Talk

Advanced search

To think the idea that schools won’t be back full time by September is an absolute disgrace?

(1000 Posts)
LovingLivingInLockdown Sat 13-Jun-20 22:36:04

The government and teaching unions need to pull their fingers out. There should be no excuses.

The effects of 6 months out of school is going to be damaging enough, both educationally and mentally for hundreds of thousands of children. Not to mention the unnoticed abuse and neglect.

Teachers should be wearing PPE with spit screens if they are vulnerable and this should be being organised now. Temporary classrooms should be being built in playgrounds and school fields. Random testing routines in all schools should be being devised as well as guidelines regarding children’s contact with others outside of school and home. Whatever it takes, it must be done.

Our society expects parents to work while their DC are at school and if they want to get the economy moving again, schools being back by September should be non negotiable surely?

OP’s posts: |
cantkeepawayforever Wed 17-Jun-20 10:16:53

I think we also have to be very careful about what is an individual teacher's responsibility, and what is a function of Government or Headteacher policy.

Schools not open / partially open: Government policy, or in some cases local Public health policy.

Overall decision about home learning: Headteacher

Delivery of home learning in line with school policy: Teacher

So if a school as a whole is not delivering good home learning, that is not the individual teacher's fault, but lies wholly with the head. If, on the other hand, 6 classes out of 7 have good home learning but 1 teacher is not delivering the same, that is down to the individual teacher.

karenwgvyxeukhlfbyvuje Wed 17-Jun-20 10:19:55

Yes I agree, this whole covid thing is made up by nasa to get our money, but im enjoying wine and coupons so I don't care

wizzbangfizz Wed 17-Jun-20 11:30:35

we aren't imagining the lack of input and when teachers come on here doubting parents, rather than the colleagues they haven't met - that's what's infuriating.

This. And I have complained and have been told that this is all that can be provided due to resource pressure. I am paying for 1 hour online tuition for each of them a week but can't afford to do more. Also what is infuriating is a complete "it can't be done attitude". Zero inclination to find a way it can work.

LaurieMarlow Wed 17-Jun-20 11:34:54

we aren't imagining the lack of input and when teachers come on here doubting parents, rather than the colleagues they haven't met - that's what's infuriating.

Absolutely this. I actually can’t understand it. I’d be raging if a bunch of lazy colleagues were trashing the reputation of my profession.

LolaSmiles Wed 17-Jun-20 11:44:38

I think we also have to be very careful about what is an individual teacher's responsibility, and what is a function of Government or Headteacher policy.

Schools not open / partially open: Government policy, or in some cases local Public health policy.

Overall decision about home learning: Headteacher

Delivery of home learning in line with school policy: Teacher

This with bells on, which is precisely why the millions of 'lazy, work shy teachers' threads are nothing but goady.

If someone has an issue that their child's over-capacity school isn't open fully and doing the full timetable they want, no amount of sitting on Mumsnet bitching about teachers is going to make any difference, and it's misplaced anger anyway as it's not like teachers can magic up a new school site by positive thinking.
The government have said schools can only welcome back students where there is no additional cost as the government will not be funding the adjustments. I seriously hope all the posters giving it 'lazy teachers don't want to work' (especially those on almost every thread making such claims) are writing to the DfE, making their local MPs aware and doing something other than sitting on mumsnet whining about a profession. I doubt they are though as a good number of them probably routinely voted in the governments that have messed with education for a decade.

nicenames Wed 17-Jun-20 11:47:00

I totally agree. I understand why teachers might be feeling defensive. And that mumsnet is a hotbed of complaints (some reasonable some unreasonable) about teachers even at the best of times.

