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(87 Posts)
aldeburgh Thu 09-May-13 09:47:31

Dd2 is 7.5 weeks old... Has reflux to the extent that she cannot lay on her back as she gags and chokes. Has been this way since about a week old probably earlier but we just assumed it was usual newborn mucous issues and needing a warm body.... Symptoms started to develop and she was diagnosed by gp after hv suggested reflux.... Anyway.... Here we are exhausted.... Dd2 not gaining and dropping centiles so i was advised that she needed at least a bottle of formula a day to get her back on track. Andnow they are suggesting 2 and perhaps i should stop altogether.
I am not enjoying bf but of course i am shattered so can't. I have dd1 to look after. Getting as much help as possible but still exhausted... I sometimes think everyone is right i should give up.... I am losing a scary amount of weight and everyone is saying my supply is not enough. I just don't know what to do. I feel guilty for even thinking about giving up but what if i am not supplying enough and she could thrive on formula. Help.

aldeburgh Thu 09-May-13 19:28:35

Oh and i live pretty rural so no groups close enough.

Pleasenomorepeppa Thu 09-May-13 19:35:52

Hi. DD2 3.5 months has reflux. She's on Omeprezole now after the GP referred her to a Paed at her 6 week check.
She hated bf & would scream inbetween latching & eating. Her reflux is very high apparently.
I tried to mix feed, as I did it v successfully with DD1 (she also had reflux), but she really hated it.
She's now on Aptimal Pepti. Her reflux is much improved & we get good sleeps & few & far between screaming fits.
Hope you get it sorted soon. Good Luck smile.

HeyMicky Thu 09-May-13 19:42:18

Oof, reflux is a bitch. DD had silent reflux, we were watching for it as both I and my mum had it, so DD was diagnosed at 6 weeks. She was prescribed ranatadine which helped a bit.

Things that worked: ranatadine; sleeping in shifts like you do; expressing in the morning for the 10 pm-ish bottle given by DH; putting a wedge under her mattress - at one point she was propped in the v cushion to sleep as well. Sling, sling, sling. Go to baby groups, there's always someone else who has a refluxy baby and you can compare vomit schedules wink

Things that didn't work: anything marketed for colic; going dairy free. Didn't try cranial osteopathy as it's bollocks and manipulating your child's skull won't make her oesophageal sphincter mature faster.

Don't worry about sleep associations. I was rigorous with bedtime, even though it meant standing in the dark for bloody ages, picking her up very time she choked then putting her down when she was calm. But she was in pain. Just relieve the pain and they'll sort themselves out.

Are you pumping, as an alternative to formula? I used to get up at 6 to do it, PITA but worthwhile. Good for supply as well.

FWIW, DD's reflux went away at about 18 weeks. I thought I'd never get to put her down, and that she'd never stop moaning, but just last night I breastfed her before bed and she fell asleep in my arms (a rare occurrence) as I was singing to her, and it was just FANTASTIC to do be able to hold her peacefully on my terms and get to gaze at her and enjoy having in her arms. Hang in there

aldeburgh Thu 09-May-13 19:42:23

Should i ask for aptamil pepti for the supplement feeds?! I had read about nutramigen but not heard of pepti .... Should (is it possible) we try and get some tomorrow for the late night feed from the pharmacy? Or is it only available on prescription?

aldeburgh Thu 09-May-13 19:54:27

Yep heymicky... Silent reflux here too. Her breath stinks of acid. sad
Did i read correctly you said 18 weeks?? I have a year tattooed to the inside of my eyelids.
Tried cranial osteo for 2 expensive sessions even though dh told me exactly what you said pretty much word for word ;)
I just don't get enough when i pump and it is hard to pump and hold a baby and make breakfast for dd1 shower and dress... I know it seems like i am being reluctant but i am just so tired it doesn't feel like an option. Great suggestions though.

noblegiraffe Thu 09-May-13 20:01:44

Not getting much when you pump isn't an indicator that there's a problem with your supply at all. I couldn't pump anything but successfully bf for 17 months.

HeyMicky Thu 09-May-13 20:27:13

No, it's hard, hard work in the early mornings. We ended up doing a formula bottle from 16 weeks as the amount I could express reduced so much. But still BF at 8 months. So mixed feeding can work

DoodleAlley Thu 09-May-13 22:53:43

Dont worry about sleep associations at this stage. These things can be remedied and in any event Ive seen babies pick them up from getting extra cuddles when ill even. These things can be worked on when they are older and things have settled down.

You do what you need to right now and leave tomorrow to worry about itself.

GraceGrape Thu 09-May-13 22:54:53


When I mix fed I offered a small top-up (2oz) after each feed as advised by my HV. I was then supposed to express after each feed, to stimulate my milk supply. Like you, I was too exhausted for this though! I think putting baby to the breast is actually a better way to boost milk supply. Topping up after every feed is quite time consuming as you end up washing and sterilising a lot of bottles, but I imagine it might be easier to do as a short term thing as you could cut it out more easily? (I'm guessing....). Switch-feeding like you're doing is the best way to build milk supply though I think. I also tried breast-compressions. With DD2, I worked very hard to build up a good milk supply as I didn't want the same problems as with DD1. I fed her a lot (every 1.5 - 2 hours for the first couple of months ) so poor DD1 spent a lot of time in front of the television. I also co-slept which meant she fed as often as she wanted at night. Is this an option for you? I was able to sleep while she fed!

