Christmas - am I missing the point?

[thisiswhoiam]

Like everyone I want the chance to celebrate a "normal" Christmas with my loved ones but obviously I do not want to give them Covid (or them to give to me).

What I can't understand is why the the whole country couldn't go into a hard core lockdown (a proper don't leave the house without paperwork version, rather than a UK wishy washy lockdown) from Friday 11 December until Christmas Day If we are not mixing this will have 2 benefits:

1. All Covid spread will be stopped because we are not mixing - benefits the UK as a whole.
   
   
2. At the end of these 2 weeks we can get together for a normalish Christmas with one or two other households safe in the knowledge none of us have Covid.
   
   
3. We can even go mad in the shops and hospitality 2 Dec - 10 Dec if we really need to to help the economy.
   
   What am I missing?

[TokyoSushi]

Sigh

[RedskyAtnight]

People crowding into shops and restaurants for such a short period will drive up transmission rates. And those people (if they need it) will need hospitalising around Christmas.
Businesses won't recoup 6 weeks missed revenue in 9 days; some of them will go out of business entirely.
A week missed of school (yes your 5 year old might only be making Christmas cards in the last week but my DC's secondary school will be doing normal curriculum work all week)
People won't stick to it (see thread about how you can't possibly restrict your child to the house for 14 days when they are self isolating).
Keyworkers still have to work.

[Sleazeyjet]

My dad is dying. Christmas is the last chance we have to get together.

Will I fuck not have him spend his last Christmas with his family.

[megletthesecond]

Because Johnson is incapable of making a sensible decision.
He'd rather deal with the mess in the new year. When he's probably handed his resignation in .

[TokyoSushi]

@RedskyAtnight

People crowding into shops and restaurants for such a short period will drive up transmission rates. And those people (if they need it) will need hospitalising around Christmas.
Businesses won't recoup 6 weeks missed revenue in 9 days; some of them will go out of business entirely.
A week missed of school (yes your 5 year old might only be making Christmas cards in the last week but my DC's secondary school will be doing normal curriculum work all week)
People won't stick to it (see thread about how you can't possibly restrict your child to the house for 14 days when they are self isolating).
Keyworkers still have to work.

Yes this is what I meant to write but I just can't take it anymore!

[Ponoka7]

This is a contagious virus. We will get it during Shopping and going out to said hospitality. Some will get it going to work, being at work, going to medical appointments etc.

If we have a shorter time to shop, we will all crowd and travel at the same time. During that full lock down people will die because of it, including children. The sacrifice isn't worth it. I'm in support of small gatherings at Christmas. We don't have anyone particularly vulnerable in our family and we otherwise stick to the rules.

[TokyoSushi]

I think every post on these Christmas threads needs to come with autotext saying: if you are single and legally entitled to be in a support bubble and if you/your relative is terminally ill and therefore exempt on medical grounds, then this does not apply to you

Yes I agree. I think I'll make a mental note to step away from these threads. It's clearly one of those subjects where nobody is going to agree.

[BerryTown]

@TokyoSushi

I think every post on these Christmas threads needs to come with autotext saying: if you are single and legally entitled to be in a support bubble and if you/your relative is terminally ill and therefore exempt on medical grounds, then this does not apply to you

Yes I agree. I think I'll make a mental note to step away from these threads. It's clearly one of those subjects where nobody is going to agree.

I agree - I only post because otherwise noisy people (and people posting on behalf of certain industries/lobby groups/unions) drown out the silent majority and give the wrong impression of what most people think .
But this is also why I can't even open school/coronavirus threads any more.
Anyway, the rest of my post was entirely misleading - I don't think I do agree with the OP after all and probably posted on the wrong thread by accident! So I asked for it to be removed

[Tfoot75]

Well your idea doesn't work for many reasons and would not result in lower cases than at the start of the 2 week period, because there are millions of people in the country who need to leave the house for essential reasons who would continue to catch it. How the hell do you propose everyone buys the food they need for the 5 day party for example?

I think the idea of the 25 day lockdown to make up for 5 days of socialising is just utter nonsense. People won't be going to work and won't be going to school over Christmas, and shops and many other places are closed over the 4 day Bank Holiday weekend. Surely this will offset against small groups socialising in homes and not create a massive spike?

[amicissimma]

Or you could just agree to do this among the group of people you intend to meet with at Christmas and leave other people to earn a living, educate their children, keep up social contacts vital to their wellbeing, look after the vulnerable, provide goods and services for those who are locked down, etc as they need.

