okay then all you fab parenting types - Cappuccino is on her KNEES asking you to help

[Cappuccino]

dd won't eat anything.

she never has eaten much (I'm alarmed by now much earlier dd2 wears her hand-me-down outfits) but now her paediatrician has referred her to a nutritionist because she is too small. She is nearly 6 and when I try to buy her school skirts even the 4-year-old ones hang off her diddy little waist.

She has some feeding problems due to her cerebral palsy but the last time I spoke to her chewing and swallowing therapist she said she was doing really well, and said that maybe 20% of her unwillingness to eat was down to the disability, and 80% was behavioural.

She is a very clever little girl and I think that food has become An Issue. She never ate or drank much, as I said (when she was a baby we used to force water down her with a syringe when it was really hot and she had had nothing to drink) but now she looks at her food and pushes it away without even having a spoonful.

We have tried everything at least once. Stickers. Ignoring it and just bringing on the next course. Praise for good eating. Naughty steps. All sitting down happily for a meal and chatting and just blanking her shenanigans. Trying to talk to her about it. But it gets worse and worse. She barely eats or drinks anything at all. This morning I just left her at the table with her milk (she refused her Ready Brek straight off) for an hour until she drank it. I told her that she wouldn't be ready to go to her grandmas until she had drunk her milk and got dressed. It worked eventually after many tears and everyone's morning being ruined by it, but I don't have time to do this when she's back at school.

I am at the point where I have no patience with this 6-year charade any more and I can't see a way out. When she was at nursery I used to pay extra so they would give her lunch - I didn't need the childcare but I just couldn't face three meals a day. I always feed her things that she likes and that she can easily eat; I give her a good, varied, tasty diet but it all ends in the bin. I can see going to this nutritionist and him saying 'you need to give her this and this' and watching her push it away again. I'm also aware that dd2 could soon see what is happening and join the 'game', and she is a great eater.

can anyone help me with a way out of this? I'm just getting completely past it.

[Olihan]

Is there anything she REALLY REALLY likes? (I'm thinking along the chocolate/sweets route......) I was just wondering whether out and out bribery might work - if you eat one mouthful of dinner, you can have a chocolate button, etc. Then keep increasing the amount she has to eat before she gets the treat.

I guess it depends on how you feel about bribery!! I can't think of anything else, other than what you've already tried so it may be worth it as a last resort.

Sorry if it's totally inappropriate, you just sound so desperate.

[colditz]

Do you give her sister pudding?Maybe get some really desirable (chocolatey character things?) puddings, and when her sister finishes or makes a good attempt at dinner, a pudding is allowed - but not for dd1 if she doesn't eat as much as dd2 does.

[fredly]

How is she during the day ? Is she active and full of energy or lethargic ? If you think she's active enough I wouldn't force the issue beyond a certain point (I agree that she shouldn't leave the house without at least milk in her stomach) and accept that she has a very small appetite. If not, I would give her food only in very small quantities at first and insist that she eats it. Then increase the amount very gradually. You could start with things that are easily for her to swallow and she likes and once she eats those start to diversify.
You have my support, I wouldn't like to be in your shoes.

[Issymum]

Quick thought because I need to get on with some work, but how is your DD1 at school? Does she like and respect her teacher, want to conform with the rules etc.? If so, it might be worth getting school involved. A tangential example: DD1 refused to brush her hair, put her shoes on etc. in the morning before school. I shouted, I pleaded, I bribed but it was still ugly. Then one day I sat down on the sofa, picked up a book and said "You know, I don't actually care whether you brush your hair/ put your shoes on, but we are not leaving until you've done it. And if we are late, I will explain to Mrs Connor why we are late and she will be very disappointed with you." And I would have done and she knew it. And that was the end of it.

Would that possibly work for breakfast? And maybe enlist the school's help for lunch too with stickers and comments in the homework book?

I'm only suggesting school, because it will effectively stop it being a 'you and her' issue. And if she ate a good breakfast and a good lunch five days a week, you could probably relax the rest of the time.

Obviously this will depend hugely on your and her relationship with her class teacher and the school.

[Cappuccino]

fredly no she's knackered

she has no energy at all and she's a pain in the a*se, grumpy etc. She can't walk very far in her walking frame as it is but she's so tired she often doesn't try

I know it's down to lack of food & drink

but whenever I try any 'you must eat this' kind of thing there are just tears and tantrums

[bakedpotato]

(You say you've tried everything, so you've probably tried this.) How does she respond to authority figures (as opposed to mothers) telling her what to do -- would she listen? How would she respond if the paed/nutritionist were to sit down with her and spell stuff out for her?

[makemineadouble]

Its very interesting that you say you paid for extra nursery time so that she would eat,for other people i presume? Is that still the case? Does she eat at other houses when your not there? ie grans,family friends? Is she just doing this to you ?

[fredly]

Have you tried explaining to her that she's not able to walk because she doesn't eat. At 6 she should be able to undestand. You could say something like 'if you ate a bit more we could go swimming together or go to the park', etc, anything she'd fancy, you get the idea.
Would she eat soup ? you can hide anything in soup, including pasta, spuds or rice, which are good energy providers.
I feel so sorry for you. If this is behavioural, there must be a way out, we just have to find the right approach.

[catrin]

Apologies if you have already done this... elaborate making mealtimes special stuff. Sit at different table (big table if currently small, vice versa) decorate chair in manner of throne, dress up, wear crown, tiara, have food cut into favourite shape (star, heart etc) use pink food colouring if allowed, to dye pasta, get her to help you cook (things like fish cakes, meatballs that can withstand a good mangling), special cutlery. Massive hassle I know, but may help even for a short time.

