Do all those who think we are entering lockdown because the Tories are incompetent...

(134 Posts)
BertieBloopsMum Mon 02-Nov-20 12:45:38

... also think the same thing about Macron and Merkle?

OP’s posts: |
TiersOfAClown Mon 02-Nov-20 13:03:52

No one can predict whether or not we'd have needed a 2nd (3rd, 4th, 5th) lockdown with someone else running the show. However, what is clear is that the government are continually handing out money and contracts to their mates, wives, brothers, etc in what must be the biggest round of corruption this country has seen - which is saying something.

Are they incompetent? Probably. Do they have all their greasy fingers in the tax money pot, helping themselves? Yes they do. Would the country have been financially in better shape to weather this storm if they were spending tax money (including appointing top jobs) wisely and through proper process? I think so.

StatisticalSense Mon 02-Nov-20 13:06:12

Unfortunately I think we can say with some degree of certainty that whoever was in charge cases would currently be rapidly rising as they are in the whole of Europe regardless of leadership and previous strategy.

Qasd Mon 02-Nov-20 13:07:55

Merkel is very much lockdown light and generally I do think she has done the best in Europe so far in handling this so I guess I think we could have avoided a bit if this if we had a slightly better administration but not completely.

I cannot work out what u think of macron’s response, loads of french mumsnet sell the praises of how sensible the french are handling this compared to the U.K. but it’s not really reflected in the figures.

MercyBooth Mon 02-Nov-20 13:21:25

Inbound travel being untouched tells me all i need to know

BertieBloopsMum Mon 02-Nov-20 16:00:31

StatisticalSense

Unfortunately I think we can say with some degree of certainty that whoever was in charge cases would currently be rapidly rising as they are in the whole of Europe regardless of leadership and previous strategy.

I agree. And yet, somehow, it's all Boris's fault in the UK.

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BertieBloopsMum Mon 02-Nov-20 16:03:27

Qasd

Merkel is very much lockdown light and generally I do think she has done the best in Europe so far in handling this so I guess I think we could have avoided a bit if this if we had a slightly better administration but not completely.

I cannot work out what u think of macron’s response, loads of french mumsnet sell the praises of how sensible the french are handling this compared to the U.K. but it’s not really reflected in the figures.

People may be calling it "lockdown light" but I can't see much difference between current German lockdown and England lockdown?

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Baaaahhhhh Mon 02-Nov-20 16:06:25

However, what is clear is that the government are continually handing out money and contracts to their mates, wives, brothers, etc in what must be the biggest round of corruption this country has seen - which is saying something.

This is a theme of MN threads, but is there any actual proof? Most of the major contracts have gone to existing governments contractors. It has always been so, there is a list of pre-approved contractors, which actually saves time and money when awarding contracts in emergencies. I am not arguing that Serco and co have done a good job, just that it is not unusual for the likes of McKinsey or Deloittes to do work on behalf of the government. They in turn contract out to many smaller consultancies, and you never, ever, hear of the good work they do, only the bad.

Bluntness100 Mon 02-Nov-20 16:06:27

Agree, and most of eu is now moving to a similar lock down. So I guess they are all incompetent,,,

MummyPop00 Mon 02-Nov-20 16:08:27

It’s tough & Im really not sure Labour would have been much better (if any better).

People love somebody to blame as it helps them to deal with a situation.

Looking at our comparable peers in Western Europe tells me we’re all slightly different variables of the same that’s all.

MarshaBradyo Mon 02-Nov-20 16:09:54

I think Merkel and Germany have handled it well but up to that level we are all in the same boat and getting hammered in Europe

Bamboo15 Mon 02-Nov-20 16:10:11

I think we should have locked down earlier on both occasions but I do accept it’s a very difficult situation to manage. The scientists did suggest lockdown in the 21st sept so I do think there is a level of incompetence in not following scientific guidance over something like this, especially when saying for months they would be lead by the science.

Baaaahhhhh Mon 02-Nov-20 16:10:20

Not only Macron and Merkel, but the leaders of Italy, Spain, Belgium, The Netherlands, Sweden, Slovakia, Czech Rep, Switzerland, Luxembourg, etc etc etc........ to a greater or lesser extent, we are all in the same merry-go-round of pandemic crises.

peakotter Mon 02-Nov-20 16:12:38

Unfortunately yes, I think Macron has also left it too late. Germany is doing much more like level 3 rather than full lockdown so not comparable. Belgium have made a complete mess of it.

In Scotland cases are at the same level they were 3 weeks ago. We’ve had much stronger rules in place from a lot earlier (no home visits for months). Level 3 over most of the population even if cases were only 70/100k. I am definitely not a SNP fan, but there were different ways to do this. I think the U.K. government left it all too late, like many others.

AlexaShutUp Mon 02-Nov-20 16:13:34

Germany has done a much better job of managing the virus than we have. 127 deaths per million people as opposed to our 687. They're clearly doing something better than we are!

JamieLeeCurtains Mon 02-Nov-20 16:15:54

I'm watched by Parliament Live, @BertieBloopsMum.

Johnson is getting a pasting from his own MPs for his dithering and prevaricating.

HTH.

JamieLeeCurtains Mon 02-Nov-20 16:16:50

Wow. That's my best autocorrect ever!

I'm watching 👀 !!

BertieBloopsMum Mon 02-Nov-20 16:18:26

It's easy for back benchers to moan and gripe - it's what they do.

I still don't see how Germany is lockdown "light" - its virtually identical to ours, and yet supposedly Merkel's been handling it all much better. Previous numbers do bear this out, but they're still locking down at the identical time to us.

OP’s posts: |
JamieLeeCurtains Mon 02-Nov-20 16:19:39

It's easy for back benchers to moan and gripe - it's what they do

Not like you then?

RedMarauder Mon 02-Nov-20 16:20:54

Macron admitted he made mistakes, Johnson refuses to. So while Macron may be equally incompetent in how late he acted unlike Johnson he isn't arrogant.

BefuddledPerson Mon 02-Nov-20 16:21:59

Macron made some similar errors especially unlocking quickly and locking down late.

Merkel/Germany in a much better state - not least due to having much higher hospital capacity.

Summerhillsquare Mon 02-Nov-20 16:22:24

It's not how often/hard/long restrictions are applied for, it's what you do with that time and what the results are

So far the UK has over 60,000 dead, and no functional testing, tracing or quarantine systems.

Put simply, other European countries are not in that level of mess.

MrsPernicious Mon 02-Nov-20 16:23:42

Having spent a lot of time in SE Asia at the beginning of the millennium, yep the Tories are incompetent and corrupt.

BefuddledPerson Mon 02-Nov-20 16:25:27

I still don't see how Germany is lockdown "light" - its virtually identical to ours, and yet supposedly Merkel's been handling it all much better. Previous numbers do bear this out, but they're still locking down at the identical time to us.

Germany might be locking down around the same time but much lower on their curve as yesterday they had 29 deaths.

Johnson has acted too late again.

JamieLeeCurtains Mon 02-Nov-20 16:26:11

Bloody hell, Johnson's so clueless he's answering questions from his own Party's Chairs of Select Committees with, 'err, umm, err, might I ask the err, honourable err gentleman umm err to go and have a look at the government website.'

It's cringe-making.

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