To think that all those generations of women who battled for equality for women have actually achieved nothing!

[flixx]

All that has changed is that women are now expected to go out and work and well as still being souly responsible for the vast majority of domestic stuff and childcare.

Womens lives aren't better or easier, infact they are now so complicated that half of us are so stressed and knackered we don't even remember who we are anymore.

The role of a mother is less valued by society than it has ever been when we all know that it truely is THE hardest job ever.

[smugmarried]

I agree, but prepare to be slated.

[OsmosisBOOnana]

I don't think that is true. I think if you could go back to that era and feel what was like to be a mother / household runner / wife etc you wouldn't say that.

I do agree that we let ourselves down though.

The number of women who still don't vote despite our forebears dying for it, who still propagate the myth of woman as 'weak' 'man reliant' 'stupid' - basically a lesser creature. Something we all know and I think a respectable amount of men know to be utter bullshit.

[OsmosisBOOnana]

think i might have spelt forebear wrong... awaits pedant...

[cory]

Doesn't work like that in all families. Dh does at least his fair share of the domestic jobs and is very involved in the childcare.

[bahcornsilk]

I disagree. You can define your own role.

[Threadworrm]

I knew this would happen as soon as I saw Sigourney Weaver in Alien. That was the first film in which a woman really really kicked ass. But she had to prance about in vest and knickers looking sexy too, and I thought then that liberation would just mean doubling the workload.

Still, it has been A Good Thing I think.

[bahcornsilk]

But I want to be able to prance about in vest and knickers looking like Sigourney Weaver.

[wheresthehamster]

If you don't have a partner then it must be tough. If you do have a partner then it's his fault you feel like this.

[PopBitch]

Well, I wouldn't say it is "THE hardest job ever" really. Although I would agree that it isn't valued.

I do think if women work AND then do EVERYTHING at home (eg are married to lazy men who don't pull their weight) then yes, it's rubbish and horrible and they need to sort it out. Men shouldn't get away with it, why should they work and NOT do anything else?

But I don't do everything, my husband shares it and we both work so my perspective is coloured by that.

[TheGoat]

yabu, get a grip

[PopBitch]

And I think it's great that women

a) work and are able to (it wasn't allowed in the olden days)

b) vote and are allowed to

but I think there are still plenty of things that need doing, the gender pay gap is still there and that's unacceptable imo.

[flixx]

I'm not talking about our individual partners. My DP is fantastic. I'm talking about society in general.

For example many women are expected to go back to work after having a baby, even though being a mum is a full time job in its self.

Another perfect example. My boss is a women and works very long hours in the office and at home. She has a 1 year old baby and her
husband does the majority of childcare. But it annoys me the amount of people who have said to me recently "I don't know how she can work so many hours when she has a baby at home that she hardly sees" Now if she was a man people wouldn't be saying this, a man would be commmended for working so hard to provide for his family!

[TheCrackFox]

Dh is cooking dinner tonight and then I am going to the pub to meet up with some friends. Don't know about you but "I'm all right Jack".

[flixx]

You need to look at the bigger picture.

Threadworm makes a really good point. You wouldn't see bruce willis prancing around in his pants and knickers when he is kicking ass!

[cory]

flixx on Tue 02-Dec-08 17:10:01
"I'm not talking about our individual partners. My DP is fantastic. I'm talking about society in general.

For example many women are expected to go back to work after having a baby, even though being a mum is a full time job in its self."

Errr...what what about women who want to go back to work? And what about stay-at-home Dads? Isn't their work as valuable?

[flixx]

Another example if a couple split up it is the generally accepted norm than the kids stay with mum and dad moves out.

The odd time we hear of the mum moving out and choosing to leave kids with dad the poor women is vilified (sp?) and treated as if she isn't 'normal'

This isn't equality!

[TheGoat]

'The role of a mother is less valued by society than it has ever been when we all know that it truely is THE hardest job ever. '

i hate this sort of navel gazing. we are all part of society. some of us ahve kids ,it isnot a job it is life. no one is going to give you a medal for producing offspring. why does society have to 'value' the role of mother and how do you need it to be expressed.

[VinegarTinselTits]

YABU and probably misinformed, women have actually acheived a hell of a lot over the generations.

I dont think women have yet acheived equality but they are definately closing the gender gap by a huge amount.

And i dont agree that the role of a mother is the hardest job ever, yes it is hard but there are far worse/more difficult jobs like soilders/doctors/nurses/police and many many more.

[TheCrackFox]

But a lot of women want to go back to work full-time. I have also heard men being castigated for being too career orientated.

[saadia]

I don't think it's true, there are far more opportunities now than there previously were for women. How people run their homes is their individual family decision, but women generally can enter any profession they want to. OK they may face obstacles and prejudice but the law is now on their side.

I think if you look back in history at what women's lives were like - not allowed to own their own property, not allowed to vote, forced to marry according to their families' wishes, very little autonomy generally, denied a meaningful education - then you have to admit that progress has been made.

[Miyazaki]

I think they have achieved an awful bloody lot. I wouldn't want to time travel back to a pre-suffragette era AT ALL.

I have much more equality in my relationship, in my work life, even financially and legally than my mum did. And that's just one generation.

[flixx]

saadia "women generally can enter any profession they want to. OK they may face obstacles and prejudice" Exactly!!! because we aren't regarded as equal!!!

VinegarTits "I dont think women have yet acheived equality but they are definately closing the gender gap by a huge amount" We still haven't closed it enough though!

You are all saying I am unreasonable and then you follow it up with comments that actually agree with what I'm saying!!

[Miyazaki]

No, you said "all those generations of women who have battled for equality for years have actually achieved nothing!"

which is quite patently untrue.

[saadia]

I'm not saying that there is perfect equality, just that a lot of progress has been made, things are much better than they were and I am very gratefuk to those generations of women who fought for this.