@Sleazeyjet, a random MNer has just had her spirits lifted by your determination to hold onto your humanity. Thank you.

[Abendintheriver]

But not everyone can stay at home for two weeks, healthcare workers, essential shop staff, services still need to run so need staffing and that's just the start. How do these people guarantee they don't have covid?

[Sleazeyjet]

@amicissimma

Or you could just agree to do this among the group of people you intend to meet with at Christmas and leave other people to earn a living, educate their children, keep up social contacts vital to their wellbeing, look after the vulnerable, provide goods and services for those who are locked down, etc as they need.

*@Sleazeyjet*, a random MNer has just had her spirits lifted by your determination to hold onto your humanity. Thank you.

Thank you.

We’ve done what we can to minimise the risk.

My aunt has left her home and moved in with my cousin (who she was bubbled with) and me and my cousins are going tomorrow to bleach the house to within an inch of its life.

His grandchildren (one mine, one another family member’s) have self isolated in their university rooms for the past 2 weeks. The day 14 is today. They’re travelling tomorrow in one car - masked, one in the front. One in the back.

They will then isolated for 2 weeks from tomorrow night.

But apparently I’m a selfish bastard wanting to kill people. According to mumsnet.

[IceCreamAndCandyfloss]

Because people won’t stick to it. So many are out and about with children who are supposed to be isolating, popping for non essentials, seeing people despite lockdown etc. There will be lots who won’t want their children home earlier than the end of term either.

Plus a surge in pubs for those days will take a while for cases to drop so 14 days wouldn’t be enough.

I’d like a hard lockdown to drive cases down, not for socialising but so the NHS can treat other things bar covid.

[DivGirl]

I don’t think people who want this kind of lockdown really appreciate just how many people are involved in keeping the country going. Factory workers, shop workers, civil servants, entire hospitals full of staff, lorry drivers, petrol station workers, utility services workers, the emergency services, sparkies/plumbers, childcare workers, teachers, bus/train/taxi drivers, prison guards. That’s just off the top of my head.

You can’t stop “all covid spread” now. It’s just not going to happen.

And if one more person points out NZ I will go bananas! NZ are a tiny nation in the middle of nowhere with a landmass bigger than Britain, but a population smaller than Scotland. We have 60M+ extra people to clothe and feed and control in a smaller area, while being connected to our neighbours by road/rail, and whilst also being a major hub for transport, finance, and politics. We could never have managed what NZ did and to constantly compare the two is nuts.

[FundamentallyFucked]

What am I missing?

Money.

[Powerof4]

Two weeks wouldn't be enough to ensure it had been through a whole household.

Also, why should we all be put into a 'hard core lockdown' so some people can have a 'normal' Christmas, whatever that is? You say 'Like everyone'; I certainly don't want any more lockdowns of any type for the sake of relaxing rules for one or two days.

[BerryTown]

@Abendintheriver

But not everyone can stay at home for two weeks, healthcare workers, essential shop staff, services still need to run so need staffing and that's just the start. How do these people guarantee they don't have covid?

Yes, so much of the population is currently in 'essential' employment even in the current lockdown. So is a big extended-family Christmas going to be just for people who don't work in key services?

As I tried to say before, the PHE woman was wrong. I don't want to lockdown for 25 days to 'pay' for other people's 5 days of celebrating. My personal opinion so don't flame me.

I don't include single isolated people in support bubbles or the terminally ill in that BTW before anyone swears at me.

[Choirbells]

Agreed

[fizzyp0p]

Loved to stay at home for two weeks but I've got to go to work in order to live

[Jaxhog]

Because too many people just wouldn't follow the rules. Sadly.

[IceFrost]

People don’t want to stay in. They are fed up and don’t honestly care anymore.

That’s why. Everyone will do what they want anyway.

[ifonly4]

Shops and hospitality won't have taken on temps this year. Customers who really want to shop locally, will already be piling into shops for three weeks to find service is going to be very slow, so they'll be constant queuing and little distancing. Just to have a week, is going to make that even worse.

I'd rather be able to see the odd friend(s) for a walk/takeaway coffee outside now and have less contact at xmas.

[LuckyAmy1986]

What I can't understand is why the the whole country couldn't go into a hard core lockdown (a proper don't leave the house without paperwork version, rather than a UK wishy washy lockdown) from Friday 11 December until Christmas Day If we are not mixing this will have 2 benefits

The whole country? What everyone including keyworkers? .............

[Floralapron]

Who would police it?