VBAC support thread.

[mamasunshine]

Hi, thought it would be nice to have a seperate thread for those of us that are planning/thinking about VBAC this time round We can share fears/hopes/research found/fights to get what we want etc etc. I had a succesful homebirth VBAC (HBAC) last summer, and I'm hoping to do the same in January

Mamasunshine-DD 17th Jan. Dc1 EMCS,Dc2 HBAC

[LadyBuzz]

Hi mamasnshine I would very much like to join you.
I had a emcs after a failed induction with DS1 and an elective with DS2.
I had a few complications second time am a little bit terrified this time round esp as I have already had some pain in my scar site!

Mamasunshine-DD 17th Jan. Dc1 EMCS,Dc2 HBAC
LadyBuzz - DD 29th Jan. DS1 EMCS, DS2 ELCS

I have a VBAC hynobirthing CD (if I can find it, and I think it was perhaps you who suggested some books??
I want to do as much research as possible into it. I have a doula who is going to help me out with yoga and homeopathy etc.

[TheBreastmilksOnMe]

Great idea mama! It will be interesting to see how many people manage to have the birth they want and how mnay opt for a HBAC!

Mamasunshine-DD 17th Jan. Dc1 EMCS,Dc2 HBAC
LadyBuzz - DD 29th Jan. DS1 EMCS, DS2 ELCS
TheBreastmilksOnMe - DD 2nd Feb, DC1 EMCS

[Unbuffy]

Yes please! Trying to sort out 'being allowed' and 'recommendations' etc at the moment - am 20 weeks and everyone I see seems to be a trainee. grrrr. Would love HBAC but as I live an hour from the nearest hospital have to compromise on that...

When did you all have your cs (ie how long ago)?

Don't know what order you want the list in, will add myself to the top as chronological order, please move me if this is not right!

Unbuffy - DD 27th Nov, DD1 ELCS
Mamasunshine-DD 17th Jan. Dc1 EMCS,Dc2 HBAC
LadyBuzz - DD 29th Jan. DS1 EMCS, DS2 ELCS
TheBreastmilksOnMe - DD 2nd Feb, DC1 EMCS

[LadyBuzz]

unbuffy my first was 4 years ago and my second will be 27 months ish when this one is due.

My MW is behind me but i'm not sure how much clout she will have when it comes down to it.

I'm a bit worried about the scarring mainly, last time it took them 45 minutes to get through the scar tissue and if DS had been in distress they would have gone in top to bottom aswell - not good!

[mamasunshine]

Hello

2 great books I would absolutely recommend are: Vaginal Birth after Caesarean, by Helen Churchill and Wendy Savage. And any books by Ina May (she's a spiritual midwife in US) very motivating books on natural births.

Also the homebirth website is excellent, not just for homebirths!

2 things I didn't do last time but wish I had were 1) have a de-brief with consultant about previous birth and 2) meet with the head of midwifery to discuss concerns on VBAC and what I would have liked for my VBAC.

I'm going to ask for a de-brief on both my EMCS with ds1 and HBAC with ds2, so I can see what actually happened 1st time, and see how I can improve things this time round

unbuffy - when you turn up for your appointment at hospital you can ask to makesure you see your consultant that day and not the registrar. It might just mean waiting aa little longer until they're free (unless they're on an emergency). I've done this and have been able to see a different consultant if mine hasn't been available. TBH I bever had a good experience with a registrar here. They were almost bullying me into induction/about HBAC etc etc. I had my VABC 15 months after EMCS with no problems at all. My 2nd VBAC will hopefully be 19months after last one!

[Unbuffy]

Mama I have (hopefully) an appointment with the head of midwives coming up, but as it was booked by useless registrar I'm not holding my breath until the letter comes. If it's not here within the fortnight I'm kicking up a fuss! All my appointments seem to have been made with the registrar not the consultant. It's so frustrating.

I also had no debriefs or contact with either hospital or midwife after I was discharged. And as for the culture of bullying... I'm still not convinced dd needed to be a section at all, she was breech but small and there was still time for her to turn. I don't think I stood a chance because it was two days after Christmas.

My (hopeful) VBAC will be 23 months after the cs.

