...to not understand why so many parents post constantly wondering why their child wakes through the night?

[sleepingtroub]

Post after post.
"My child is 5mo and wakes during the night to feed"
"How can I implement a routine on my 5week old?"
"How can I get my 6mo to sleep in their own room without waking up"

When did it get to this?

These are all normal things.

Before I was even old enough to have a child I was fully aware of the concept: baby = no sleep
Obviously it's not as bad as that 24/7 but why are so many parents expecting their old sleep routines to continue when they have a baby?

[Toomanygerbils]

I don’t think they are expecting anything OP, I think they are posting for advice and support. They are tired and wanting interaction like everyone else, Including you, when they post here

You post hoping for a response

They post hoping for a response

The only difference is you post hoping for a negative response against a struggling mother

So who is the better person here?

[Kirkman]

Its great that you know that. Well done.

But unfortunately theres a distinct line that if you do everything right that your baby will sleep through the night.
Competitive parents who brag about how great their baby sleeps (usually forgetting to mention the nights they dont sleep), older people insisting their kids slept through from night one (I am convinced lots of these just dont remember).

Lots of people in RL dont want to admit they find it hard, or their child isnt a 'dream'.

People talking about it and asking questions is good. Because it let's people know it's normal.

When you havent had a full night sleep for 3 years (both of mine did this) and everyone else apparantly has babies that sleep from day one, you can end up thinking you are the issue. You feel shit and seek help. No biggie.

Also I dont think anyone can really understand how bad sleep deprivation is, until they experience it. Again, lots of people internalise that. They arent coping so it must something they are doing wrong.

[sleepingtroub]

We all struggle with sleep.

I'm not talking about the struggle. It's the expectation. The opinion that these things aren't normal.

I'm wondering if health visitors/ midwives etc aren't gearing new parents up with this info.

[sleepingtroub]

Sorry that was to gerbils

[Toomanygerbils]

OP if you want to start a thread about how you are struggling with sleep I’m sure lots of people will be there to help and support you

But to start one criticising and belittling parents isn’t the way to go

[Kirkman]

No one can gear you up for it though.

In my experience, MW and HV, will try their best. But they arent going to tell you all the horror stories.

And again, if you are sleep deprived and feel that everyone elses babies sleep well, you will think it's you. You are doing something wrong. Not that it's normal.

How about we just dont judge sleep deprived parents who are trying their best, looking for advice and struggling.

[OpportunityKnocks]

Because they are very tired and would like some sleep. So they ask for advice.
Some babies do sleep longer stretches from earlier on than others and perhaps they wouldn't mind having a turn.

[sleepingtroub]

Competitive parents who brag about how great their baby sleeps (usually forgetting to mention the nights they dont sleep), older people insisting their kids slept through from night one (I am convinced lots of these just dont remember).

Totally agree with this. And the posts such as "my 6 month old is walking and talking" I find them insensitive

When I see responses to these threads very few actually say it's normal. A lot actually advocate sleep training, night weaning without the realisation that this is normal.

I'm similar to you 25 months on and still waking frequently and sometimes I'm like ah I need a break (single parent) which is fine, I'm just wondering why these things aren't included during our pregnancies etc (that waking up is normal)

[sleepingtroub]

@Toomanygerbils No, I wouldn't really do that. I know the responses would be, "stop breastfeeding, sleep train"
I'm not criticising at all. I'm just wondering why it's not put out there more that this is normal. When I gave birth I was given leaflets about breast milk and formula etc but not about wakings during the night. I don't see my health visitor anymore but I wonder if I spoke to her about my lo waking up frequently if she would say it's normal or not.
Saying that, when I've contacted the breastfeeding helpline about thrush the lady was helpful in telling me it's normal to have growth spurts where they wake up more frequently.

[Kirkman]

They are included. But the parents you are talking about are knackered.

We are all guilty of not thinking quite right when tired. The babies that sleep through tend to be the ones that stick in your mind. Not that next door but one hasnt slept for 6 months either.

[tobee]

I fully expected bad sleep with my babies. You can imagine it coz you've had one or two bad night's sleep in a row.

But what is really hard to imagine is nights and nights, weeks and weeks, months and months of it! Not just one's own body waking up/not sleeping, but being woken up by another human being. It's punishing! There's often no respite!

[Toomanygerbils]

Op, I think you meant well but it came across very arrogant and impatient in your first post. Maybe instead try another post with helpful advice offered by health visitors and from your experience. It will be welcomed!

[sleepingtroub]

Like I said I'm not judging sleep deprived parents.
What I'm wondering is why we don't know this is normal.
If I hadn't researched extensively I, too, would think my 2 year old has abnormal sleep patterns as my mum, grandma etc were all "stop breastfeeding, they should sleep longer"
So I understand that side, but why is it not explained enough?
The same with the pain from breastfeeding, I wasn't prepared for it at all. It was excruciating

[sleepingtroub]

@Toomanygerbils This is what I mean. I didn't receive any helpful advice from them.
is it covered in antenatal classes, I wonder
I was an impatient throughout my pregnancy so I didn't have a chance to go to any

I also see people mentioning books where they say babies sleep through, it's so unrealistic

[AgeOld]

I think it's to do with the media as well. You don't often see a mum sitting for hours feeding and rocking a baby and then saying "right. I'm off to bed now as well as this will wake up in 3hrs... bye".
Plus people without kids often just think babies just go in a basket when tired and go to sleep. I had a friend over and said I'm off to put baby to bed, then came out after a minute as I'd forgotten something and they thought the baby was all done and asleep. 😂
I think as well people often hide what goes on. I certainly am more open now but with my first I didn't tell people I feed the baby at night for 2hrs then pop them into bed and get woken up every 3hrs after. Because when you do, people think you're stupid, like you're just inept, like the reason your baby hates the Moses basket for naps is just because you're a moron who wants to carry a baby all day and never wash.

