normal 4 year old behavior or adhd?

[likecherrycola]

hi i will try keep this short , my dd has always been hyper , things like running around in circles for no appart reason a few times a day , constant talking, not listening, hates waiting her turn, has terrible tantrums if something isnt going her way , lashing out, not sleeping shes on the go from minute she wakes up till she falls asleepwhich can be as late as 12 regardless of how early shes up , sleeping is a nightmare. now she has started refusing to wear shoes ,or any tops other than a certain short sleeved one. All these things i put down to being a hyper 4 year old but a family friend has said she think she displays symptoms of adhd , are these "normal" ?

[olivo]

I would say normal, but I am no expert. My 6 year old does many of those things ........

[TreadOnTheCracks]

Does she go to school or nursery? Have they ever mentioned anything? If you are worried I would say seek some advice, perhaps start with the school or health visitor.

Hope someone more knowledgeable is along soon.

[likecherrycola]

thanks both of you's
she goes to nursery and they have mentioned that she has problems sharing waiting her turn ,being bossy and not sitting still for story time /snack and lashing out. But not in a way that concerened me iykwim just said in passing. Have doctors appointment on thursday about her feet so will inquire then , the shoe and sock thing is driving me mad she hasent left the house in two weeks :0 because shoes and socks "hurt" but she is fine running about ALL day , shes our first and only child and niether of us has vast experience of childrens behaviour but compared to nursery friends and our nieces,/nephews she is different.
thanks again for reading and replying.

[olivo]

The clothes and shoes thing really rings a bell. My DD, now 6, has a real sensitivity issue with seams, materials etc. she will to wear tights, jeans, we had a long period where she kicked off over shoes and socks as they 'hurt' her, same with certain items of school uniform. She seems to have grown out of it, although she nearly always just wears long sleeved T-shirts and leggings.

Good luck, hope the dr gives you some answers or reassurance.

[littlemiss06]

The shoes and socks hurt, do you mean as in they dont feel right on her feet? My little girl is currently undergoing assessments shes almost 7, shes very hyper, demanding, she has problems in school with learning, shes very behind, but by far our biggest problem is her clothes, she struggles so much and its not her being a pain or fussy, she simply cant bear the feel of certain things socks and shoes do cause a lot of issues, she doesnt like bumps, they have to feel tight on her, they have to touch her 'right' not move etc so many different things that shes limited to a few items that shes comfortable in, its a sensory processing issue and the hyper side of things can also come in to this sensory processing, they can seek out so much that it can come across as behaviour problems however it can also be linked to to things like autism, adhd or in my adopted daughters case its looking very much like foetal alcohol syndrome. If you feel concerned about her then ask for a referral to camhs or a paediatrician

[AugustMoon]

My DS (9) has mild to moderate ADHD diagnosed a couple of years ago and, yes, what you describe is typical for him. As other poster said the tactile sensitivity to clothes (socks and t-shirt seams being the main problem) is true for him too. Also, difficulty waiting turns is also true for sufferers of ADHD. However, its unlikely that at 4 you would get a diagnosis as they would most likely say she is too young to rule out all these things being normal child behaviour. Its a tricky one but it wouldn't hurt to read up on ways to manage / minimise this behaviour and tactics for helping sleep (DS is an insomniac!)

[likecherrycola]

Thanks olivio will update tommorow after docs.

littlemiss06. She says they hurt but I think that's what she means have tried lots of shoes socks and even slippers they all "hurt" I don't think she's just being fussy either as she's missed out on lots of fun by not going out , we had planned day at carnival she got dressed and was very excited but as soon as she put her socks on it was tears and "just leave me here" same scenario on Christmas Day had to carry her barefoot to car to go to my parents for dinner, she loves going out and was at park play area most days after nursery , and if not there then walking dog with me. I don't see why she would lie as she seems genuinely upset but I can't understand why it's only when wearing socks/shoes she's running around mad as I type this and no pain any other time. Thanks for replying I will inquire about cahms tomorrow.

Thanks AugustMoon she does have an issue with tshirts too she can't/won't wear long sleeved ones as she hates the feeling it's a nightmare trying to get her dressed. I'm not too bothered about getting diagnosis just now as we have became used to her ways , just feel would be easier to cope with if we knew she wasn't just being naughty ,playing up or just ignoring us. Sleep problem I had a read on some methods last night and will be giving them a try tonight fingers crossed I get some sleep, she went to bet at 12 last night and was sleep walking at 2 and wouldn't go back to sleep till after 3 and then woke up at 7.30 full of energy :o wish I had some of that.

