Routine for a ten week old

[LittleMilla]

I prob ought to post this in sleep. But as the thread os frequented by people like me (who don't have brilliant sleepers!) I am hoping that it might be better here.

My DS is ten weeks. In the last week his nightime sleeping has gone haywire and I'm feeling quite demoralised as I thought we were making progress. Looked something like this:

Bed between 7-8
Dreamfeed at about 10:30pm
Wake up at 4:30am for feed
Another feed at about 6:30am
Up for the day about 8am

I was loving it and on Sat night he even slept from 11-7 .

We then moved him in to his cot on Sunday and it's all gone to pot. He's been waking up every 2-3 hours. He seemed unable to resettle in the cot, so I've ordered dividers etc from amazon and put him back in moses basket last night as he had jabs yesterday (so was expecting last night to be crap, and it was).

I am bf him and give a ff top up for the df. In the daytime I feed on demand and he'll go anything from 2.5-4 hours between feeds. For the most part, I am having to offer him boob as I am always focused on trying to get as much food in him as poss so he'll (hopefully) sleep at night.

He naps ok in the day, so long as we're at home. Split between one big one and usually a couple of smaller ones, he'll have about 4 hours sleep between waking and going back to bed. When out he'll only ever have short naps (40 mins) in his buggy.

Can anyone offer any words of wisdom on how to get him sleeping better at night again? And what do other people experience with their 10 week old LOs?

Oh, he weighs about 14lbs and is up ont he 75th percentile - so I know he's big enough to be sleeper better than he is at night.

Thanks in advance! x

[ThePippy]

Hi littlemilla when my daughter was between 8-9 weeks old she started going all night without a feed. This was however preceeded with a week of what appeared to be her getting worse and worse with her night wakings which was so upsetting and I was quite down about it. We moved her from moses to cot at about 7-8 weeks (so just before) and I also think that time is when they have one of their growth spurts.

So don't despair too much - I felt so down when my DD did this then was totally elated when suddenly a week later she was sleeping through. We also had a similar routine as you, inlcuding the dream feed about 10.30 before we hit the sack, which we kept going until she was about 7 or 8 months old when I think it had become a safetly blanket for us rather than being needed by her. In actual fact when we dropped the dream feed she started being completely settled through the night (rather than the odd wake up and crying for cuddle) so I think by then it had got to the point where waking her for a feed she didn't need was distrupting her natuarl sleep patterns.

[LittleMilla]

Hello Pippy thanks for your relpy. Can I ask how your DD was feeding in the day? I'm worried that by feeding him fairly frequently, he's not always hungry?

Also, was your DD's nap routine established before she began sleeping through? DS is 'roughly' the same every day. But I watch him vs. the clock when putting him down. So it does tend to drift somewhat!

I am in two minds on the df tbh. He's often FAST asleep when we give it to him and looking back, it doesn't guarantee he'll last any longer. Might try dropping it tonight, just to see what happens. Figure we haven't got anything to lose...!

[ThePippy]

Hi again.

We were roughly following the baby whisperer approach, so she was on a 3hr routine of bottle, play, sleep. So she would have bottles at 7am, 10am, 1pm, 4pm then after her bath/before bed at 7pm plus the dream feed and in the early days an additional cluster feed at about 8pm which we dropped by amout 3 months. She generally slept at 8am, 11am and 2pm for around 1 - 1.5 hrs each time (although it took some training to get her past the natural 45 min sleep cycle she seemed to have and get her to learn to get herself back to sleep) and often a late shorter nap about 5.30pm otherwise she was just no good for bath time.

With regards how much milk she took (I know exactly as BF had stopped at 5 weeks) she was frankly rubbish and was regularly well under the lower amount specified by most books/milk companies. It never affected her growth though as she tracked the 25th percentile consistently and as I said even though some days I would struggle to get more that 40-60ml in her at a feed, she still slept through the night. I think it was less to do with how much was in her tummy and everything to do with being ready to sleep through. I definitely think the efforts we went to for her daytime naps in terms of teaching her to get herself back to sleep (rather than just giving in and getting her up after she cried at 45 mins) paid off massively with the night success. This is one of the main baby whisperer concepts I guess, that you teach them to get themselves to sleep by not feeding just before the sleep phase, as then they only even associate getting off to sleep with having milk, so then will "need" night feeds for a lot longer as a way of getting back to sleep not because they need the extra milk. I have no idea if this theory is correct, but it seemed to fit in my head and certainly appeared to work for us.

