Would you want capital punishment back?

[Mynameisnew]

There are people who do such vile things in this country and are jailed for a decade or two. Perhaps released for good behaviour a bit earlier.

Afaik CP was stopped amongst other reasons because there were a number of errors made and innocent people being convicted.

But these days with DNA proof or cases where it is on cctv /phone messages or has been admitted (thinking of Emma Tustin)

Would it not make a good deterrent? Even if one person is saved from being murdered...

I appreciate that in the USA people still commit murder, but they also have guns there which means a higher incidence of spur of the moment violence.

But a sustained campaign of abuse - would such an abuser as Tustin have been put off if CP was an option, even if very rarely used?

It's easy for me to say that I would be deterred, but I'm not a psychopathic and sadistic person so the issue is, it's hard to say if people like that would be put off such a crime. Perhaps it doesn't even enter their heads that it's wrong.

[Mynameisnew]

Bit of a rambling OP there, sorry!

Hope you can unpick it.

[EngTech]

I agree up to a point but there have been a few miscarriages of justice

Can’t bring people back if they are found innocent later 😳

[Mynameisnew]

No, that's kind of where I am too. But whenever there's a particularly awful crime, it just gets me thinking.

[LunarEclipseWinterSolstice]

I'm going to say no because honestly death is too good, too kind and too easy for these scumbags. They need to suffer over time in stead.

[TartanDMs]

When capital punishment was in place, did people stop murdering? Of course not, because there were still hangings so must have been eligible crimes committed. Did innocent people get hanged? Yes. Can that be changed? No. Look at America where the death penalty is in place - people sentenced to death row daily.

I think it's such an emotive subject but although I abhor what Emma Tustin and her partner did, and others who have committed similar offences, to me the thought that they have to live with that for the rest of their lives, and will have a difficult painful time in prison, is the punishment. I don't think that she would have been deterred by anything, because she clearly wasn't thinking like a rational, normal person when being so abusive.

Bringing back the death penalty is a kneejerk sentiment which is sort of understandable in the heat of the moment, but as a solution it doesn't really deter.

[BustedCanOfBiscuits]

Nope, never

[araiwa]

countries with death penalty don't have any murders?

[Insert1x20p]

No- it's a really inefficient system once you have all the appeals etc.

Plus I'm not sure it's that much of a deterrent. People either assume they wouldn't get caught or would probably be fairly indifferent between a life sentence and getting killed.

I think life should be life though.

[Mynameisnew]

@TartanDMs good points. But I think she was so dreadful over such a prolonged period that I don't think it was a case of her not thinking like a rational person, I think she is in the category of psychopath - totally lacking in empathy.

I don't think that living with it for the rest of her life will bother her. I'm also afraid that she won't have too bad of a time in prison, but those are separate issues from my original op.

[RilkeanHeart]

No.
Some people do abhorrent and barbaric things. The state shouldn’t do abhorrent and barbaric things in response.

[Aussiegirl123456]

I think if there’s absolutely zero doubt that the perp committed a heinous crime then yes.

I mean zero doubt though, so not just relying on DNA evidence alone if there’s a million to one chance it could have been planted, a set up or a coincidence.

I know a million people will disagree though.

Where I live, years ago a young teenage boy was lured into a car, sexually assaulted and killed. His killer is frequently tortured in prison despite being in protective custody. That makes me guiltily happy he’s still alive to suffer. I don’t even care if that makes me sound heartless.

[starrynight21]

I don't believe that CP has ever acted as a deterrent. People don't stop doing something because of what might happen to them if they get caught . That might happen with things like driving, where you know you'll get a big fine if you speed and so you don't speed. But things like murder, I don't think people's brains comprehend that they are doing something that bad.

The detestable murderers of little Arthur probably thought that they were teaching him a lesson or something similar. And they apparently thought they would never be caught. I doubt very much that they ever would have stopped what they were doing because they were afraid of the punishment they'd get if they were found out.

I prefer the US punishment of "life without the possibility of parole" which effectively condemns the person to an eternity behind bars.

[Topseyt]

No. It is state sponsored murder.

It is also so totally irreversible in the event of a miscarriage of justice, which is always a possibility.

[Mynameisnew]

@starrynight21

I think in the USA they also stack up sentences consecutively so she could be jailed for 200 years or so, a year for each bruise for example, serving as proof of a beating.

[Seafog]

I don't support capital punishment because it can't be undone.
I would love to see flogging brought back though.

[ilovesooty]

Absolutely not. There's no evidence it's a deterrent anyway.

[foxgoosefinch]

No. It’s inhumane and not the mark of a civilised society. Read about how it’s carried out in the US - the actual mechanics of it - it’s not something that’s acceptable to carry out (and to expect other humans to carry out and be involved in) given the methods, the outcomes and the whole prison and legal culture around it - before you even get to the ethics of it.

[AnotherOneWithNoGoodName]

No. Regardless of anything else/any other argument, no government should never have the power to decide who lives and who does not. It's as simple as that for me.
I do agree that whole life sentences should be used more often.

[Zotter]

Never!

[Coyoacan]

Even with DNA evidence, US prisons are still full of wrongfully convicted prisoners. And as for the deterrent factor, that doesn't work. Life in prison would be enough of a deterrent, if it did.

[HangingDitch]

No, it shouldn’t come back.

It’s not a deterrent.

Mistakes do happen.

I disagree with it on moral grounds.

[DinosaurDuvet]

No. Let’s not forget the grave injustices against the Guildford 4, “Justice” Donaldson said in his closing statements that it was regrettable that he could no longer impose the death penalty. In this case there was irrefutable evidence they were innocent but it was hidden by the police and prosecution. The justice system was rotten to the core and I don’t think any evidence can be considered as 100% safe. Even confessions.

I can understand why someone would want to murder someone who hurt their loved one, but for the state to do it in cold blood is every bit as vile as the original crime. What sort of a person would take on that job? 🤯

Not only that, but the amounts of appeals etc would make it much more expensive than just keeping them. But make life mean life behind bars

[plinkplinkfizzer]

Going by this Arthur's Mother would be dead too .🤨

[lisaandalan]

Yes definitely let them who have killed little Arthur be the first ones, these vile vile things don't deserve to breathe.

[lisaandalan]

They should not be able to appeal either if they know they did it.