[LadyBuzz]

good luck unbuffy I hope you get your appointment.
Ask them to go through your notes with you from last time.
I demanded a consultant appointment after DS1 as the midwife kindly informed me I had almost died - I had no idea so I was a little bit. It def helped to hear exactly what had happened.

if you have any problems try the hospital PALS service, they usually get things moving if you are having issues.

[Unbuffy]

No one else then?!

Thread Killer Strikes Again...

[mamasunshine]

Hello ladies

Have had a very busy week or so with poorly ds's...it feels never ending!

unbuffy - i would definately suggest you get a debrief from consultant for dd's birth. They should answer all of your q's and tell you exactly what happened and why it was needed etc. Have you heard about HOM app yet? Also what's a thread killer? Sorry a bit stupid of me maybe?
ladybuzz - sounds like you had a very scary time

Well I'm having my booing appointment on Saturday (at last!) I'll be 14 weeks! Will ask my midwife about de-briefing births 1 and 2 etc. I'm still not sure which consultant to be under? The one who is excellent at his job and would be best to have if I have P.E.T again, but son't think it very likely that he will 'stand by' me having HBAC. Or the consultant who doesn't have the best reputation but who signed my HBAC off last time (as my consultant was on holiday )? Argh...decisions! Hope you're all well?

[LadyBuzz]

Well I had my parade well and truly rained on this morning. I had my 12 week scan and the MW said you will be having another CS so you will be a week early. I said not if I can help it and she said they would advise me against it because of the problems I have had and because I have had 2 CS before. I have a consultant app at about 34 weeks so we shall see!

[Unbuffy]

Ladybuzz grrr at your mw. I would suggest you try to get a consultant's appointment earlier than that, they like to have it all sorted by 36 weeks or so, so a good idea to try to have a bit more time perhaps? Someone posted a link to some helpful homework... will find and pass on shortly...

hang on, you're going on hold for a sec...

[Unbuffy]

attempting shamelessly stolen link

I fort I'd frightened everyone off, hence the thread killer thing, it's happened before!

20 week scan today, no adhesions as far as they can tell so that's positive. No news of appointment yet, though...

Poor mama, poorly dcs are horrid. Sympathy.

[LadyBuzz]

thanks unbuffy I will have a good look at that when the horrors lovely quiet children are in bed!

mama hope the DCs are better.

[mamasunshine]

Hello ladies Hope you are all well? We're starting potty training with ds1 at the moment (not fun!)

Had midwife booking in app and she seems to think there's no reason why I shouldn't be able to have another homebirth . Will see what consultant has to say although still waiting for an appointment. My blodd pressure was high though, which obviously isn't good with my history. So have to keep an eye on that already , but I'm sure it's 'white coat syndrome'.
ladybuzz - why don't you get in touch with the head of midwifery and get a de-brief from previous times? You can discuss everything with the HOM and she/he will be very honest and realistic with what your chances are etc. Then you can decide for yourself what you think is worth it? Hope that make's sense? For e.g I was given a 70% chance of successful VABC last time, so I thought 'great' . However, if they had said 35% for eg. I prob would have had an ELCS.
unbuffy - thanks for the link Great news on scan! Did you find out the sex?

[Unbuffy]

Hello hello!

Good news on your appointment Mama. Homebirth would be soooo nice - I am jealous!) No, we did not find out the sex - at the moment I think it's a rabbit with boxing gloves on (and perfect bladder aim...)
Appointment with community matron coming up on Wednesday - any suggestions as to what I should be asking? Can't believe it's taken this long to get an appointment, and not even with the hospital! Many grrrr's.
Oh, and we too have started potty training. Yukky.

[LadyBuzz]

unbuffy I would start by asking for a full breakdown of your notes from your first labour as to where and why it all went wrong. It might not be nice to hear but it will prob help your greatly with your decisions this time.

Hope it goes well for you and you get the answers you need.

[maxpower]

Hi Ladies, can I join you? 24 wks with DC2 and I have VBAC clinic appt today. Had a emcs after failed induction with DD 4 years ago. Really would like a successful VBAC as the recovery from the emcs last time was horrid and completely spoiled my first months with DD.

[sittinghippo]

Hello to the originals and hello to Maxpower. I would like to join too, I had ELCS first time round due to breach position, it was all very trauma-free and calm, and my MW has said no good reason she knows of at the moment why I cant attempt VBAC so will definitely be hoping. No way am I even considering HBAC, just not that brave!!

