DH and the Queen Bee

[justilou1]

Apologies.... it’s a long one.
My DH and I have been married for 16 yrs and have 3 teenagers. He has known one group of friends since high school and they’re mostly lovely guys, but there is one girl who has been single for most of the time we have been together and has made it clear to all the wives and partners of the guys in the group that she is the “Queen Bee” and via various passive aggressive comments at the beginnings of our relationships, she has implied that she chose not to get involved romantically with whichever of the guys we happen to be with, but they were all secretly in love with her. None of us believe her, and we ignore that, see it for what it is and over the years have forged a friendship for what it is.
I thought..... I don’t for one minute think that my DH is actually secretly in love with her at all, so this is not coming from this kind of insecurity. DH and I are in counselling stemming from me feeling betrayed when I tried to discuss my ptsd after repressed rape memories began to return and he refused to have the conversation because he was going through his own shit and was already feeling resentful towards me. Obviously physical intimacy is a massive issue for me because of these two situations. The Queen Bee has recently admitted that she broke up with her boyfriend in FEBRUARY (her longest relationship in the time I have known her) and hasn’t spoken to anyone about this. They went out together for a couple of drinks in a group.... all good. Then last weekend we all went out for dinner at a pub where there were two different football games showing. She was VERY friendly towards me. All good. After the games were over and she’d had several more drinks, she brought up in conversation that she knew that DH and I weren’t having sex and hadn’t for a long time. It was abundantly clear that he hadn’t taken responsibility for his side of things at all despite repeatedly saying so to my face. (Not the rape, that was years before we met, but the arsehole behaviour.) When I confronted him later about having this conversation, he said that he has the right to talk to his friends about how this affects him, but he couldn’t talk about my rape as that was invading my privacy. I think that was a cop out to avoid looking like an arsehole. I’m hurt and feel like I’ve been betrayed again. What do you think? (*btw - he has more insight than most, he has been raped himself, and I have helped him through some very dark times and some awful behaviour of his own.)

[TheKarateKitty]

First thing I want to say is sorry for what happened to you.

She sure does come across as immature, at best.

They both overstepped a boundary. He shouldn’t share what’s private between you two, especially with someone like that.

She should’ve stopped him from going on when he started to tell her.
I have done when someone started to overshare information about their partner. I know for sure their partner wouldn’t appreciate it, nor would I!

She certainly shouldn’t have then told you.

I’ve had that, btw, from my ex husband as well as my parents.

My parents, one big example was my divorce. They loved telling me what they thought I should do, and would “back up” it all by throwing in what each of their coworkers thought, and even the family dentist.

I do think you overshared that last bit about him though.

Talk to him about it, talk about it in therapy. I hope he will listen and admit he was wrong. She needs to apologize too.

[boptist]

I do think you overshared that last bit about him though.

Do you mean on MN? I think that the OP is anonymous enough.

[Jesaminecollins]

What is this "Queen Bee" stuff all about? I prefer to call them attention seeking women that think they are pretty but are dillusional and pretty average looking - well the so call popular girls when I was at school were like that. There was one called Jill who really thought she was the bees knees - I bumped into her a few years ago and she has aged quite badly she now is wrinkly and looks like a monkey - I blame too much sun bathing and smoking.

I would tell her to keep her opinions to herself and your husband - what was he thinking? confiding in a poisonous egotistic woman like that! - she need putting straight imho and told quite bluntly to butt out and mind her own business and she has no room to talkin seeing she can't keep a man and has no children or anything else significant in her pathetic life.

[Jesaminecollins]

no room to talk

[TheKarateKitty]

@boptist No, not because it’s MN. I find it’s doing what he did. Oversharing, even if it’s anonymous.

[boptist]

I think most of us need input from a third party sometimes. We then have the choice of friend, colleague, therapist, MiL, dentist, MN or over-invested friend of the opposite sex.

What has your DP said about your concerns?

Personally I think you need to accept his need to talk, but I would also struggle with his choice.

[maras2]

No real advice justilou1 but I'm so sorry for your trauma (and DH being an eejit) and I wish you well.
You are so supportive of others and have a very caring take on all posters looking for advice.
I hope that someone equally as kind as you can give good advice.
Best wishes Mx.

[TheKarateKitty]

@boptist, only if it’s sharing information about oneself. IE their own issues within themselves.

It wasn’t my parents place to share very personal information about ME. I certainly didn’t need the advice of their friends about MY life. They weren’t some anonymous people either. If I’d wanted their opinions, I would have asked. It also contradicted their own “don’t air dirty laundry.”

It wasn’t OP’s husband’s place to share info about her, especially to someone like that. It has nothing to do with being a friend of the opposite sex.

[RebootYourEngine]

I have had friends confiding in me about very personal things. I have never repeated this information to anyone.

This 'queen bee' sounds quite immature and insecure.

[itsmecathycomehome]

I know a lot of women who are happy to discuss their sex lives or sex problems with friends, so I guess men are allowed to do that too.

However, he should have made a better choice of friend to confide in than the attention-seeking female friend who had previously implied that he was in love with her, and can't be discreet when in possession of sensitive knowledge.

[ShippingNews]

I must be getting old. I just don't get this idea that it's OK for a husband to have long-time female friends with whom to confide every personal matter relating to their marriage.

This "Queen Bee" sounds awful - and if my DH told someone like this about our sex life I'd pack his bags. The fact that your DH thinks it's OK would be a big red flag to me. Some things are private and this is definitely one of them.

[HennyPennyHorror]

I don't think I'd be accepting of this AT ALL.