[likecherrycola]

Sorry for terrible spelling and grammar, I blame lack of sleep.

[NaturalBaby]

My 3yr old is very similar and we did wonder about hyperactivity last year, but he can sit still and concentrate for fairly long periods of time with books of puzzles.
He also seems to have a sensory overstimulation issue with socks and noise. Have you seen barefoot shoes? They are thinner, more flexible shoes - vivo shoes

He is very different at nursery, so they don't see any of the hyperactive behaviour.

We went through a hyperactivity tick list on the internet and he didn't tick enough boxes for us to take it further.

[cestlavielife]

have a read of the out of synch child -
www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0399531653/?hvadid=5128072265&hvpos=1t1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=566821401422324048&hvqmt=b&ref=pd_sl_5n48inibdv_b&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

and the articles on here
out-of-sync-child.com/

[littlemiss06]

Sorry hun hope you didnt think I was impyling she was lying, I was talking about my own daughter saying its not that shes being a pain or fussy she feels it so real, its just ive spoken about it on another forum before and someone implied it should have been nipped in the bud and if they had the child for a couple of days they wouldnt be like that, clearly people who dont understand so i always make a point of saying its not her being a pain or fussy when i talk about it now, like your daughter mine has missed partys and fun things because of her clothes, it definately sounds like sensory processing disorder either linked to something else or on its own definately mention to your doctor about her missing fun things and how distressed shes getting, ive got to the point where i know what bothers her (most of the time) and work round that, my paediatrician said i have to be careful between her getting away with it all but he doesnt live with her and if not wearing a particular top or pants stops her meltdowns then why shouldnt i just work round it. I've not had it were she wouldnt put anything on her feet thankfully for my little one its usually solved by ensuring her socks are smooth and her shoes are as equally tight and cant move. I hope you get some help from your doctor.

cestlavielife I really fancy reading that book, thanks for the link :)

[likecherrycola]

Thanks NaturalBaby those shoes look perfect I'm willing to try anything just now, I will let her choose a pair and hopefully she wears them .
Thanks cestlavielife that book looks very interesting , might help me understand my dd better will defiantly be ordering it.

Not at all littlemiss06 sorry if I sounded like I thought you did, I thought she was lying and just being awkward but she's still adamant about it , will be fun trip to doctors tomorrow partners working I don't drive and she won't wear any shoes , it's 20 min walk so think I will have to get taxi , hope don't get strange looks with dd sat in waiting room barefoot with no doubt short sleeves tshirts and starry leggings :).the person saying it should have been nipped in the bud obviously doesn't have a clue I wish it were so simple I have tried everything even bribery nothing's worked she also got a little electric motorbike which she was desperate for but can't try out because of sock shoe thing. She's back at nursery soon too hopefully can solve this before then.

[olivo]

Likecherrycola, how did it go?

[likecherrycola]

Hi Olivo not very well was a nightmare to get her there , and we didn't see her usual doctor, the doctor we did see basically said we should nip if in the bud and she's just being awkward and also that I shouldn't have booked an appointment as its not a medical problem :o ,have left a message for health visitor though so hoping she can visit next week with hopefully better advice. I feel like a bit of an idiot to be honest , but I'm positive there's more too it than just being awkward, I asked dd tonight why she never listens to me and she said there's too much traffic in her head i feel terrible for her shes missed out on so much with the shoe thing and the doctor was terrible yesterday she didn't even touch her feet to check. thanks for asking though , not got a clue what to do on Monday me and dh are both working , so thinking she will be going to nursery barefoot if they allow it, fingers crossed they do.

[Disappearing]

If she's not great at sleeping, the tiredness will be making all of her other behaviour more extreme/wearing. If there's any way you can improve her sleeping you might find everything else improves.

Perhaps try giving her omega oil supplements?

[TheFallenNinja]

Yep. One wouldn't wear shoes, one would only eat egg after smearing most of it on his face and the other one talked, ran, jumped, bounced and shouted almost constantly.

Sounds perfectly normal boundary testing to me. It did get better however

[olivo]

Aw no, hate it when drs are dismissive and you KNOW something isn't right . I have taken dd to nursery shoeless before, they have usually managed to deal with it for me once I've gone.

Hope the HV offers some support. Would Wellies be an option for now?

[TreadOnTheCracks]

Have you tried crocs?