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TTC Super Ovulation part 3

(978 Posts)
Arianrhod Mon 08-Oct-12 08:30:07

Hey ladies -

There are a few of us who are ttc after mc's, however there will be ladies out there who are also ttc for the first time or second or third without success. If anyone is on, considering or had success on a super ovulation programme then do join us. How long did it take ? Did you try IUI with it.. ? Did you have PCOS?

Kicking this off and hoping some of you will join....

part 1 here:

Part 2 here:

Arianrhod Mon 15-Apr-13 20:23:04

Keeping a brief eye on the thread while I'm out of the country but 3G is playing up so can't often post. In a restaurant at the mo and using their wifi! Huge hugs to you brown, I understand exactly what you're saying. Take care of yourself xx

Very quickly but if anyone is interested I'll post my supplement list when I get back - I've detailed exactly what each supplement is supposed to help for too.

Catch up properly soon, love to all xx

Mel3062 Tue 16-Apr-13 04:17:01

Please ari that will be useful hoping your having a great time x

suemays Tue 16-Apr-13 14:36:52

I think we should also have a useful tips list too so not just supplements - such as using a hot water bottle during ovulation and avoiding certain herbs etc at different times of your cycle. The Zita West book has loads of tips so they might benefit everyone on here.

I have switched from pregnacare plus, vitd3, selenium and fish oils to vitafem, vitaboost and vital DHA as they have it all in plus extras like co Q10 and resevertrol. Stopped taking the steroids but still on aspirin and hydroxychloroquine.

Brown I remember hiding in the house before I had my termination as I was very obviously pregnant at 23 weeks and it was agony for strangers to ask me when I was due when I knew I wasn't going full term. It feels like the final insult to an already awful time. Look at me now though, ready to put myself through it all again when I felt like my whole world had ended. Time really does heal although it won't feel like it in the early stages.

I think your mind copes with tragedies by telling you that you didnt really want it anyway as I had exactly the same thoughts as you when I knew the pregnancy was doomed. Dont feel bad about being relieved as I can relate to exactly how you feel. You will have good and bad days. I am now almost telling myself that I have had my lucky chances almost as if I am willing some miracle to prove me wrong.

Trying to prepare my body for IVF now by doing a 4 day detox this week and then making sure I get early nights and not googling every evening!

Mel3062 Wed 17-Apr-13 09:27:37

Thinking of you brown x
Sue best of luck x

suemays Wed 17-Apr-13 21:01:25

Does anyone know what complex NK cells are? They are on Mr Shehata's website on the treatment programmes. I find their website very slow so can't get on to the specifics of the plan. Was curious to know whether it differs from the very high killer cell plan which I am on.

Mel3062 Thu 18-Apr-13 03:33:32

Interesting I've had a look because its 3.30 am and steroids and the wind are keeping me up!! Complex looks identical to what was the very high treatment. Very high now says to increase pred to 40 and wean off them at 9 weeks!vitamin d is upped to 2000. I wonder if I need to up my dose to 40 now then...umm. X

lemonsherbet Thu 18-Apr-13 16:54:30

I have to ask what is the difference between complex NK and very high NK cells?

Mel3062 Thu 18-Apr-13 18:16:18

I'm just assuming they've changed opinion depending on results but that's the treatment plans on the web! X

brownstag Fri 19-Apr-13 11:18:47

Thanks Sue and Mel; I really appreciate it.
Maybe they are now called complex because you can have normal levels of natural killer cells but high activation, as my friend LJ has. She was on that treatment programme. Whereas I have high levels but with normal activation.

brownstag Fri 19-Apr-13 11:19:22

And Ari! xx

Mel3062 Fri 19-Apr-13 12:55:45

Apparently my activation is 1.6 whereas 1.8 is very high x

suemays Sat 20-Apr-13 09:58:32

Is the treatment not the same though?!

Mel3062 Sat 20-Apr-13 12:12:20

t. Very high now says to increase pred to 40 so thats the same but wean off them at 9 weeks! I'm still on the high plan 25 as activation isn't that bad apparently x

lemonsherbet Sat 20-Apr-13 13:21:27

what I do not get is it says high, complex or very high NK cells suggesting there must be a difference between these groups

Mel3062 Sun 21-Apr-13 06:07:44

They all sound similar apart from slight increase in pred or early weaning off pred or an extra intralipid!! I think it just depends on your level under what catergory you are but it seems a lot more confusing!
Where is everyone? I'm missing you all! Enjoying the sun I hope x

ChoccyPud Sun 21-Apr-13 15:58:50

Hi all. I know this is a bit lazy, but I'm posting this here as well as the Pred thread, as I know not all of you hang out there any more, and I want to maximise my audience. smile

Apologies in advance for what will be a bit of a me-rant...