DH and I have a pair of best friends...we'e known them nearly 20 years and they tend to tell us (separately) all the gory details of their marriage...he confides in DH and she in me...but DH and I have agreed that we'd not comfortable with ourselves doing that.

Our sex life and relationship is for US only.

It's stupid to share that intimate stuff with friends. Lines get blurred.

I'd be extremely worried. My DH would not want to be friends with someone like this woman though.

[justilou1]

Let me explain more clearly why I call her the Queen Bee - she is the only female in the group of friends from high school. She has been proprietary with every single one of the guys. She is not good at relationships of her own, and yes, I will agree with the assessment that she is quite immature. (Her other friends tend to be younger, she is also the youngest child of a very large family.)
I explained my husband’s assault because I feel that he has shown a distinct lack of empathy towards me in regards to this situation. When I have explained that I have felt betrayed already and he has had this conversation with her with no accountability for his part in why out intimacy has been shattered, I don’t have much faith that what he has said to me about it all is very heartfelt.
I haven’t yet felt connected enough to open up about my attack either, btw.

[justilou1]

There is no way I would have had this kind of conversation with anyone outside of counselling, btw. I wouldn’t disrespect him like that.

[justilou1]

Oh, and while he apologized, he apologized for the way she made me feel, not for having that conversation. He still argues that he was entitled to do so, and if I have a problem with it, I should talk to her about it. I have told him that won’t happen because I will no longer be socializing with anyone who thinks it’s okay to discuss my sex life behind my back or to use it as a weapon to put me in my place, and that includes him.

[SunshineCake]

Is she insecure or is she a bitch?

Insecure- she's trying to show she has clout and importance as she repeats what he told her. Look how much your dh thinks of me, he told me this.

A bitch - he'd be having loads of sex if he was with me.

[Deathraystare]

I prefer to call them attention seeking women that think they are pretty but are dillusional and pretty average looking - well the so call popular girls when I was at school were like that.



In other words...Samantha Brick!

[Sadiesnakes]

I'd be very cautious of their relationship op, he doesn't need to be "in love" with her to shag her.

That conversation was a very intimate one and it crossed huge boundaries imo.

[Pringlesfortea]

Cut her out of your life ..if he loves you more he will agree to not see her again...he must realise she is shit stirring ..if he refuses ,let him go ,he doesn’t sound worth it...plus if he set the example I wonder if the other wives would follow..have you talked to the other wives ,I bet they would love to be rid of her

[justilou1]

Well, he knows how I feel about what happened. He doesn’t care that I feel betrayed. I am waiting for Thursday’s counselling session where I am going to explode. I am so tired of his bloody male entitlement and lack of accountability!!! If he was able to be empathetic instead of patronizing, controlling and irritable, maybe I’d feel a lot more inclined to jump his bones!!! It’s a bit hard with the kids around to really let rip.

[Pringlesfortea]

She’s meddling,she’s shit stirring,she makes out she can have any the men she wants ..nasty entitled cow .id be speaking to the other wives and fronting her out ..I’d be refusing to socialise with her and if my dh carried on socialising with her ( or whatever the fuck he is doing with her) he’d be an x dh

[no42]

OP, yes she does sound very needy. There are women like this, who need to make a song and dance about their male friends, yet never seem able to connect in a relationship of their own. I’m surprised she’s still hanging round after 16 years, given that they’re all married and have moved on. How odd.

It’s irritating that he’s confided in her because this will feed her delusions of importance and with this kind of needy individual, if you give them an inch, they’ll take a mile. They thrive on other people’s drama, sadly.

It sounds like you both have a lot going on. Maybe your disclosures are too much or triggering for him and vice versa. I would get individual counselling / psychotherapy first. It may take some time, but it really helps to have your own space to talk to a neutral person with no judgement or comeback. Maybe you and your DH are both expecting too much of each other at present and you can’t separate things out.

I would tell him that you are hurt that he’s confided in this woman because she is using it to patronise you. However, it has revealed that you both need someone to talk to - separately. The situation could be resolved if he texts her and says that he regrets talking to her about his marriage. He has overstepped the mark and, by going back to you, so has she. That should shut her up for good.

But do look into individual counselling. Take this as a wake -up call. Good luck.

[eddielizzard]

She's a nasty piece of work. You knew that, she still is, no surprise.

What would really upset me is the utter betrayal of your deepest, most private conversations that weren't meant for anyone else's ears. If you can't trust him not to go blabbing your intimate secrets, esp. to someone who he KNOWS is a problem, you can't continue to trust him and healing of your relationship is at an end.

To me this would be a massive betrayal.

[Frangible]

You can’t ‘make it clear’ you’re Queen Bee, the other people involved have to give you the power and engage in deferential behaviour towards you, other wise you’re just deluded.

Another way of looking at this woman would be that she’s someone unhappily longterm single and desperately clinging to her schooldays role as the Belle of the Lower Sixth when she’s absolutely certain Male Friend X was giving her the eye at the school disco.

But is she genuinely a close friend of his and someone he confides in?have you had conversations about privacy and boundaries? Have you talked to your own close friends (not this group, who sound like your DH’s people) about any of this? My best friend is a man, and confides a lot about his troubled marriage — they’re in Relate counselling and negotiating a divorce — but the difference is that I barely know his wife, though I like what I know, and certainly wouldn’t get pissed and start talking to her about their lack of sex in the pub!

[TheKarateKitty]

That kind of “apology” is the worst, the “sorry you feel that way.” He’s being very dismissive of your feelings in addition to already betraying you. He’s being a pig.

I’m sorry you’re going through this.