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Latest report on cost of childcare: is a childminding agency coming?

(60 Posts)
Italiana Tue 09-Oct-12 14:48:14

This is the latest report in The Telegraph today
Is a National agency coming to produce more c/ms ?
I am sure you will have many comments

GrimAndHumourless Tue 09-Oct-12 17:19:49

this article?

Italiana Tue 09-Oct-12 18:31:39

Thank you for putting the link...totally forgot

GrimAndHumourless Tue 09-Oct-12 18:45:42

And yes, I am sure that 'something' is in the pipeline

WickedGirl Tue 09-Oct-12 18:58:41

So he wants cheaper childcare?

As a self employed childminder you have to earn a certain amount to comply with the new universal credit being brought in.

He can't have it both ways...... He either wants childminders to charge less or he wants them earning at least minimum wage for at least 35 hours (after expenses). Which is it?

stomp Tue 09-Oct-12 20:18:19

have you read Penny's Place blog?

I so want to comment more but the childcare sector is full of whispers and uncertainty at the moment and trying to separate truth from lies, facts from fiction is almost impossible..
Then we get reports like the one from the Centre for Social Justice, utter garbage, full of inaccuracies. Is it any wonder that the right hand seems to contradict the left hand, and that no one seems to understands what a Registered Childminder actually does/is.

Frakiosaurus Tue 09-Oct-12 20:30:27

I hear bells. Warning bells.

GrimAndHumourless Tue 09-Oct-12 20:33:20

Wicked girl, the UC doesn't affect me, we don't claim

I am bothered about the subterfuge and chinese whispers

Stomp what is the blog? I'll go have a google

stomp Tue 09-Oct-12 22:05:31

Grim i'm not sure i can post the link but i'll try
pennysplacechildminding.com/2012/10/09/feedback-sent-to-dfe-in-response-to-questions-set/

Italiana Tue 09-Oct-12 22:20:09

Sorry but the link above refers to something totally different
Many c/ms have replied to the Centre for Social Justice about their misinformed report and many more should as it appears they are engaging in discussions now

I would not refer to what is going on as chinese whispers...plenty has been going on and c/ms have met with the DfE and E Truss to discuss this matter
Not long until we get told what this is all leading to but it is not rocket science...is it?

GrimAndHumourless Tue 09-Oct-12 22:24:36

thank you Stomp

MrAnchovy Wed 10-Oct-12 00:43:54

There's a bit of confusion here.

This is the article from last Thursday's Telegraph referring to this report from the Centre for Social Justice.

GrimAndHumourless's link was to the article in the Telegraph today (Tuesday) which doesn't really say very much (sorry Grim, not your fault!)

I think that a number of people that have been 'involved' in consultation on this have a lot to learn about how government works.

However it is interesting to note that the CfSJ report does NOT recommend either a central agency for childminders (that would be pretty unlikely from a Conservative coalition with a localism agenda anyway) OR local childminding umbrella agencies (the discredited Dutch/Liz Truss model). In fact whereas Liz Truss's report recommended the creation of childcare oligopolies through the withdrawal of Tax Credits/childcare vouchers from childminders falling outside the umbrella organisations, the new report recommends the extension of these state subsidies to users of informal childcare!

Tanith Wed 10-Oct-12 07:43:38

What I am struggling to understand - perhaps someone more knowledgeable/intelligent can help me here smile - what I really do not get is:

They say childcare costs are too high. Parents are paying more in childcare than they do on their mortgages. We are the most expensive country for childcare because all the others are more heavily subsidised .

So, instead of tackling nursery costs (the childcare option that is often very expensive and paying out minimum wage to their staff, and has benefitted from millions of pounds of Government money not available to childminders), they are going after childminders. Why???

I really don't get it! How will making us take on more children for less money make any difference at all to the nurseries? It's not going to reduce childcare costs. If anything, it's going to put childminders out of business.

I don't understand confused

Italiana Wed 10-Oct-12 07:55:53

No MR Anchovy no confusion if you read the CSJ report you will see it has nothing to do with the link provided for that blog mentioned by Stomp as that blog has a report on a DfE visit

Once again you tell us we know little...on the contrary
Tell me did you like me meet with the DfE and Liz Truss and have you corresponded with them since?

It is beacuse we know how govt works that we have spread the news about this report which is misinformed and inaccurate
Some sort of deregulation is coming ..it would be good if informed c/ms would contribute to how it is going to be shaped....let me reassure you the DfE are keen to listen and we know why don't we??

