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very angry toddler- asd or just behaviour?!!

(35 Posts)
NessaWH123 Thu 16-Jul-15 09:52:00

Hi I have a 28 month old son who has been hard work from birth. Never settled, often cried and now at 28 months his behaviour is very embarrassing. He is very 'strong willed' all the time (which I know is many toddlers) but constantly shouts and screams at us. He has been to speech and language as he has had glue ear but their main concern was his very poor concentration. He points his finger and shouts no at people all the time, constantly pushes and hits and if random strangers or people he knows enters the room he usually shouts at them ..is this normal please? We tell him not to shout at people in a low stern voice, he sits on the time out chair/step for hitting and pushing..we are consistent and praise a lot when he does respond well but I am worried about his behaviour and lack of concentration. I feel silly asking but I worry about things like ASD and if so how to manage it. I know he is young and this is probably to early to tell but when he goes to the child-minder I look at the other children and they don't constantly look for a fight! Any advise please..i feel so embarrassed when out and about or visiting people as he will happily start at my grandparents house etc...

NessaWH123 Thu 16-Jul-15 09:56:40

sorry I meant ADHD not ASD

SophiePendragon Thu 16-Jul-15 09:59:15

Hello, well I don't know if it could mean he has some other issues going on but he does sound an awful lot like my toddler.

I mean we don't have the constant shouting but when he is really tired (which is often - he doesn't sleep well - and has never been settled, cried a lot etc) he will get very stroppy.

I think you have sometimes to lower your expectations and do very little of the things that set him off, if at all possible.

I find we often achieve very little during the day - I am SAHM - but he will sometimes watch the TV for a while which is bliss, otherwise he wants to take things apart, break them, tear off wallpaper and draw on the furniture.
He is dreadful - I was cleaning one bin this morning while he was busy shoving chocolate spread all over the other one. It never seems to end - and 'wash your hands' ends up being water all over the ceiling, his clothes, etc etc.

I find two things help. Food - always making sure they don't need a top-up - and sleep, and the combination of eating/drinking plus exercise can send him off and then he is much much nicer.

It will pass though, normally - this is a normal stage - could he be cross and frustrated about going to the CM, or about his hearing? That might just be exacerbating it a little iyswim. (Mine got very cross after he had been at Grandma's without me for a few hours - like a reaction to feeling worried when he was there - we aren't doing that now, till he is a bit bigger)

SophiePendragon Thu 16-Jul-15 10:03:16

Also I understand how worried it makes you but honestly, these behaviours are VERY common indeed with toddlers, particularly I think boys though can't be sure of that! And they usually DO grow up to be lovely. My ds1 is 12 and you would never know he had been like this at 2/3/4.

Go easy on the discipline - usually no need for it at all, if you are prepared to distract, cuddle, give them something else to think about or whatever. Seriously none of the organised discipline even goes in at this age - you're wasting your efforts smile He WILL be reasonable and lovely one day, you don't need naughty steps or anything.

DixieNormas Thu 16-Jul-15 10:12:07

Some of it is probably down to his speach and concentration, some down to age! Ds3 was similar, poor concentration, frustrated as he has some receptive language difficulties. He started behaving much better when he turned 3 and started nursry.

Imo salt are really good at picking up signs if asd. Ds4 is 2.6 and salt mentiined asd on their first vist at 2.2 years and helped with the referral s. He had his official diagnosis last week.

Some little ones take longer to mature and he is still tiny, I do know hiw it feels to have the toddler who shouts no at people and seems to constantly misbehave. We still now at 4 have to be strucked with bounderies and have talks about acceptable behavior before we go out.

NessaWH123 Thu 16-Jul-15 10:14:35

he seems to have little control over himself. If I dare take him to a supermarket he shouts all the way round hello like a mad things, tries to lean over to touch and grab people, very hyper etc.. he wont sit in a pushchair unless he has a snack. I hope he does settle sophiependragon but he is always sooo over the top often like Jekyll and hyde. He does understand a lot but pretends he hasn't heard me most of the time. I do think some discipline is needed though so he understands right and wrong.

SophiePendragon Thu 16-Jul-15 10:20:32

It's normal - mine is exactly like that, no self restraint, they can't at this age. Of course I do speak to him and say 'NO' sometimes rather loudly, blush but it's a question of managing for them what they can't manage themselves.

Mine will not sit in a trolley at all, even when bribed. Supermarket has to involve my other children chasing him round while I try and shop as quickly as possible, and often they end up quite desperate. We have ten minutes if we're lucky.

It is exhausting. It is temporary though. I have to say my probably Autistic ds2 was always extremely compliant and easy in this regard (I thought I had cracked parenting, finally!) and not wild at all. It varies I think.

As I said lower expectations - shop online if you can - don't put yourself through it. It's a total nightmare, but very, very normal.

NessaWH123 Thu 16-Jul-15 18:19:51

Thanks sophie just pucked him up from childminders and she had enough today she said he has shouted and pointed and argued and pushed all day about everything it has been a constant battle every few minutes and he has been very angry dont know what t do x

SophiePendragon Thu 16-Jul-15 21:03:31

Oh gosh you poor thing. What is your situation - do you think you will be able to leave him with her again?

It sounds really difficult.