BUT, there have been quite a lot of instances we here a parent trying to wfh has said "shit, I am struggling to do both, the resources given by my school are terrible, with no contact from them and no marking so I am struggling to motivate my children to work when their teacher seems to have forgotten about them and I am slowly sinking under the weight of work and trying to find resources myself to support my child's school work and I have complained to the school but I still haven't got any support" and has been met with one of:

1. "I am a teacher and I can wfh and manage my kids' learning quite easily, why can't you. You can't be trying hard enough", which leads people to suspect that either they are a very skilful teacher (which many parents are not, having been thrown in the deep end) OR it is easy for them because they are not really doing much work, or are able to do that work in quieter moments in evenings etc because they are actually able to choose their hours, unlike some people who have to work office hours in order to do anything.

OR

2. "Why haven't you brought this up with the school, there is a pandemic on and you must be unreasonable. All teachers are working harder than usual if anything and all criticism is unfounded".

FrippEnos Wed 17-Jun-20 11:52:58

nicenames

Or
3/ Help and information.

Northernsoulgirl45 Wed 17-Jun-20 12:19:00

Or I am a teacher and my children are being neglected as I am working to support my students.

nicenames Wed 17-Jun-20 12:33:40

Yes @FrippEnos @Northernsoulgirl45

I agree that lots of teachers are offering at least support and sympathy (and empathy from doing it themselves). But there are a few on here who simply cannot bring themselves to consider that a parent might have a legitimate point, just like there are a few parents on here who don't seem to understand that most teachers will be doing the best they can and fail to empathise with them. This just makes people angrier and more entrenched.

Parents compare stories on here precisely to work out what is normal / good provision in these unusual circumstances. In most cases this is not intended to be teacher bashing - most people just care about their kids' education and want to understand what is out there. Of course they are not able to take the teachers' individual circumstances and the schools' individual circumstances fully into account in the comparison, but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't seek to compare.

FrippEnos Wed 17-Jun-20 12:41:12

nicenames

I accept (as do the other teachers on here) that parents have valid complaints/points to be made.
But parents should also accept that what they consider good provision for their child is not good provision for all children.
Zoom does not work for every child
Handouts don't work for every child
Audio files on powerpoints don't work for every child.

Yes, parents are being asked to do some of the teachers job (in fact it is the best bit of the teachers job IMHO).

But the argument has become polarized due to the belligerence of some posters, and yes I am one of them because I will no longer stand for the crap that is being posted by the same names all of the time.

nicenames Wed 17-Jun-20 13:02:00

@FrippEnos

I totally understand.

I think (hope) we can all agree that sending a few worksheets and a couple of links to bite size or oak academy without any other contact and no marking or feedback (which is what some parents have complained about) is a bit crap.

As is offering little other than a video of the lovely things you have done with your own kids

As is the fact that my best friend got zero communication about teaching or school opening for more than two months for her reception child and they have only just managed it in mid June).

And some of the "you just can't be bothered to educate your own child" is pretty awful.

But that doesn't mean that a full virtual timetable or any of the other things on offer work either. I totally agree that it is not for parents to decide what works best for the spread of pupils a teacher has and what is feasible in the circumstances. And I think that parents have to understand that what teachers are doing is highly unusual and give them the benefit of the doubt where possible. And the lazy teacher rhetoric is offensive.

nicenames Wed 17-Jun-20 13:03:56

And by only just managed it I don't mean the school opening, I mean the communication about the school opening! Even a holding email would be considered courteous when you know that other kids have already gone back and the parents at your school have had no communication at all.

CallmeAngelina Wed 17-Jun-20 13:06:07

@nicenames I think I have read most, if not all, of the "teachers are shit" threads, and I don't recall one single teacher saying, "I can wfh quite easily, so why can't you?" Or, "all criticism is unfounded."

Twinklelittlestar1 Wed 17-Jun-20 13:06:27

I haven't seen any poster ask for help though? Or are we supposed to see the blatant teacher bashing as a cry for help?

I for one would be willing to help and support parents who feel they are struggling. You're not wrong about how hard this situation is and trying to juggle working along with home learning is just so hard. Even at my school with many sahp- kids are bored and disengaged and the reality is that learning should be active and interactive and that's so difficult to achieve at home, never mind in the middle of a pandemic or with trying to juggle other commitments. You end up pulled in so many directions and feeling like you're failing at everything. It's bloody hard.