I was definitely convinced the dream feed was leading to more distruption than help by the time we stopped, but I kept it going a lot longer than techincally needed because ironically this was the one feed she would happily drink the most at and I saw it as a good way of getting a decent amount of milk into her overall.

[MoonFaceMamaaaaargh]

there are lots of growth/developmental spurts and sleep regressions to (possibly) come. They don't affect all babies. But if you hit one it doesn't mean you have done anything wrong. Babies patterns can change lots in the early days. We always followed ds's lead and he wasn't in anything remotely approaching a routine till 10m.

Pippy sounds very lucky to me. ime it's highly unusual for babies to sleep through so young.

Fwiw ds also went through a rough patch of sleep before he started sleeping through, just like pippy's lo. My ds however was 15m, and still wakes occasionaly (sometimes needing a sandwich so hunger is always a possibility)

I don't blame you for wanting your dd to sleep through, or for trying to achieve that. I'm just saying it is very early days...

[LittleMilla]

Had another thoroughly crap night, despite an almost perfect day's naps yesterday - one two hour, one hour and two 40 mins. Pippy I am feeling quite envious of your DD too!

He went down OK at 8pm. I dream fed him at 11:15pm. Then up at 1:45am, 3:45am, 5:45am and then 7:45am.

He went back to bed at 9am, but woke after an hour (he usually has a big am nap). Put him back down at 11am and he's now fast asleep.

I am wondering if the dream feed is disrupting his natural rhythms as he'll easily go 3 hours + in the day between feeds? We gave him water at 1:45am to see if he was really hungry, and he wasn't cause he went back to sleep (although it took a while cause he got quite agitated waiting for the water). He hardly took anything at the 5:45am feed either, so I'm convinced he's just waking out of habit.

Moonface Although we had one joyous night this time last week, I'm not really expecting him to sleep through. Just one wake up (at say 4am) would be utter bliss. I am really bad without enough sleep and snatching 1.5/2 hours a night is hard for me - I nearly had a breakdown in the first 6 weeks!

Been reading about growth spurts and as he was 10 days overdue, he's nearing the 12 week mark if I measure him based on his due date. Clutching at straws slightly, but wondering if that might be something to do with it. Absolutley dreading the 16 week mark as I keep on reading about regression...cannot begin to think about it getting worse!!

[Tryharder]

I am going to sound harsh but you are really making a mountain out of a molehill. For the sake of your health and happiness, RELAX. Forget about what your baby "should" do - he can't read the bloody books and doesn't know what he's supposed to do.

Stop getting stressed and in turn your baby will relax. If he doesn't settle, put him in bed with you, breastfeed him and both go to sleep. If you don't get a good night's sleep, then go to sleep with him in the day. Stop clock watching and believe me, you will enjoy your baby so much more. I hate to read posts like "absolutely dreading the 16 week mark...." as you have written above because you shouldn't be dreading the time you spend with your baby.

Stop worrying about what your baby should or should not be doing and forget about sleeping through or rods on back etc etc. Just keep your baby close to yourself in a sling or in your bed, feed when he wants feeding, forget routines or schedules and you will probably have a much happier baby.

I know you probably won't want to read this but what you have written is quite sad and yet, you don't really have a problem. He's only 10 weeks old. He only wants to be close to you - this is instinctive to him as he is unable to defend himself from predators etc.

Sorry this is very garbled - am posting from work(!) so no time to post something eloquent. But please, stop worrying, go with the flow, sleep when he sleeps, forget about routines or books, or the bloody baby whisperer and listen to your baby.

[matana]

Hmmm... i pretty much agree with Tryharder. 10 weeks is still tiny. I think by that time my DS (who is now an 8 month old excellent sleeper) was still waking twice. There's a growth spurt around 10 weeks which might be responsible, so it may well pass but i think you've been spoilt by having a baby who goes so long at night anyway!

Have you tried putting him down to sleep in his moses basket inside his cot so he gets used to it? Is his cot in a separate room? At that age they still need closeness to you, though i accept he may have outgrown his moses basket and you don't have a lot of choice. Despite him being a big boy, he is only 10 weeks and hasn't developed the sleeping patterns or other behaviour of an older baby. His weight has nothing to do with it and he probably just wants to be close to you.

You will never get this precious time back again, so by all means do what you can to make things easier (cot dividers to make it a smaller space, put something in that smells of you etc) but routine will happen when your DS is ready and 10 weeks is, imo, still very young and you may be expecting a bit much of him.

[matana]

Oh and i found the Baby Whisperer didn't work for us when DS was still so young and i consider i made a mistake worrying about whether he was in a routine or not at that age instead of just enjoying him.