I've always got pg the first or second month or trying, not that that's done me any good, obv, aside from leading to me and dh joking that we can turn round a pg in 3 months from ttc to mc. Not any more it seems - AF arrived today with a vengeance and cramping worse than a mc, which is most unusual for me. Normally I'm 28 days, regular as clockwork and don't get painful periods. Had a positive ov stick last month, but no smiley ov stick this month. After 7 mc's, the bleeding of the last of which lasted for over a month, and cycles of 29, 27, and 25(!) days the last three months, I'm beginning to wonder what's changed...

I'm aware this will sound insensitive to those who have difficulty getting off the starting line, but irregular periods and possibly not ovulating is a whole new experience for me. I'm left wondering if all the drugs and failed pg's have left a mark, or nature is breaking something gently to me. I'm also aware that although this is different for me, it's by no means unusual to take six-plus months to conceive so its not like there's anything "legitimate" to worry about yet. And there is a good dose of pmt grr, hopelessness and frustration mixed in today as you can imagine!

On the upside I'm opening a guilt-free can of Guinness when I've typed this (plenty of iron you know, and tastier than Floradix). If anyone has any suggestions or thoughts, I'd be grateful. This can include shouts of "pull yourself together woman before I hit you with a wet fish"!

Waves to all - thanks for any and all thoughts

Mel3062 Sun 21-Apr-13 16:26:17

Choccy if you can't have a me rant here where can you?! No advice but I'm sorry you're feeling like this and hope you're enjoying your drink! I'm sure steroids must play havoc with cycles as they have mine. I too was 28 days regular but I've had bizarre 50 day ones since the pred! Hugs x

Arianrhod Mon 22-Apr-13 08:33:31

Hiya ladies .. choccy I've replied to you on the pred thread, not that I think I've been much help hmm

Interesting to hear Mr S is now differentiating between high levels of NK cells and high activation. I have both, so guess I'd still be on the 'very high' programme. Once I've managed to catch up with everything I'll go and have a nosy on the website to see what the differences are.

Back from both the Canaries and Greece, some thieving scumbag nicked my purse out of my rucksack while on the Metro in Athens, so at the moment Athens isn't my favourite place in the world! Very interesting meetings with Penny and interesting outcome (well, interesting for us smile ), tell me if you want me to bore you all about it smile

/waves to everyone

duggs1976 Mon 22-Apr-13 13:53:33

Totally interested to hear ! I'm sure everyone on here is?? Is all new territory for us so any new info esp in this area is precious. Understand if you'd prefer to keep off the web and just pm but either way I'm v interested ...

Arianrhod Mon 22-Apr-13 14:45:46

No, not at all, I just didn't want to bore anyone smile I understand my case might be a bit different as our problems seem to be almost completely down to the 100% DQa match between me and OH, but there might be something of some use/interest to others in what's come out of it.

For a start, Penny and her staff were wonderful, they all really seem to genuinely care about you as a person and about getting you a baby. Penny is also very willing to discuss options - rather than the standard consultant approach of 'my word is law' that seems to be the case over here, she asks how you feel about things as she suggests options and is very willing to explain and consider anything you might query or suggest yourself.

Anyway. She did an aquascan and immediately said that I definitely did need an hysteroscopy - and she showed me why, my uterus was full of scar tissue/dead cells. She said the lining was 'nice and thick' but that it appeared to be quite a lot of scar tissue (and I could see it on the screen), and that if I didn't have it all cut away nothing would be able to implant. She also said that this is almost certainly why my AF bleeding has changed - she doesn't for a second consider it's an age/perimenopausal thing as has been suggested elsewhere. She also scanned my ovaries and said they are 'very productive'. Not that that matters in this case, as we're using DE, but it does mean that I wasn't entirely on the fertility scrapheap as I'd thought!

She's said we are an 'interesting case' due to the 100% DQa match, which is apparently quite rare, and brought in her head of immunology to meet us as we will also be working with him. It is apparent that due to this match we had virtually no chance of having a baby that is my eggs & OH's sperm, as even with medication my immune system would just respond too strongly to kill it off - which explains why, after my first MC on Mr Shehata's protocol and even while still taking 40mg pred, the NK cell retest Mr S did showed my total NK cell count sky-high.

Penny wants to throw everything possible at this, as her aim is for this to be our final attempt (which is just as well, as no way we could afford another!). She apparently works with Dr Gorgy at times, although she feels he can be quite negative! She has prescribed neupogen for us as per Dr Braverman's successes in using this in DQ matches, along with intralipids (starting before egg transfer, not from BFP), 10mg pred, clexane, and LIT. We started with paternal LIT as she wants to see if that provokes any kind of antibody response, but we're not expecting it will, at which point we will use either pool LIT (paternal plus white blood cells from my donor) or just LIT from my donor. She has told me I am going to have to have several LIT transfusions - sigh, more £ on airfare - although how I'm going to get the days off work to go out there several times I really don't know yet! So I had the first LIT transfusion (ouch!) while still at Serum on Saturday, and will have the next when I go out for ET.