So c/ms carry on making your views heard here and anywhere else you can

stomp Wed 10-Oct-12 08:18:12

its worth taking the time to read the lady's blog Italiana not just the one post. Sorry must dash.

Italiana Wed 10-Oct-12 08:24:20

I am very aware of this blog Stomp as I am aware of many others...yes definitely worth reading and respecting all opinions....

HSMM Wed 10-Oct-12 08:59:00

Thanks Grim, Stomp and Mr A for the links. Interesting reading.

MrAnchovy Wed 10-Oct-12 11:17:45

Tanith I think that the problem is not the comparison with nurseries, it is the comparison with after school clubs. The perceived gap is in supply of affordable childcare for those aged 5-7 - mainly because under Universal Credit parents whose youngest child is of school age will be "encouraged" to work for 20 hours a week.

The way the numbers work is that on minimum wage the clawback of UC will only leave them with £2.17ph in their pocket. With the childcare subsidy at 70% this means that they can only afford to pay £7.23 for childcare (for all their children) otherwise they will be worse off working. So 2 children at a childminder @ £4.50ph is a non-starter - but 2 children at an after-school or holiday club at £2.50ph each would only leave them 67p better off: you see the problem?

Italiana Wed 10-Oct-12 22:01:41

One of the other reasons Tanith is that c/ms are very expensive to register and inspect as well publicised by Sir Michael Wilshaw HMCI which prompted Gove to introduce less regulation via the EYFS 2012 and promising to reduce further red tape

Unfortunately most of the red tape comes from DfE, DWP, LAs and most organizations we belong to and want a slice of the action...to that you need to add the various funding which is now not ringfenced anymore and used by LAs without accountability and which does not reach families or providers

As you know I met Liz Truss and the DfE and I can ressure you their main aim is cutting cost...what will hapeen will soon be revealed by Truss as she makes her proposals known...some sort of deregulation is coming but lets hope she abandons the 'agency' idea

HSMM Wed 10-Oct-12 23:13:13

Yes Italiana you are right, they are stressing about the cost of CM inspections. They inspect us for 6 children and then the nursery up the road for 200 children. Cost per child is massively different.

Tanith Thu 11-Oct-12 07:38:01

So, in actual fact, there are very little savings for parents in all this?

Many childminders don't do after school at all - the after school clubs and children's centres having taken their business - and they're not doing anything regarding the expensive nurseries.

Italiana Thu 11-Oct-12 09:04:56

The DfE have been made aware that wraparound/holiday care is expensive to deliver for c/ms and it has been suggested that some incentives be given for c/ms to provide this service
The increase in ratio, looking after more than 3 children in the EYFS at our discretion and professional judgement, also means less spaces for after school care...the DfE will make holiday care worse and have taken this on board...they can't have all their way

Holiday clubs can be cheaper but when you add the fact that no food is provided for the children in the end it is the same cost and children are in 4 walls rather than out and about with a c/m

I feel that the cost of childcare has suddenly become very expensive because of the cuts to parents but it is c/ms who are being blamed for being too expensive?
in some areas c/ms charge £2.50 in others £ 4.50, take away the expenses and this is well below the minimum wage...no woman should be paid so little
Lets also remember that when parents go back to work they are entitled to the minimum wage of £6.19...why not c/ms?
I have also read that the govt is planning to cut the tax relief parents get on c/vouchers but I need to read more about this...will c/ms take the blame for this too?

HSMM Thu 11-Oct-12 09:10:38

I have reduced the price of my holiday care, as holiday clubs round here are very cheap and many include food.

MrAnchovy Thu 11-Oct-12 11:02:49

"So, in actual fact, there are very little savings for parents in all this?"

Not unless they switch from childminders to after school/holiday clubs, or childminders have to drop their rates to match them as HSMM as already done.

I am not aware of any proposals for further changes to childcare vouchers.

Italiana Thu 11-Oct-12 14:33:59

I do not think you can compare the care provided by holiday clubs with that of c/ms...cheap is not always best and as said they do not even provide water for the kids

As a c/m I have no intention to drop my fees as there is no service comparison
I too have given some savings to parents but will not drop what are already fair fees for my experience, qualifications, large setting, care, long days and continuity of care which for some of my cared for children has lasted for 9 years

I have read about the c/vs and will post it here if I can find the information again

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