There was a period of maybe a few weeks when he fell naturally into an EASYAE pattern (although i didn't stress it), but it all changed when he started on solids at 6 months and it all went out of the window again!

It does work for some, and you'll find plenty on here who say it worked wonders for them. I'm just saying that despite the advice, not all babies do well on a routine. I have discovered that despite being an 'angel' baby, my DS is prone to having a very independent streak meaning he never thrived on a routine and just as i thought i'd sussed him out he changed the goalposts!

[LittleMilla]

Hello tryharder and mantana - you're both right, I know that I've got good and he's still young. I don't want it to come across that I don't love him to pieces and am enjoying him, I really am. I'm just (like many I think) trying to piece things together. And having been teased with some really good night time sleeping, I've just wondered why we cannot replicate. I am, by nature, the type of person that will read everything to try and make sure that I know as much as possible. And I concede that when it comes to babies, this isn't the most helpful thing to do as it makes me think I (he) should be doing certain things.

Saying that, I am relaxed with him and he's very much leading everything we do. I'm not a Gina Ford type at all, seriously! He's fed on demand and get LOTS of cuddles. He isn't left for hours crying either, to try and fit with a 'schedule'. We've just tried a few different things to see what happens.

Incidentally, he slept amazingly last night. Bed at 8pm. Didn't bother dream feeding him and he slept until 3:45am, then up for the day at 7:30am. We have put the divider in the cot and also bought some breathable cot bumpers. So we'll see what happens tonight.

Thanks for taking the time to reply to me.

[matana]

I'm pleased it went better last night LittleMilla. I know what you mean about books - i have a whole library of them, but pretty much use them just as useful guidance only now. Unfortunately the first one i read was the dreaded GF and, being a first time mum, i thought what she said was gospel! Spent ages trying to do what she suggested, thinking that this is what babies should be doing, before realising that my DS and I were much, much happier doing our own thing. He's a fantastic little ray of sunshine and we have both thrived by just doing what feels natural. It's tough having so much advice thrown at you in those early weeks - but i've found the information and advice here on MN so much better than any book i've read.

You sound like you're doing a great job and, more importantly, enjoying it. So just carry on as you're doing and i'm sure you'll raise a happy, lovely little boy.

[LittleMilla]

Thank you for the kind words Matana x

[xsazzox]

Hi ladies, newbie here!
I went through all this with DD1 who is now 13m....I now have DD2 who is 8w and cannot believe how different they are! DD1 slept thru @ 5w but this lil monkey just will not! Tryharder is bang on the mark....stop stressing out it will happen....I just feel spoilt when it came to DD1 and I'm expecting too much of DD2! LOs pretty much will do what they want at this stage, its not til later on wr can try techniques and training etc.
Fingers crossed we all get s better nights sleep tonight! :)

[xsazzox]

Sorry about spelling, on mobile phone!

[MoonFaceMamaaaaargh]

littlemila i didn't mean to scare you re regressions etc. All i'm saying i there is a lot of chopping and changing to come, over which you have no control!

It's easier to change your habit's than those of a tiny baby.

I agree completely with other posters.

Re replicating those good nights of sleep...there have been nights where i have got by on only a couple of hours, and nights when i have slept for 12...but i can't do either of those on an ongoing basis. Imo doing something sometimes doesn't mean they can do it all the time.

[MoonFaceMamaaaaargh]

also i think it's the more reliable sleepers that appear to be affected by regressions.

[ThePippy]

I totally agree that I was VERY lucky with DD, I know that isn't the norm at all, I was more trying to point out the fact that it got much worse before it suddenly got a lot better, so not to give up hope and think that it will be like this forever.

Also agree though about the regressions you have to come - while DD went through from 8/9weeks with no feed, I certainly didn't get uninterupted nights from that time on, and it wasn't in fact until she was 8 months or so that she was regularly sleeping through without waking for something, even if it wasn't milk. I would say 18months was another point at which she seemed to settle even further and it became a rarity that I needed to go in.

I think MoonFace may have something on the more reliable sleepers being affected more by regressions, or maybe that is just the perception from the parents who are usually getting better sleep ;-) I had a terrible week recently due to an ear infection and it hit me really hard because I wasn't used to it, but when I look back it was probably no less sleep than newborn days.

I totally know I have a shock coming though with DC2 due in december as everyone keeps delighting in telling me how you never get two the same and how I am bound to have a terrible sleeper to counter the fact that DD was so good. Gulp!!

[MoonFaceMamaaaaargh]

the pippy i am due a sleeper (dc2) in september...or so i reckon! I'm just getting use to getting sleep again so i hope so!