Can someone knowledgeable explain to me the risk...

[Bubblesbubblesmybubbles]

Firstly we have NOT broken lockdown once as I am a stickler for rules but I don't judge others unless I deem something stupid.....

Been reading the 'broken the lockdown' thread and I wondered can anyone explain to me what the risk is of visiting someone (whilst on your one walk), in their garden where they have left the gate open for you, taking you're own supplies, sitting say 4m apart, having a chat and leaving. Its against lockdown, yes, so we haven't and I will continue to be one who sticks to the rules but I actually can't see the risk. Loads of people have done it and it seems to be helping the mental health of others at (what i imagine to be) no risk of health issues.

As I have spotted people we know whilst on our walk and had a socially distanced chat which I'm guessing is allowed, or maybe not

[Bramblebear92]

I have no expertise, but I just wanted to say I think some of the rules are pretty arbitrary, to be honest. You can cram people into Tesco Metro, but National Trust Parks etc. MUST be closed. I get that one is essential and the other is not, but MH is a major issue.

I also dislike the no sunbathing/sitting on grass rule. If you're socially distancing and sitting alone, what is the big deal? I live in a flat alone in London and my MH has taken the biggest dive since lockdown. I know that being able to sit on our green and read a book for an hour or so a day would have done my physical and mental health a world of good. I have no garden so there's no option there.

I get that they need to be consistent, but some of the 'rules' are silly IMHO. As long as we're socially distancing and there's no increased risk, why should it matter?

[Bubblesbubblesmybubbles]

I did wonder if its a case of if they said you could do 'ABC' some idiots will break the rules and do 'XYZ' which is actually risky behaviour. By saying dont do 'ABC' despite it not being risky then if people break that rule thats actually OK.

As in some of the rules are stricter so people break the ones which are safe to break?!

I don't know but just pondering

[LittleFoxKit]

I also dislike the no sunbathing/sitting on grass rule. If you're socially distancing and sitting alone, what is the big deal? I live in a flat alone in London and my MH has taken the biggest dive since lockdown.

Firstly I feel your pain, I grew up in countryside but currently live in a city without an garden so am very much struggling not being able to sit outside. However, the reason you are not able to sit in public spaces is a logical one. Firstly if everyone in london who didnt have a garden but wanted to sit outside in the local greens and parks then it would be physically impossible to keep to social distancing. Secondly by sitting on benches it is possible to shed the virus and someone who then sits on it few minutes later could technically catch it. Thirdly by allowing people to sit in the greens/parks it will inevitably lead to people becoming complacent and not sticking to distancing rules. Finally it will inevitably lead to fights when some families and people find they are unable to find space to sit outside because all the available space is full, which means either people start getting closer and closer or people get angry at those who have sat outside for over a hour and inevitably fights break out because its "unfair" that they haven't been able to because there's no room. In my local city it would be even worse as there is only a tiny amount of green/outdoor space yet lots of people and families without gardens. I've seen people tucked away in all weird and random crevices while out exercising

[Bubblesbubblesmybubbles]

@Littlefoxkit yes thats why I've assumed those rules were brought in. Unless they marked out squares on the ground in the grass with paths through (which isn't achievable) then it would be insane on a sunny day

@Bramblebear92 i really feel for you, it must be so tough.

[JellyFishSquish]

I have had a garden visit while socially distancing as you describe, OP. It hurts nobody. The rules are arbitrary, a bit, but then they have to be easily spelled out and understood.

We talked sitting 3 meters apart, and repaired our sanity. No risk, much healing.

[TattyDevine]

To answer your question, there is no risk and you are spot on with the "if you can do abc they will do xyz" analogy

[Tangledyarn]

As above if people did follow that to the letter, there's no risk really, but people will naturally push slightly so if that had been 'allowed' people would have gone in the house, had a cuppa, sat closer together or for longer etc where there would be a risk.

[Bubblesbubblesmybubbles]

@JellyFishSquish I'm glad you got a visit which helped

@TattyDavine thank you. Thats what I thought and actually makes a lot of sense.

[AhComeOnNow]

It's because: how many of the garden visitors will just have to pop in to use the toilet. Then if x can walk to their parents/ friends for a garden visit, why can't I drive 15 minutes, but I'll need to stop for petrol, and some might break down and have to call someone out. And if they're sunbathing in the local park, I will... But we'll need public toilets to be open and cleaned regularly, and the litter collected and I'll need to pop into the local shop for some water... etc...etc...etc...

[heroku]

I agree. Absolutely minimal risk, it's just easier for the government to say "stay at home" than "you may visit a friend but only in their garden at minimum 2 metres apart, don't go through the house, bring your own wine". It's my dad's birthday next week and I'm thinking about surprising him by going through the back gate and having a socially distanced chat in the garden. I've not seen him since Feb and I really can't see what the danger is.

