Reassure me that it's okay for my toddler not to go to bed

[BroccoliSpears]

She's 19 months.

She's always had a lovely bedtime routine and gone happily to bed after bath, story, cuddle etc at about 7.15.

This is the third night in a row she's 'decided' not to go to bed. When we put her in her cot she screams and hollars. Last night she played happily until about 10.00 and then went down happily.

At the moment she's even howling in protest because we're not letting her out of her bedroom - but DP is in there with her and she has the option of cuddles!

I know many people would say we need to let her cry about it and learn that bedtime is non-negotiable. But we just don't want to. It feels very very wrong to let her cry - yes, even if we go in to reassure her every minute or so.

But I do want her to get a good night's sleep!

I know every one of my friends and family would be strict and make her go to bed whether she wants to or not.

Are there any other parents who would let her get up and play if she really doesn't want to go to bed?

Am doubting myself.

Go on, I can take it.

(But really, no leaving her to cry!)

[ArmadilloDaMan]

if you can let her get up when she wants in the morning then why not.

[emmaagain]

I'll get jumped on but...

I don't believe in bedtimes...

I believe in children falling asleep when they are ready and where they want

puts on flak jacket

also, I love it when a childn's rhythm edges towards late nights. Oh the lie ins when they aren't waking till 930am! happy sigh I know several families where that's their policy, so they really get an evening together as a family

[NineUnlikelyTales]

My DS is a bit young but a friend of mine does the same as you, or at least did for a few weeks until things went back to normal.

[BroccoliSpears]

Now she's in her (dark) bedroom, DP is with her (on the sofa I assume) and she's cheerfully emptying her toybox.

The thing is, se wakes up at normal time in the morning. And she was a bit pale and tired today.

[lizandlulu]

each to their own. i personally like to have baby free time in the evenings, but if you dont want to put her to bed it is your choice and you should do what you think is best.

[ja9]

ooh, sounds dangerous to me!!!! i'm much to precious about my evenings to entertain this. does she have a daytime sleep? perhaps it needs cutting down...

[cece]

I couldn't be doing with kids still up in the evenings - I like that to be my time - so I am strict about bedtimes.

Now the youngest is 4 I am getting a bit more flexible, say if we are on holiday I may let them stay up a bit later.

But at 19 months I think you need to be strict. It may suit you one or two nights to let them stay up but then when you need them to go to bed (say for work next day u-you not them!) you will have even more tantrums and crying...

DD has always been fine but I have had trouble getting DS to bed some nights but IU have presevered and he now knows I mean it and tends not to argue to much....

[emmaagain]

I'd worry about making sure everyone is happy now rather than whether they will be tomorrow because of what they are doing now.

If she's really tired tomrorow (which she may well be, having a late-for-her night two nights running) she'll probably just have a massive nap.

Worry not, go and help empty the toy box

[BroccoliSpears]

That's good to read Emmaagain.

Actually, over Christmas she didn't really go to bed until she wanted to and was fine. But I put that down to Christmas excitement.

I do like my evenings too, but not at the expense of traumatising myself and my daughter into sleep !

Oh it was much easier being a laid back, lentil munching earth mother when my child wanted to be asleep by 7.30 every night.

[phdlifeneedsanewlife]

I think this is how I would handle it (ds only 9m so don't know for sure!) But I'm just a wuss when it comes to fighting with 'em...

[Meeely2]

she's testing her boundaries - my dt's went through this a little older than your DD. They had a beautiful bedtime routine, went to sleep as soon as their heads hit the pillow, then one night, hours of playing, hysterical laughter, taking beds to pieces and dh and i taking it in turns to go up, explain their options, return them to bed and start again.

It lasted weeks and suddenly stopped. Now at age 3 they go to bed, chat and sing for about 10 mins and then gone.

Can't explain it really, but we remained consistant and they got the message i suppose, or they just grew out of it - who knows. They are at nursery 5 days a week so need their sleep as they also no longer have daytime naps so are knackered.

End of the day i wanted/needed my two in bed and asleep by 7.30 at latest - if your family doesn't need that sort of routine and you can get up when you want the following day, why force it?

[cece]

Ds would stay up all night though if I let him. But usually asleep within 10 mins of being put to bed even though he protests all the way...

[Seona1973]

I need my 'me' time as well and couldnt be doing with my lo's being up late - ds (15 months) and dd(4) are in bed by 7.30pm every night. During the week we wouldnt have the option of letting either of them having a lie-in as dd has to be out for nursery at 9am. If your lo is not sleeping any longer to make up for the late nights then she will become sleep deprived and her daytime behaviour could suffer for it.

I certainly wouldnt have anyone stay in the room with my lo's if they were refusing to go to bed as that would just be providing an audience/attention. I would personally let my lo's scream/holler and pop in every so often to repeat the going to sleep message.

[BroccoliSpears]

Well, she and DP are now downstairs assembling flatpack furniture.

In the big scheme of things it's not really going to matter if she has a few late nights. As Emma said, she can always have a longer nap if needed.

I shall see how we're doing in a week's time before panicking that I'll never have an evening to myself ever again.

[phdlifeneedsanewlife]

maybe there's an in-between - some activity where she's up, but not getting quite so much attention from you/dh? Like, if you were both sitting quietly reading/working and told her that's what happens at this time of night, she could stay up if she sat quietly too, so she didn't start to think avoiding bed = fun fun fun?

just a suggestion, what do I know!

[bigmouthstrikesagain]

My dd is 21m and although she does go up to bed at around 7pm (same as ds 3) She frequently ends up downstairs again an hour or so later. I am a bit stuck at the moment as she is still bf frequently - So I have to either spend alot of time running upstairs - or give up and go to bed myself or bring her downstairs. So I am not strict at all about her bedtime, she still ends up in me and dh bed every night.