Am currently 14+6 so a long way to go...

I do feel like I missed out on a proper labour, as it was planned I have no idea what a contraction feels like! Never had Braxton Hicks or anything so have always felt a little hard done by.

Unbuffy - DD 27th Nov, DD1 ELCS
Mamasunshine-DD 17th Jan. Dc1 EMCS,Dc2 HBAC
LadyBuzz - DD 29th Jan. DS1 EMCS, DS2 ELCS
TheBreastmilksOnMe - DD 2nd Feb, DC1 EMCS
Sittinghippo - DD 7th March, DD1 ELCS

maxpower do you want to add yourself to the weeny list?

[maxpower]

Unbuffy - DD 27th Nov, DD1 ELCS
Maxpower - DD 31st Dec, DD1 EMCS
Mamasunshine-DD 17th Jan. Dc1 EMCS,Dc2 HBAC
LadyBuzz - DD 29th Jan. DS1 EMCS, DS2 ELCS
TheBreastmilksOnMe - DD 2nd Feb, DC1 EMCS
Sittinghippo - DD 7th March, DD1 ELCS

Saw someone I presume was the consultant yesterday (he didn't introduce himself) who had no idea why I was seeing him - always reassurring . Anyway, he seemed totally nonplussed about the whole vbac thing, bascially said ok, I'll see you nearer your due date. And that was that.

I'd worked myself up into a right state beforehand but I'm sort of hoping that his level of disinterest means that they'll be fairly lax in their approach to vbac, rather than some tales I've heard about what they'll 'allow' you to do or not.

[LadyBuzz]

Hello maxpower and sittinghippo

maxpower if it helps they were very lax with me and quite happy for me to go for the VBAC 2nd time round. Unfortunately DS2 had other ideas and was happy where he was so I had an ELCS!

[maxpower]

thanks ladybuzz

[Fizzielove]

Do I really HAVE to have constant monitoring is I am having a VBAC!

Had a meeting with consultant yesterday and stood my ground by saying No! I didn't want it - she kept on telling me that it was due to uterine rupture - FFS 0.05% - surely the risk by giving birth by CS is higher!

So I've got her to agree that if I go into spontaneous labour before my due date they will not constinuously monitor me until the latter stages and that I will be able to use the bath for pain relief.

Was I right?

[LadyBuzz]

fizzie well done you, I think you were right yes!

Good Luck!

[maxpower]

fizzielove good for you. That's exactly the kind of thing that angers me - if I hadn't have had to have an emcs last time, there wouldn't be any of this 'deal' making this time round. IMO, I think it's agreeable to say you can have a listen when I arrive but if there's nothing unusual, then there shouldn't be a requirement for monitoring. I read somewhere that the research there has been on uterine rupture is quite flawed as they haven't actually established that the risk relates to previous sections - ie it might have happened anyway - because noones looked at where the rupture occurs in the uterus (so they don't know if it's at the scar site or somewhere else).

[Bumptobirthbeyond]

The risk of uterine rupture during an attempted VBAC is very low (less than 1%). Of this 1%, 90% are asymptomatic ie. the mother and baby won't need any assistance.

Constant monitoring is totally counterproductive to a VBAC labour. It restricts movement which is one of the most important things a labouring mum needs to have.
Plus, monitoring your baby won't necessarily indicate a rupture as these signs are typically noticed via checking the MOTHER'S blood pressure and temperature and looking for any changes. Monitoring is useful in checking how the baby is tolerating labour, so is still important.
You can INSIST on intermittent monitoring. It's your right.
Lots of hospital consultants appear indifferent when they are talking to prospective VBAC mums. My advice is not to be lulled into a false sense of security ito thinking that they are being open minded on VBAC births. Hospitals have rules, policies and protocols to follow and although the NHS now has VBAC targets to meet, a VBAC mum still often has to 'jump through hoops' to ensure she gets the birth she wants and deserves.

I'm a VBAC coach, based in Mill Hill North West London and help mums who want to maximise their chances of getting a VBAC.

If anyone needs any help, or has questions, please do get in touch!

Best of luck ladies!

Madeleine Moss
Bump to Birth and Beyond