You're not wrong for wanting kids back in school because it's where they (usually) learn best. But this has to be done in the best way possible, the safest way. If we don't put things in place now and instead just open fully without protective measures to mitigate the spread then outbreaks will happen leading to school closures. (I also think individuals would end up missing more school because other bugs will be passed on and children will have to miss school for every cough/ temperature/ sneeze which they'll be more likely to catch if we operate as we used to in large groups with no social distancing whatsoever)

Also re the home learning and lack of support, I, a teacher, cannot answer that or be answerable for how your child's school is doing things so I can't comment but I do understand the need for support and agree that this needs tightening up so there's more consistency across schools. At my school we are evolving and improving the provision daily but it's a new way of working and one we had no preparation for so we're very much learning and adapting as we go along.

Frozenfan2019 Wed 17-Jun-20 13:07:49

Why are you all still moaning on here about it? We teachers on here can't do anything about it. We are busy sitting back with a cocktail watching box sets while our own kids play Fortnite.

You have three options
1) complain to the relevant person at the school (but they probably won't care because essentially they are on holiday and they'll probably have already started on he Malibu and coke)
2) complain to your MP about the government's approach. (But if they're Tory they probably won't do anything about it because Dominic Cummings has something on them and if they're not Tory they can't do anything anyway)
3) spend some time putting together your own learning programme for your kids at the weekend ( it's lots of extra work but you did have the kids so presumably it's your vocation).
4) moan on here even though it will achieve nothing and cause upset

FrippEnos Wed 17-Jun-20 13:10:49

nicenames

The problem is that it is a balance.

For a MAT child a worksheet is pretty crap, for a child with a SEND a worksheet maybe too much, and there is a whole range inbetween.

It would be impossible to set a single piece of work for a class that covers all of the different levels.
And often any work that is differentiated is done at the lowest level by all pupils because it is easy and quick. (I suspect that this is where some of the complaints actually come from)

There is no simple answer to what schools are trying to do.

And some of the "you just can't be bothered to educate your own child" is pretty awful.

Unfortunately in some cases it is also the truth.

MarshaBradyo Wed 17-Jun-20 13:14:56

Fripp yes it is differentiation as well as active learning that is good in the classroom.

We’ve found our own way now for the first which is proving better, the second is hard though because children are much more motivated together at school.

FrippEnos Wed 17-Jun-20 13:18:55

MarshaBradyo

the second is hard though because children are much more motivated together at school.

Generally yes, but some are and some are not.

Some of the best work that I have had submitted is from pupils that have struggled in lessons. but at home no distractions, no chatty friends and possibly the reward of extra console time if they complete it.

One size doesn't fit all.

MaryMcCarthy Wed 17-Jun-20 13:18:56

I suppose we'll just have to wait until the Prime Minister Keir Starmer confirms that schools are safe.

poisson428 Wed 17-Jun-20 13:21:54

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

MarshaBradyo Wed 17-Jun-20 13:23:05

Fripp I can see that, not true here unfortunately. Teen responds very well to school and marks show it, ten year old can really engage with stuff on adhoc case (ie watches stuff of own accord plus school), long term with home schooling it’s harder.

But yes I’m sure some dc can. I wonder what the split is, maybe mine are not in majority.

Rainbow12e Wed 17-Jun-20 13:28:01

I am astounded at how many posts this thread has.
Clearly all the kids will be bzck at school full-time in September. The numbers will be down to zero by then and the governmemt know they have have start getting kids back to school. Please, all stop worrying.

Rainbow12e Wed 17-Jun-20 13:28:42

back

poisson428 Wed 17-Jun-20 13:29:27

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

FrippEnos Wed 17-Jun-20 13:30:20

Rainbow12e

Given those going to the beach and the BLM protests + the statue (whatever the hell they are), we will have to wait and see.

This thread is not accepting new messages.