I do worry about getting her sleeping in her own bed and at a reasonable hour though as I have to get ds to preschool 3 mornings a week and he will be starting school in Sept. DD is likely to start doing pre-school sessions in the autumn as well. So it is not fair to be letting her stay up all hours - it is all very well to be 'free and easy' when work/ school is not in the equation but the fact is kids need lots of sleep and I need to make sure they get it. I also need some child free time to pull myself together for the next day!

When dd was new born and ds was coming up to 2yo - we had a few weeks of hell getting him to fall asleep on his own (I had stopped bf him a month or so before). It was worth it but it was horrible at the time (we used a rapid return technique). He started sleeping through then and life was much easier and his behaviour during the day improved.


Sorry - I did not intend this to be so long winded - It is not the end of the world to let a toddler stay up but you do need a routine of some kind when pre-school/ school starts, here endeth the lesson...

[mawbroon]

Each to their own Broccolli but our experience of letting ds stay up over the Christmas holidays resulted in progressively worse night wakenings until he wasn't happy unless he was in bed with me co sleeping and breastfeeding all night. It took a week of being super strict to get him back on track and I have vowed not to let it happen again.

I also didn't like that ds was so tired during the day and his behaviour suffered too. All round, it was a bad idea for us however you may find that your dd can cope with it with no problems.

[Countingthegreyhairs]

I'm afraid I've always taken the rather old fashioned approach to sleep BroccoliSpears (but I am ancient ...... and selfish .. because I like my evenings ...]) and this is your decision to make. But I think you might be storing up trouble for yourself if you let bedtime become "negotiable".

Obviously, there's always the odd exception during high days and holidays etc but, like yours, my dd always wakes up like clockwork early every morning, whether she's gone to bed late or not and we all suffer for it the next day!

Around this age as I recall they need approx 11 hours. You don't mention whether yr dd has an afternoon nap? Does she fall asleep in the car or in the pushchair? That's an indication whether she's getting enough sleep or not.

Tbh, I would try putting her to bed earlier. I know this sounds like madness, but when they get over-tired then, in my (admittedly limited) experience, they settle less easily. And there's a natural dipping point during the early evening which - if you miss it - makes going to sleep much harder.

We went through all the pacifying and going in and settling again and again and again, and in my dd's case, whatever we did was never, EVER enough. It could have gone on all night. That's when we starting setting some boundaries.

I know it seems like you are traumatising them when they cry - but in our case - it got to the point where I felt her need for sleep became more important than her distress in that moment (not to mention my own distress!) when she cried (if that makes any sense at all!!)

What we did was be consistent, very boring, and very firm. We went back up once and then not again. (Whilst monitoring with a baby alarm from a distance.) She got the message quite quickly and benefited hugely. I felt like a monster at the time but she is the sort of child that thrives better with firm limits. And it got easier and easier both during the day - and at night - once she was getting enough shut-eye.

All children are different though, that was just our experience but hope you find a way that suits you and yours!

[Countingthegreyhairs]

sorry - have just re-read my post - that "storing up trouble" comment sounds terribly patronising voice of doom/old maiden aunt talking!! Didn't mean to sound like that!! Good luck with whatever works for you!

[Umlellala]

Broccoli, we go by trust in this house - and trusting our own instincts too. Because dd loves bed and happily goes to bed when tired, in this instance I would be inclined to think 'well, she isn't tired yet'.

So we tend to go with the flow for a while and then see whether we think she needs us to be in charge or whether she needs whatever it is (eg more cuddles at bedtime or not having a bath or going to bed later). There is no 'formula', I just go with what feels right on when to be firm or not. I wouldn't like her to be going to bed really upset - we tend to fnd a way of explaining and compromising that means we get what we want and she is happy too.

Def agree with emmaagain that you don't have to sort it now OR THERE'LL BE HELL TO PAY . Think a happy sleep association is more important personally. And you can teach new routines etc if you need to v quickly AT ANY AGE. IMO it's so much easier as they get older because you can explain...

You are the parent - if she is happy and you're happy, it's fine!

(PS if she does start really hating cot, what about a bed? we put dd in one at 14mths cos we think she hated the idea she couldn't get to us. She has LOVED bed and sleep ever since...)

[BroccoliSpears]

Really appreciate all your replies. I sometimes think that I am the only parent in the world that doesn't have firm boundaries about things like sleeping and eating, and then I give myself a big guilt trip, wondering if I am relaxed for her sake or for my own - am I just not parenting? .

Particularly interesting to read about a natural 'dipping point' for sleep. I had noticed that with dd there comes a point where I just know she will sleep - a change in her that wouldn't really be noticable to anyone but me.

Anyway, happy ending time: Less than 40 minutes after my last post she is in her cot, fast asleep. She played downstairs for 30 minutes, yawned once and I asked her if she'd like to go to bed now. She bid "Nigh' nigh' slee' tigh'" to the dog and willingly came upstairs to bed.

My favourite ever parenting advice is to do whatever works for you. A few people on this thread have said it. Thank you. It's true. Dd is a pretty laid back child and I never feel that if I give an inch she's ready to take a mile. She just doesn't equate being stressed and cross with going to sleep, so it works for us to let her get up, calm down, have a play and then go to bed in a while. It never takes long and I was silly to get worried.

Now, can anyone lend me some varnish to put a nice finish on this lovely rod I've just made for my own back?

[bigmouthstrikesagain]

Umlella - good point about the bed - when ds was moved to his own room at 19m (just prior to dd being born) he loved his big boys bed - and slept in it happily - we just needed to teach him new sleep cues once bfing had ended which was hard but necessary for us.