[Elibean]

Its hard to know what to suggest without understanding why she doesn't want to eat...'behavioural' covers such a broad spectrum. Has she ever said why? Probably a silly question, I'm sure you'd have said if you knew.

I do think explaining (if you haven't already!) that how she feels and what she's not able to do have big links to not eating is worth doing. In a very matter of fact sort of way. Then, if she shows any interest, I would try to engage her in finding the solution - ask her what might help her to eat/drink? Wonder out loud about it, but let her take control somehow - IYSWIM.

Sorry, feel like I'm fumbling in the dark trying to be helpful...it must be upsetting, and frustrating (to say the least) seeing her so tired from lack of nourishment.

[Whizzz]

COuld you do a reward system (marbles in a jar) depending on what she eats. Get enough marbles & then get a treat ??

[motherinferior]

Oh you poor love, what a total bloody nightmare.

[fredly]

Sorry, I don't know if swimming or going to the park are appropriate for her condition, oops. I'm not familiar with CP .

[shebnem]

is it possible that you involve her in cooking?

[makemineadouble]

I was just thinking if she'l eat for gran or a friend try and let that happen just for long enough that she gets back into regular eating which usually increases appetite

[Cappuccino]

fredly no we can go everywhere everyone else goes

it's a great idea, as is sitting her down and telling her what the score is, and I have done this. But she gets herself into a little state and even though she's been told that if she doesn't eat xxx won't happen, she starts getting rude and teenaged, pointing, sulking etc

makemineadouble yes she does seem to do better at school; she'll eat most of her lunch there. She hates me . Actually she would snack endlessly given the opportunity and a never-ending supply of Rich Tea biscuits but would never eat a full meal or drink a full drink

I like Issymum's idea; but I fear Malory that if I ignored it it wouldn't make any difference, she'd just eat nothing and be quite happy that all the hassle had stopped

[fredly]

If she eats at school at least you know that she's getting food from somewhere, that's a good thing. But it looks like it's a relationship issue more than a food one. What makes you say that she hates you? It's a pretty violent thing to say.

[BettySpaghetti]

How about inviting friends round for tea/lunch? Children often eat better when they're with other children (I've just watched my DD, also 6, who is a very slow eater just wolf down masses of food in record time at a friend's house!).

Does she eat better in unusual situatiuons eg picnics? If so how about having some "fun" lunches in dens or tents (indoors or outdoors), picnics in woods, fields, gardens etc.

Hope things improve for you soon

[harpsichordcarrier]

Cappucino what a nightmare for you.
I agree wtih fredly about explaining to herin simple terms that the consequences of her not eating are X, Y and Z.
Then I would say that MT's advice is correct after that - completely ignoring it possibly for many months. If you believe it is an Issue because she wants your attention and because it bothers you then I think the only solution is to not let it bother yuou - or to be more accurate, to be utterly convincing in the charade that it doesn't bother you.

So for example, say that if she eats her breakfast then she will feel better all day and have the strength to do X. And if she doesn;t eat it say in a completely neutral voice, oh that's a shame and then just change the subject, do something else or speak to dd2 or whatever.

I would also (and I don't know how you feel about this) abandon the whole three meals a day thing and just provide easy snacks when she comes home from school. I would probably keep beakfast but I think that mealtimes and the dinner table provide a bit of a stage for all this drama and that the behaviour will not be so effective if there is no audience.
this may go against the grain of everything you believe, but I think difficult times call for radical measures. I think it is worth changing the whole dynamic of food in your householf - eating in front of the tv, going to a cafe for tea after school, picnics in the garden or the park, tea at friends houses, snakcs in the car.. whatever it takes really. stoip the control issue by giving her control.

also, what about providing a snack drawer of healthy stuff that she can eat whenever she likes?

my apologies if any of this advice isn't appropriate to your dds special needs - I do have some experience but not with CP.

hth and hope I haven't offended.

[fredly]

Another thought, she has to understand that she needs to eat not to please you but just because she needs to full stop. It looks like she's using food as a weapon to get at you.
What happens if her dad gives her her food or eats with her without you being present ?

[charliecat]

Could you end the day on biscuits and milk if she eats whats on her plate at each meal. Serve bird like amounts to begin with and the reward at the end of the day is laods of biccys and milk. No arguing about it. This is the score...you eat A, B and C ..you get biccys. You dont, then no biccys. No bartering or bribing. Her choice to eat or leave.

[MrsFio]

have you seen a dietician?

I dont know how your dd is, but we saw one when dd was pretty young (about 2 or 3) and it was very useful. We had to put dd on a high calorie diet, she basically said to take no notice of what you are suppossed to feed and try and get as many calories down them as possible. It was stuff like adding cream and butter to almost everything. Then it was no to stress, which I found very hard at the time.

We were also prescribed fortisip drinks (they were shakes though) which were not very appetising, but I used to make ice lollies with it and mix it into yogurts.

She does 4 years later actually eat well but I think my stressing madeit worse. I worried so much about her.

[oliveoil]

oh

I have this with dd1, she is a complete pita

So I have just stopped trying to get chicken casserole in her and she has Bird's Eye nuggets instead. She will not eat 'normal' potato so has some crockette things from M&S

cheese sandwiches in front of the tv or a picnic in the garden

she has no fruit or veg, I chop it up and put it in front of her, may have a nibble once a month

she is big for her age but f&&k knows how, she lives on fresh air imo

xx

[Quadrophenia]

Cappucino this sounds really draining for you, it really must be tough, especially when you see the consequences of her not eating. Ithink HC's advice is absolutely spot on, particularly the three meals a day at the table. I really hope you reach some form of resolution soon, and please remember we are all here if you need to some support?need to vent scream etc xx