Penny wants to start this straighaway but we have to wait for AF to show following the hysteroscopy last Fri. I'm due my AF on Wed, but don't know if the hysto will delay things. Penny did a downreg shot on me on Friday, so I assume she doesn't think it will be long.

As for the hysto itself - well apart from the fact that the Greek hospital was efficiency itself; the staff all very friendly and helpful, the procedure quick - I was in at 7am and out by 10:30am, had absolutely no aching or cramping (I did after my hysto at NLC last August) and stopped bleeding within 2 days (took 6 days last Aug). You get a DVD of your procedure (yes, really!) which I then took to Serum for Penny to watch. She showed me the scar tissue as they were cutting it away and the cuts they make to the endometrium. Not something I ever wanted to see, but still! She also showed me clear indication that the 'hidden' chlamydia we were treated for last July is still there, and OH and I are now going through the 25-day course of anti-bs again (nice sad ). What I want to know is, how come my hysto at NLC didn't see this scar tissue? Although I have read many ladies say that their various UK clinics have missed this - Penny said very often they just don't know what they're looking at. Which is a bit worrying in itself!

So ... we have a plan, and a much, much emptier bank account sad ... will it work? Who knows, but we have to give it a try for closure, if nothing else. Not sure about exact timings, although when I told Penny we were away the second week of July for two weeks she calmly stated 'you'll be pregnant by then' .. ! Wish I could share her optimism, but we'll see what happens.

Hope I haven't bored you all too much!

Mel3062 Mon 22-Apr-13 16:27:08

Wow that's so positive fingers crossed!!! Sorry to hear about your purse though :/

Arianrhod Mon 22-Apr-13 16:43:46

I hope so, thanks Mel. And my lovely mother has told me to just go ahead and spend whatever we need to, bless her heart.

duggs1976 Mon 22-Apr-13 17:40:39

Wowzers Ari! What a lot to take in. You can def say you are giving it your best shot. I'm very interested in your journey so pls do keep us updated. I like the no hanging around approach. Best of luck gringringrin

Breezyweezy Mon 22-Apr-13 18:08:25

Interesting talk on here on Mr S's new complex Nk cell plan. I hadn't been on his site for ages so didn't realise there was this new category. I am also interested in the 50microg dose of Vit D3 as my sheet I got from him over 18 months ago only said 25microg. I take the 25microg when I remember as my attitude to supplements has become a little lax lately!

Brown thinking of you and hope you are well.

Choccy I am probably not the best person to give you advice on changes to AF. Like you, I used to be bang on 28 days, textbook and could even know exactly what time of day AF would start. That was up until my last pg and mc, mc3. Since then cycles have been anywhere from 23-31 days, with the most consistent being around 24-26 days. I know I ov due to temping, so they are not annovulatory cycles. I just thought that it was one of those things that happened after a mc. Mr S didn't seem bothered by the shortening of my cycles at all, but the NHS fertility consultant I saw in Feb said it was an indicator that I was becoming pei-menopausal, backed up by my crap AMH levels. It was the first I had heard of it so did some Dr Googling when I got home and there seemed to be an indication that this could be the case. I always assumed that you would get longer cycles than shorter ones when perimenopausal. Anyway, who knows, I still don't have confidence in the AMH test as my level doesn't correspond with my antral follicle count and my FSH level is perfectly normal. Not saying this could be the case with you. Like others have said, it could be the pred playing havoc. I can imagine it must be extra annoying when you have got pg so quickly in the past.

Wow Ari Serum sounds absolutely fantastic and so thorough. Do you know I am actually loving the idea of a DVD of your hysto? I asked them to show me pics after mine when they removed my septum and they were amazing, but a video would have been much better!! Penny sounds so positive and I love her comment that she is confident you will be pg by July. I know we will all be crossing our fingers on here for you! Fantastic as well that your Mum is being so supportive.

Sue how did the detox go?

Waves to all!

Pebbles73 Mon 22-Apr-13 18:21:06

Wow Ari Serum sounds amazing!! So were you booked in for the hysto before you went or did you have it booked before? Also can I ask exactly what the aqua scan involves? It's great that they tailor the treatment do individually and please post all your info as I am v interested to hear. smile

Interesting that the scar tissue hasn't been picked up, makes you wonder what else gets missed!!

If only they were in the uk.... Thinking I should seriously consider them but only have about four/five days holiday to take.

Hope things are going ok with you Brown and that you are not suffering to much. Hope things move along quickly for you so you can start to recover mentally and physically.

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