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to speak to dd about this

(51 Posts)
tyun Fri 22-Nov-13 20:30:28

Have name changed in case anyone in rl recognises this.
Eldest dd (28) has just opened a cafe and dd (18) and ds(15) are both working in it at the weekend and after school/college some nights. She is finding it hard and she has not paid any of their wages (but has paid the other staff. DD and Ds have spoken to her about this but all she says to them is that she knows that its difficult for them but she can’t afford to and that she is currently not paying herself.
I want to have a word with her about it but DH is adamant I should not. He says we should be proud of her gumption to start her own business and that the first few months are always the hardest and most stressful and so anything to alleviate this in the current climate should be welcomed. DH says that families should help each other as much as possible and be willing to put themselves out in order to help other members succeed and they aren’t exactly desperate for money as they both still live with us. He also says that the sacrifice that dd and ds are making will pay off in the future if they have a successful entrepreneurial older sister to help them with any problems they might have.
I can see his points to an extent but I can’t get away from the fact that if it was anyone but her I would have told them to demand to be paid or to walkout. DD and DS did accept not being paid for the first couple of months, they were really eager to help her but they do seem to be getting fed up with the situation. I feel really conflicted about it really, AIBU to have a word with her.

HandragsNGladbags Fri 22-Nov-13 20:32:49

How long has it been going on for?

If they decide to help an elder sibling willingly I would stay out of it. If they are disgruntled then they shouldn't be pressurised into continuing with the situation imo

breatheslowly Fri 22-Nov-13 20:33:51

I'd speak to her. If your DH wants to lend her money to support her new venture then it should be his, not his other DCs'.

WipsGlitter Fri 22-Nov-13 20:34:10

I think your other children are old enough to decide for themselves if they're prepared to keep working for nothing.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Fri 22-Nov-13 20:34:24

YABU I think, if her sibs think family loyalty is more important then they will stay- if they think they are unpaid labour then they can leave.

tyun Fri 22-Nov-13 20:34:39

Its been going nearly 5 months.

IslaValargeone Fri 22-Nov-13 20:35:15

Depends how long they have been doing it?
If they agreed to do it for free for a while then they should stick to the arrangement.

IslaValargeone Fri 22-Nov-13 20:36:39

Ah, cross post.
5 months, that's a bit much then.
I think it's up to them to speak up, not you.

LEMisafucker Fri 22-Nov-13 20:37:01

unless she made it clear to them that this would be a no pay job then she is well out of order, if she can't afford to pay her staff, she is doing something wrong - unless of course she is going to give her siblings equal share in the profits then she starts to make money.

witchremix Fri 22-Nov-13 20:38:01

I would leave it up to them but I think I would make it clear to the working dc they may never get paid and see if they are happy to help their sister like that?

Jinty64 Fri 22-Nov-13 20:39:31

Your dh should either pay dd & ds's wages himself or go and work in the cafe himself to "show support". I would not be happy with this.

Annunziata Fri 22-Nov-13 20:39:59

I would speak to her. If she is not making enough to pay wages now, she will not be making enough in January and February, they are always the worst. Your other dc have been very good to to 5 months already, but asking them to wait longer is wrong.

Is she keeping a record of what she owes them, making plans of when she will pay them, and what kind of interest/bonus she might give as a thank you? It's great if they are prepared to help her out like this, but it needs to be their choice, rather than an assumption that they'll comply just because they are family - especially with your DS who's still a child

If your DH is so keen to assist, is he helping out of free too?, or considering helping her with a loan perhaps? That may be better than her siblings feeling pressured/fed up with the situation

phantomnamechanger Fri 22-Nov-13 20:42:48

I would not allow this - she needs a loan or something to boost her takings while she starts up, but she should not be relying on a hell of a lot of free labour - if YOU wanted to offer some of your time FOC, that's all well and good, but not at all fair on the siblings to be forced/expected to put up with it. They have shown willing, been understanding, but 5 months is taking the piss. They could be earning doing other jobs.

Smartiepants79 Fri 22-Nov-13 20:44:10

Is there no way she can pay at least some of the wages and buy herself a bit of goodwill?
I would speak to her, trying to put their point across without taking sides.
I also agree that it is up to her siblings really. If they are not happy to work for free anymore then I wouldn't put any pressure on them to change their mind.
It's fine to say she is not taking a wage but it is HER business and she will (hopefully) reap the benefits. What will they get?

tyun Fri 22-Nov-13 20:48:19

No neither me nor DH work there. She specifically asked them to work for her and they didn't mind the non-payment at first but are getting annoyed now.

Liara Fri 22-Nov-13 20:52:17

I'm really not sure about this one.

I think it is great when family can help out, and it is really hard getting a business off the ground.

But your other dc should benefit too.

Maybe she can offer that she will keep tabs of how much she owes them, and give them that plus a bonus of a share of the profit when she does turn the corner?

Twoandtwomakeschaos Fri 22-Nov-13 20:53:48

Unless they knew it would be long-term and unpaid, I think it is rather unfair of her. They aren't happy (you say they have already approached her asking for their due) and working for her stops them actually earning money elsewhere. If it wasn't your eldest DD, what would you do? You say you'd advise them to walk out if they weren't paid. Well, perhaps you should, as their Mother, even if you feel you can't speak to DD1 (though, as HER Mother, can't you tell her she is being unfair, either in not making explicit that she expected the work to be unpaid and long-term or in promising pay and not following through?). Realisitically, the longer they work and the more they have owing, the harder it will be for her to find that sort of money.

loveandsmiles Fri 22-Nov-13 20:55:04

5 months is a long time. However I do think her siblings are old enough to speak up for themselves.

I would feel proud that my children were pulling together and helping each other out and would like to think that DD1 would help her siblings out in future if need be. On the bright side, they are gaining work and life experience that is always good to add to a CV in future........ grin

Twoandtwomakeschaos Fri 22-Nov-13 20:56:44

Actually, having read your latest post Op, I think she is perilously close to taking them for mugs and abusing their goodwill, which may have a long-term impact on the family's realtionships. Also, DS is a minor and, therfore, you have a legal role in sticking-up for him.

Chlorinella Fri 22-Nov-13 21:01:44

5 months is too long to be working unpaid .
They should be speaking to her about this , and I think you should be involved too , I feel she's taking advantage of them .

SlowlorisIncognito Fri 22-Nov-13 21:04:51

I think you do have to say something. It may be a long time before she makes any money, if she ever manages to make any at all! Is your DH expecting her to exploit her siblings permenantly? Presumably, if they were not working for her, she would have to pay other staff, so it might even be giving her the impression her business is almost viable when it is not.

I think you need to sit down and talk to her. Ask her when she expects to be making enough money to pay her siblings, and how she is going to pay them 5 months wages (or more) if the business folds. I think you should also support your other children if they decide they no longer want to work for free, although try and persuade them to at least give her some notice. What will she do if they decide enough is enough and walk out leaving her in the lurch?

Do they get anything in the way of tips? If not, what happens to them?

MammaTJ Fri 22-Nov-13 21:05:53

5 months is seriously taking the piss out of their goodwill! It is nice to have a succesful enterpenerial older sister, but not at their expense. All that teaches them is to roll over and play dead and be taken advantage of.

toffeesponge Fri 22-Nov-13 21:06:06

What is she doing for money then if she hasn't paid herself? How is she paying her bills and buying her food?

tyun Fri 22-Nov-13 21:11:19

They do get a share of the tips. Her boyfriend is paying her bills at the moment.

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