a bit unsure as to how to vote

How can you be?
Do you think women should have to die because a foetus is more important? If no, then repeal. It really is that simple. Women have DIED because of the 8th amendment, and not just one or two.
It's not just about abortion anyway, the 8th impacts on maternity care as well. Would you like to be held down by medical staff while they do a procedure on you against your will because it's better for the foetus? Would you like to have a missed miscarriage but be unable to have a d&c until you've had several scans weeks apart because there is a tiny chance someone made a mistake?

honeyrider Sun 22-Oct-17 23:19:36

Just when you think this vile excuse for a human couldn't sink any lower he still does. He really hates women.

www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/ronan-mullen-strongly-criticised-for-comments-on-savita-1.3262015

BrandNewHouse Mon 23-Oct-17 08:30:18

That comment is so disgusting. It is so unrepentantly vile. You have to have some fairly “unusual” thought processes to arrive at that comment, never mind to arrive at thinking it is OK to say it outside your head.

SocMcDuffin Wed 25-Oct-17 16:40:39

*I would consider myself compassionatly pro life. I don't really agree with abortion but I realise that it is the best option in some cases and I have no judgement to anyone who has gone down that road. It must be a difficult decision. I hate the kind of pro lifers who protest outside abortion clinics and who hand out horrible pictures on the high Street.
I'm a bit unsure as to how to vote.*

I'm pro-choice, having been a pro-lifer some years ago when I didnt fully understand the nuances of the situations. Even if I was still pro-life, I would be voting repeal and this is why:

It's not just about abortion. Because that amendment exists, it affects maternity care. It affects gynaecological health care. It affects women getting a HSG scan for pcos scarring for example. It prevents women from getting early pregnancy care to support their pregnancies. Because of the amendment, many services that are offered to pregnant women (who are not seeking a termination ) are not offered in many of our hospitals. They won't prescribe progesterone in some of the EPU clinics. They also don't offer tissue testing to women who miscarry. There's probably so many more areas of a woman's health care unrelated to termination where the amendment affects the service offered. They don't provide any services or treatment that could even lead to a situation where a woman might ask for a termination.

It affects our medical staff. They are working in a stupidly grey area. It's preventing them from offering the medical options to women that other women get (and yes, some including termination) in other countries.

It affects our women who can't bring their FFA babies home. The ones who have to get on a plane because the hospital up the road won't help her. It affects her when DPD or UPS or whoever turns up at her door a few months later with her much wanted & grieved-for baby's remains arrive in a jiffy bag at her door.

ForumUsername Wed 25-Oct-17 19:14:20

I am currently 28 weeks pregnant with a very much wanted baby and have seen how the 8th can/could affect my care

I think for this referendum the pro-choice side needs to be very level headed in its arguments and refrain from getting baited into insults and/or too heated discussions with pro-lifers.

It’s got the possibility of getting very nasty and think that the only way it can be repealed is if the pro-choice side stays respectful and sane

I know quite a few people who would be anti-abortion but who also don’t understand the implications of the 8th. When presented with facts like what @SocMcDuffin wrote they usually realise how uninformed they are and see why it needs to be repealed.

Some people really believe that life begins at conception and that it’s murder to terminate a pregnancy
When I have spoken to these people I usually just say I respect their beliefs but I do not think it’s right that their religious beliefs are written into law and affect people who do not believe them.

OnionShite Sat 28-Oct-17 18:07:24

English here with Irish roots and connections. I often wonder whether Irish pro lifers, either side of the border, understand that the 8th doesn't in any way stop Irish women having abortions. They still do, in their thousands each year, just a bit further on than they would've if they could do it locally. Which helps nobody. Except maybe Ryanair.

5 years today Savita.

MrsDustyBusty Sun 29-Oct-17 08:18:57

Why would they not understand that? It's very common knowledge. They are pro life, not actually stupid.

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