This is a Premium feature
To use this feature subscribe to Mumsnet Premium - get first access to new features see fewer ads, and support Mumsnet.Start using Mumsnet Premium
To ask for advice on what to say to persuade my DBro to take this offer?(10 Posts)
Long story short (I posted on the alcohol support topic in depth) but I am not originally from the UK but settled here about 10 years ago with my parents and DBro as they came for work.
DBro is living with my parents who are "functioning" alcoholics (they have been known to go 3-4 days at a time drunk) and he's utterly miserable. If he moves out he will be barely scraping by, he's got a small group of friends but no partner and all his friends are now settled with longterm partners in steady jobs and so on and I know he feels like a spare part sometimes.
He works with my DF and he's either working or gaming and isn't heading in any particular direction at the moment but I know that's also due to his current surroundings, he's down a lot and very negative, he has in the past dabbled in illegal substances and got into fights on nights out, he has also been suicidal.
He is really growing to hate my parents because of the way they are, my DGM and DGF (60s/fit and healthy/ v active and retired) have recently caught wind of the situation with my parents and have basically offered for him to move back to our home country, work here, have a room/part of their large 5 bed 3 bath house rent free, all meals cooked and groceries provided, provide him with a car and even pay for a course/university if he wants to do some part time studies whilst he works. They are putting no pressure on and say he's welcome to have his friends from the uk visit and stay in the house if they do and he can come and just try it for 6 months and see how he feels and if not he can return to the UK no questions asked.
They are not massively rich but are comfortable and retired and have no other family around so I can imagine they would enjoy the company too. They are trying to give him a clean slate and a better start, he's early 20s so he can easily establish a career in our home country, the economy over there is on the up and wages are now better and better vs living costs.
Down the line he would even be able to build his own property as my DGF has a few plots of building land and he would happily give one to DBro if he wanted it. He's likely to be unable to achieve this in the uk for the foreseeable future especially with the way things are for him at the moment.
I realise this is his decision in the end but he sometimes tends to let opportunities pass and then realise too late that he should've grabbed them instead.
He's a wonderful, bright, intelligent lad who has been completely trampled on over the years and is now very short sighted in what he thinks he can achieve in life and very downbeat and negative about everything. He lives in a not so great area with not so great people and he's beginning to conform to that way of life too.
I really want to talk to him and gently nudge him to take my DGPs up on this offer as I think it's a once in a lifetime and very few people ever get a chance for a fresh start like this.
Any suggestions on good arguments and how I could approach and have this conversation with a very stubborn person who is down and basically thinks "this is it for me" when he thinks about his future?
Well all your reasoning is set out perfectly above. I would ask him what he would want you to do if your situations were reversed. I would ask him if he might regret staying ten years down the line. It sounds like he is depressed and it's hard to make a big change like this when you are depressed. Could he sort that here and now. I know exercise is a simple start - is he interested in any sports or exercise?
How lucky he is to have you in his corner. Sometimes just being there for him is all you can do. Frustrating I know. You sound like a wonderful sister.
I can sympathise with your brother as when you're in a rut of any kind it can be EXTREMELY hard to get out of it.
I agree that it would be such a shame if he let this opportunity pass but he has to really want to do it for himself. If he's being pushed into something he doesn't really want it is likely to lower his confidence
Thanks @SummerHouse he has been jogging and doing an exercise challenge recently but it doesn't take much for him to go from a good to a bad mood. He's often just retreating to his room and gaming online with his friends, he doesn't get on with my parents so doesn't like being around them in the rest of the house. When he doesn't want to no force on heaven or earth will make him do something.
@StirlingWork I think you have it spot on with the stuck in a rut. In a bad way he's gotten comfortable in his current situation in that he doesn't have many duties at work, doesn't have many outgoings, has his room with his consoles and his computer and everything which what I can only imagine is a "safe space" where he can just retreat to and he doesn't have to put himself out there too much. He's got the small group of friends that's a bit on and off depending on how busy they are with their SOs and the odd night out.
But realistically he has no ties here, no own home, no partner, no career and technically nothing holding him back. My parents are young and don't need support and he's definitely not expected to keep them in check with their drinking they are adults, I would of course prefer him local rather than thousands of kilometres away but I think he's 10000 x better over there and we travel to visit DGPs anyway so would see him regularly and he's more than welcome to visit too.
If I was in his shoes I would be on the next available flight out.
"and have no other family around so I can imagine they would enjoy the company too"
Would the offer come with strings attached? Is the dating/ married life similar to the UK?
It dounds good on paper, but would his life, once he gets out of a rut, really be compatible with their vision?
Why aren't they offering support for him to get his own place in the UK?
Also would this be given on the basis that if they needed care, he would provide it?
The other thing that struck me OP after reading your post is this. Yes, on paper realistically it sounds a great opportunity. It sounds like he has nothing much to say for that's solid. I mean, his relationship with you will stay the same, in essence, I'd have thought no matter how near or far he is. It sounds as those his friends are occupied with their new lives for someone like me who can look at your brother's situation from the outside and don't know him personally so can be more objective, if you like, it would also be bad for your brother's self esteem to be the 'hanger on' in the friendship group - sort of hankering after an invite 'cos feels he's no other 'life' iyswim. Sorry I couldn't think of a better expression to use than 'hanger on'.
I was in exactly the same position as your brother in 2009 = had nothing to stay for in my home town so moved 100 miles away.
My opinion is for the next few years it would be better for your brother to spend time in your grandparents' country. However, what if within the next say 10 years your brother would have fully recovered etc and has set himself up well, would it be feasible for him then to return to the UK, this time obviously fully able to support himself and build a new social network. You see, in the long term, he may want to return to the UK to continue to build a career and raise a family etc because he's used to UK culture.
@Ponoka7 it's not about care, they have said he can trial it for 6 months and go back if it's not for him. They are happy to help, they have given money/helped before with different things but I think they believe he will be better off in their environment rather than just throw cash at him when he's in a rut as it's more likely to just dissolve rather than be spent on something useful. Plus their money won't go half as far in the uk as it would in our home country.
Nothing cultural re marriages he's free to date/marry whoever he wants / stay single or whatever, there's no expectation.
I think they are genuinely worried about him, worried that my parents are causing more and more damage and that the environment he's in is making things worse for him. If they get to have some family around whilst helping them out then for them it's a bonus as life has strewn all of their kids abroad and my parents are the only ones which had DCs so they don't have much young company around just their friends/neighbours of similar ages.
Biggest regrets are often things we do NOT do.
Sometimes you have to be a bit brave and take a chance.
Positives and negatives balance sheet?
Please login first.