The pepti milk (I think Aptamil does one, there is another called Pepti-Junior) is a hypoallergenic milk that contains cow's milk but in a hydrolysed form so it is supposed to be easier for the babies to tolerate as the body doesn't recognise the milk proteins. Most doctors will prescribe these first as they are cheaper. If LO doesn't tolerate this, the next step is Nutramigen AA or Neocate, which don't contain any milk protein at all. I think you can get all of them from pharmacies but you may have to order them in. The Neocate and Nutramigen are really expensive and are often only prescribed by paediatricians (GPs can prescribe them though - I persuaded mine to do it).

As an aside, how does your DD seem in herself? Is she alert and active? DD2 is bf and also lost 9% of her birthweight then gained slowly and didn't regain birthweight until 6 weeks. She then settled on a centile that she's been following ever since. She did have a tongue-tie though, and her feeding did improve after it was cut.

GraceGrape Thu 09-May-13 22:59:40

Sorry, forgot to say, my DD2 had a good latch even with the tongue tie, so that's not necessarily an indicator that all is ok.

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 02:22:23

What a night. Dd really unsettled after her ff...... Now on the breast to calm her down. Just don't know what to do for the best. sad

Whereisthesnow Fri 10-May-13 02:33:27

Hi aldeburgh
I've no words of wisdom about reflux but it sounds like you're doing a great job and hang on in there.
But re mixed feeding I have done this successfully with both dcs, no supply issues. Think the key is to use it as top up not replacement. We always did a big bf around 6, then one it two bottles.

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 03:00:41

Hv said that i needed to get a decent stretch of sleep to boost supply and to do that it has to be a replacement. And that i would continue to supply what was demanded of me... Is that not how it works? I did economics at a level so that made sense but of course breast feeding probably doesn't follow business models confused

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 03:01:48

Thank you for the support... Definitely hanging in here.

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 03:17:51

Gracegrape... When she is not refluxing she is alert and smiley... She gets tired after about 1hr15 awake but i thought normal for her age 7 weeks .... But she bf so long 45:mins to an hour sometimes that her awake time is mostly feeding.
I had been waking dd to feed but midwife and hv both said not to after the first week as i should feed on demand and she needed her sleep (which she could only get in the sling or on our chests so it was easy to wake her, just lay her gently in moses basket and wait 2 mins)... Until last week i had semi ignored the advice and didn't let her go over 3 hours... But since 6 weeks check i have let her lead and she had gone 4 hours in the day and 5/6 at night. I wonder if being snuggled up means she is less likely to wake for food.!?
All that being said this week since starting meds she has been really unsettled and sleep and feeds have been all over the place.
I can't feed lying down as she refluxes and needs more upright position. great idea though would be lovely to get some sleep... Used to get dd1 her late afternoon nap that way and i would slide over and doze too. Sigh.

Emilythornesbff Fri 10-May-13 03:21:55

Hi aldeburgh sorry you're having a tough time. Lots of good advice from other ppl here. You're doing a great job.
Sorry to butt in but your HV usvwrong I'm afraid. Your milk supply isn't boosted by sleep, it's boosted by feeding.
Sometimes babies do need a supplement (impossible to tell without seeing your LO of course) but supplementing will not boost your milk supply. If you supplement and want to keep your milk production going it helps to express so your breasts are stimulated to make milk.
It's a hormonal thing. There's a feedback mechanism that involves milk production cells "switching off" when breasts remain full and feeding stops. (otherwise we would go pop when we stop feeding)
I hope that makes sense. Good luck with your feeding, whichever way it happens. smile

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 03:35:43

So will giving a bottle a day cause my overall supply to diminish? I hoped i could just carry on feeding at the other times and my body would just assume baby wasn't asking for milk at that time anymore.
Oh i am so confused. I need that block of sleep from 830 til 130 to get me through from then to the following 830pm. And i hoped i would be able to just carry on bf the rest of the time sad
Crying now

Emilythornesbff Fri 10-May-13 03:44:00

No it won't stop you feeding at other times. Plenty of women mix feed very successfully.
Your body will make the milk that your baby "demands"
My point was that a break from feeding won't boost your supply.
If baby takes 8 feeds a day then you'll make 8 feeds etc. (oversimplifying of course)
Good luck with the sleep.

Emilythornesbff Fri 10-May-13 03:45:39

If you fancy reading up on it check out information on" feedback inhibitor of lactation"

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 03:46:44

Oh i see... Ok. Phew. Sorry my exhausted brain is not functioning properly. Thanks for the advice.

Emilythornesbff Fri 10-May-13 03:52:26

grin you are not alone.

It is complex but it's worth thinking about because some ppl find that once they start supplementing it just keeps going up. Baby might sleep longer after ff so more than one bf is lost.iyswim This might be ok but if you are desperate to bf it's worth knowing that your bf can be affected by giving formula.
Well as you can see my brain is also sleep deprived.
Trying to get some sleep now before energetic dc1wakes up. grin.

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 04:02:31

Thank you. Good luck getting some sleep.

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 04:04:20

I hope your sleep deprivation is just normal baby waking and not sitting holding a baby semi upright smile

Emilythornesbff Fri 10-May-13 04:17:06

Yet another transfer fail.

I really feel for you. Reflux sounds awful. I've been very lucky.

It might take some juggling to find an effective solution.

aldeburgh Fri 10-May-13 04:40:29

Ah i remember lots of transfer fails with dd1. Fun.

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