[Bubblesbubblesmybubbles]

So @Ahcomeonnow, the risk of doing it as I actually worded is nothing (OK unless you are there long enough to need a wee) but its people pushing it which cause the issue. So better to say no to it at all - makes a lot of sense

Thats fine, thats how I saw it. I'm no scientist/epidemiologist however I do love science so have been doing as much reading around it all as possible as I like understanding reasoning behind rules too.

[RedRiverShore]

The main risk is that you may be doing something that you might enjoy.

[Bol87]

There is no risk essentially. Or at worst, extremely small. It’s just against the rules of stay at home & no none essential journeys.

I actually think this will be one of the first things to be lifted. The govmt know people are doing this already & there is little risk. But it looks like they are giving us something to ease lockdown by saying you can now see friends & family outdoors & 2m apart. It’s one of the initial things Ireland can start to do & makes sense. So I’m expecting we’ll follow suit!

[Unravellingslowly]

I’m sure this neighbours daughter that felt the need to pop in, sit in the garden and sing happy birthday to their cancer suffering aged mother didn’t feel the harm. I winced when the loving daughter said she’s leave the cake she’d bought, that she had picked up in Tesco that morning, on the side.

I’m sure she thinks it’s fine, maybe it will be, but how will that daughter feel if it kills her mother?

[LilacTree1]

unravellingslowly PROMISE me you’ll never get in a car again.

[Newjez]

Listening to the new York governor, most people who caught it were staying at home. I'm guessing they caught it while food shopping.
I think garden visits should be fine, and hope they will be allowed next week.

[Bol87]

@Unravellingslowly - you cannot catch corona by just being outside. If you leave a decent gap, preferably a bit over 2m if you are going to chat I suppose & don’t cough or sneeze, you can’t physically pass on any germs!

The cake itself carries zero risk as the virus cannot be ingested via the stomach and any virus on the cake that might transfer to your hands would have died by the time you open the packet.

The packaging is more risky, should be washed if high risk. But even the most vulnerable need food. So either a loved one gets the shopping and drops it off or a supermarket delivery man. There’s not much difference, either poses a risk but gotta way 🤷🏼‍♀️

My mum is vulnerable, pretty high risk. She lives 10 mins walk away so I regularly stroll past on my walk and we chat from one end of the drive to the other. The virus could not possibly reach her from me!

[LilacTree1]

The 100 skittles example....what % of 100 Skittles would result in a coronavirus death..

I’m doing the figure off the top of my head but it’s not 3. I think in the UK, according to Professor Panic and his worst case melodrama it would be 0.0000000000012

If anyone cba to check, great.

[Cheekychops73]

@Unravellingslowly ffs seriously? I winced reading your sanctimonious shite.

[Wingedharpy]

I think your logic is spot on @Bubblesbubblesmybubbles.

Also, the issue that you do as you describe.
Neighbours see you and invite their 16 children round to theirs, none of whom take any of the precautions you have.

Easy to see why we all have to be treated the same.

PS. You could always pee behind a big bush in the garden 😊.

[LilacTree1]

Is the Skittles meme the sort of thing that does the rounds on Facebook?

As for pp whose friends are out drinking in the park, it’s fine, bit like being in Stockholm.

[NoSquirrels]

I’m sure this neighbours daughter that felt the need to pop in, sit in the garden and sing happy birthday to their cancer suffering aged mother didn’t feel the harm. I winced when the loving daughter said she’s leave the cake she’d bought, that she had picked up in Tesco that morning, on the side.

I drop off shopping to my ‘cancer-suffering’ mum. Last time I took it into the kitchen and put it on the side, because she wouldn’t be able to lift it otherwise. I also put on the kettle and made tea (tea tray already set out by her earlier) and carried that out to the garden. Washed hands, anti-bacced kettle etc.

If my dad had been there I wouldn't have gone in the house. But he’d driven 50+ miles away to the hospital to pick up her chemo injection, which she’s only allowed if her blood test (that the district nurse took the day before) comes back OK. It’s a short notice come & collect NOW summons so it’s impractical/impossible for anyone else to go. And no, it can’t be delivered.

So, on balance, my cancer-suffering mum is more likely to catch it from either my father via the hospital trip, or the district nurse, than from me dropping shopping & having a cup of tea in the garden well apart.

Nothing is ideal. Try not to wince. We’re all doing our best.

[PickAChew]

There is minimal risk in an appropriately distanced visit to someone and it has endless benefits to your mental health an theirs.

The problem with the national Trust properties is that the world and his wife were showing up.

[PickAChew]

Oh, a real, live dementor.

[wafflyversatile]

Probably very little risk. You would need to think about both of your risk profiles. And those of your households.

A friend caught it by visiting a friend and sitting in the garden what they felt was far enough away from each other. The friend works in a care home and tested positive then my friend also came down with it.