Sometimes children do get very upset by being left with someone else and they can express it in this way but it could be something else entirely, I mean, it might not be because of that. But I would think it is pretty common. A form of separation anxiety I suppose. Mine was a lot worse after I left him with my mum for the first couple of times. I don't know if he would have got used to it as we didn't persevere.

How many days does he go?

SophiePendragon Thu 16-Jul-15 21:04:45

Btw you sound like a very caring mum. It isn't your fault, whatever is going on.

NessaWH123 Fri 17-Jul-15 21:16:24

Thanks sophie he goes 3 days a week and has done since he was 1 year old. He has some days better than others but its pretty bad at the moment. He is like it at home aswell. Infact anywhere really!! She will have him back but its wearing her out aswellx

NessaWH123 Fri 31-Jul-15 14:23:31

Bump

Took him to a baby gym today a d he was the only one who wouldn't follow the instructions at the beginning when they were in a circle instead he kept running off ! When the lady who ran the group came over to speak he shouted no and kept pointing his finger at her which is so rude. I am so embarrassed. His pointing and shouting at children as well as adults is wearing me out I'm feel like digging a hole! It looks awful and so aggressive any ideas?

BabyMum1 Fri 31-Jul-15 15:37:35

Have a look at his diet to see if it's something that aggravates it or if he's lucking something that could calm him down?
Does he have sugar? Squash? Artificial crap? Lots of gluten?

NessaWH123 Fri 31-Jul-15 21:28:05

I do keep a good diary as I watch his diet due t constipation but will look again he does eat pretty similar every day and some days are better than others so not sure about it but thanks .

EssexMummy123 Fri 31-Jul-15 22:12:24

Not being able to listen and concentrate is normal at that age - remember the mumsnet mantra 'this to shall pass'

Kennington Fri 31-Jul-15 22:17:46

My daughter hasn't sat in her pushchair for almost a year and she is three
Very very active. Goes to sleep at 10pm. Shouts a lot. I assume it is her age!

Kennington Fri 31-Jul-15 22:18:57

Sorry didn't finish my post. What does your GP say?

ThisFenceIsComfy Fri 31-Jul-15 22:19:18

Mine is the same. Try and focus on his good behaviour. Sometimes I get so caught up on what a hooligan mine is that I forget he is pretty awesome in loads of ways.

But yes it is normal. And he will get older and it will all be a distant memory wine

chocnomorechoc Sat 01-Aug-15 07:08:36

you seem to be very concerned and he dies appear to have some areas of difficulties.

I would make a list of all concerns, go to GP and demand a referral to a developmental paed.

I find that people want to be reassuring but you seem to struggle and if he does need help, then the sooner he can access it the better but you will need to get under a paed to access Support (I have a child with SN - this is how the system works).

are you getting help re glue ear such as grommets? fwiw, my child's problems were blamed on glue ear and only once issues didn't resolve once we had grommets, we were taken seriously.

NessaWH123 Sat 01-Aug-15 07:31:57

Thanks essexmummy123 that's good t hear smile kennington thanks its good to knowiI'm not alone. Gp isn't really interested saying maybe because of glue ear or just 2 year old behaviour!Thisfenceiscomfy I hope yr right its just he seems so.much more extreme than others I see..guess I started looking and worrying about ADHD now? Every time I go out I dread it waiting for the outbursts againsad chocnomorechoc I will try again at go as yes I am worried but just hope as the other ladies said it will pass! With regards t glue ear I have t wait the three month period before being seen again and then I will push for grommets. Yes I'm guessing they and I hope the grommets will ease the problem behaviour but like u said it was only then they took you seriously. Can I ask what behaviours your little one displayed?

NessaWH123 Sat 01-Aug-15 07:38:42

And yesterday I had t pop t the corner shop to get milk and let him walk in holding my hand!!well that went well. He started grabbing everything thinking the shop was free and when I said t put a tube of smarties back after he tried to mouth then he threw them down on the floor along with the rest of the shelf of smarties tubes and screamed in rage before trying to run off around the alise in rage! I had to carry him out and apologise. I felt mortified! sad is this normal?! My friend takes her little girl the same age to the shops and she happily walks around helping get the bits of shopping...what am I doing wrong

chocnomorechoc Sat 01-Aug-15 08:27:47

DD behaved a little different to your DS. no concentration, little attention. speech and language delay (but no aggressive behaviour). we have now a dx of severe autism. not suggesting this is the case with your DS but The have been through the well meaning chestnuts of "this is all normal" and "it will pass" etc. just follow your gut and don't let anybody fob you off.

BabyMum1 Sat 01-Aug-15 09:35:41

Nessa no I don't think it's normal
Ds1 behaved similarly till I took gluten and casein out of his diet and now he's a completely different child! Goes everywhere with me even with my 10 mo!

NessaWH123 Sat 01-Aug-15 13:57:27

Thanks chocnomorechoc can I ask how old your little one is and how old before he was diagnosed? Babymum1 I'll look into gluten as a possibility but the dietitian has looked at diet previously with him and didn't feel that was it.

chocnomorechoc Sat 01-Aug-15 14:33:44

grommets at 2.5, referred to paed at 3.0 and dx just before 4th birthday. everything takes ages and forever. don't do the wait and see things if you are concerned because the process is awfully slow

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