[BillHadersNewWife]

What I hate is all the buzz words for developmental stages..."Three month regression" "Baby Led Weaning"

These phrases are made up by people selling books.

Baby Led Weaning is just "giving the baby a bit of what you're eating' and something my Mum did with me in the 70s because it was easier than cooking little meals and better than giving me jars... and saying all babies have a 'regression' at a certain time is just bollocks.

They change like the wind, as and when they want to.

[Patienceisvirtuous]

I sort of agree OP. I especially cringe when it’s in relation to really young babies. Ffs it really does come with the territory.

What I do understand is it’s me projecting though. I waited years for my precious bundle. He’s nearly three now and the first two years were tough re lack of sleep. I didn’t really care though, just went with his flow and used my reserves. ...Understand it must be very different if you have more than one. But just let them be little rather than trying to force a sleep regime so early.

[sleepingtroub]

and said I'm off to put baby to bed, then came out after a minute as I'd forgotten something and they thought the baby was all done and asleep. 😂

😁😁😁😁😁

If only.

I agree Re being open. I try to do that as much as possible too. Along with feeding in public.

Age Oh yes, the typical "you're baby is doing xyz because you are conditioning them to"
Was talking to my auntie a while back saying how I will let my child self wean from breastfeeding and the response was, "you can't let dc feed till their school age just because you want them to" 🙄

[sleepingtroub]

@BillHadersNewWife Sort of see what hoyed saying but then I guess they name them because nowadays we all Google etc maybe?

[sleepingtroub]

@Patienceisvirtuous


But just let them be little

This ^

There seems to be a rush to force babies to grow up.
"They should be walking/ crawling/ talking by now"

I look back on pictures and miss the early days. Time passes so quickly, enjoy the early years

[Rosehip345]

Maybe it’s just because it’s not your normal?
I mean what exactly is normal for a baby?
Pretty sure they’re all different, that said I can’t wait for this baby to arrive so that I can get some sleep 🤣
Seriously my normal is obviously just different to yours!

[Monty27]

There's no normal for a baby so how is the rest of the world supposed to understand your baby?
That's what parenting is about.
Not the internet.
No offence anyone. Internet wasn't available when I had mine.
I just communicated with the child.

[knittedgoldfish]

But some babies do sleep through from a young age, as young as 5/6 months. That's normal for them. Even breastfed ones - I think it is a myth that breastfed babies sleep much worse isn't it? My older child stopped waking for feeds just before 7 months. We didn't night wean, she just stopped waking.

A lot of baby sleep is down to luck but most parents want there to be a magic bullet that gets their child sleeping because they are exhausted. There isn't really one, but good consistent habits (e.g. keeping the lights off from the same time every night, bedtime at the same time every day) help both babies and adults to sleep more easily so there may be some things they can practically do to improve the situation.

I find the opposite a lot of the time on here - some people seem to think doing anything to help a baby sleep better is some form of child abuse and parents should just accept babies and toddlers waking every hour because "its normal", even if it's making the entire household- baby included - totally miserable. The responses to these threads are usually half recommending sleep training (which can involve gentle methods with no crying) and the other half just saying accept it because its normal.

Anyway, night waking was covered in the antenatal classes I did before I had my first yes.

[marmitepasta]

I honestly thought that my twins would be sleeping through by 6 months because that seemed to be the norm or at least what people said around me.
Well, two later they were still waking! 🤣 and yes I remember desperately posting in her looking gif magic answers, thinking I was doling everything wrong when actually if was pretty Norman.

[Ozziewozzie]

Your still missing the point OP.
Parents aren’t posting in here because they feel a waking baby is abnormal. We all realise that a baby or toddler, in some instances, children too can wake at night.
It’s about reaching out for ideas, support to try and move through those stages.
It’s not always easy to come up with a structured plan or new ideas when your smack bang in the middle of what feels like rubbish.
Hv and midwives don’t throw upon you the reality of child birth either, so as not to panic us. We all know it’s pretty painful, but that doesn’t stop us from feeling panicked, scared, and unable to cope whilst in the throws of it all.
Other parents can offer a wealth of ideas and experience. A baby waking regularly throughout the night may be fairly normal, but it doesn’t feel normal for the parent to be woken throughout the night.
We all know babies cry to communicate. But it doesn’t stop us from feeling desperate when it’s actually happening and reaching out for support or ideas.
It’s obvious trillions have had babies, but when it’s you, you can feel so alone in going through the various stages. Our instincts tell us to soothe, nurture and care. Sometimes parents just need reassurance that it’s not something they are doing wrong and that everyone else’s baby isn’t sleeping perfectly through the night.