AIBU to not want my 3yo DD being left alone for hours with her uncles

[PeppyPiggy]

Dd’s dad has only been seeing her for the past year or so, he did not bother with her before this and claimed he was not her dad when asked to help or contribute (knowing that he was). He has been seeing DD every Saturday for a while. It turns out that every Saturday he was picking up DD and taking her to his mums and leaving her there so that he could go and play his weekend football game for hours (about three plus the travels which were sometimes long). Then he would spend a little time with her after his football and drive her back to me. I found out from DD that his two younger brothers (her uncles) were being left in charge of DD while DD was at his mums house. She was being left alone in their rooms with them and also left with them taking her to the toilet. One of these uncles is 20 and seems to have undiagnosed learning/social problems (this is what i was told by them) and the other is 13. Apparently they spend their time play fighting with DD. I don’t know if I have a paranoid view here as myself plus half of my friends growing up had bad experiences from young ages and some by family members, I also had an uncle try to get alone time with me when I was about 7 in my room and he wanted to talk to me about his fantasies, I told my mum and he never came over again. Also my closest friends mums bf had started raping her when we were at school together in what had started off as casual play fights. Obviously she agreed with me about this... but from outside perspectives, AIBU in not wanting my DD being left with two uncles?

A little bit of backstory incase people want to know, I barely know the two uncles. During the two and a half years that Dd’s dad didn’t bother with her none of his family nor his mum attempted to connect with her or me (they knew where I lived and my contact I didn't know theirs) I was never able to get to know them. The relationship I had with DDs dad was just awful and he treated me badly so it was short lived, about three months long and then i discovered I was pregnant a couple weeks after I broke up with him. When I told DD’s dad I was pregnant he assumed we were getting back together, when I said that wasn’t happening he had nothing to do with DD and denied her. He only became involved once he was forced to financially contribute by child maintenance. I have already told DDs dad that I'm not happy with her being left with uncles to take her to the toilet etc and he reassured me that he spoke to his mum about this and that it wont happen again. Today I confirmed this with his mum and she said that nothing was said to her by him and that if I didn’t want that situation for DD then DD should only be at her house when her dad is with her. DDs dad will not give up playing his weekend football games for his Saturday with her, he has made this clear to me. Sundays don’t work for either of us too. I feel like I’m being looked at now to disregard how I feel about DD being left with her uncles or face the threat of her dad not seeing her (which will really hurt her)... Would really appreciate perspective here?

[Windydaysuponus]

Unfortunately a judge would say who has dd in your exes time is his business. Unless you have concerns great enough to share with ss...
It's shit ime.
But same goes would you want him dictating to you?
When I had a new bf he was police checked via Cafcass but I wasn't allowed to know exes gf's name at all.
Sadly you can't make him step up.

[BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz]

Trust your gut.

I'd stop contact and let him persue it through the court. Make a call to NSPCC for advice and then if needed this can be used to aim for supervised contact.

[autumnboys]

I would trust your instinct here. If you aren’t comfortable with it, put a stop to it for now. Perhaps her Dad could collect her on his way back from football and take her to the park for an hour? I know it means you don’t get a break though.

Also, I know not everyone feels the same, but I don’t much like play fighting - you have to be quite alert to ensure that the smaller child is actually enjoying it and not just having their boundaries eroded.

[pooopypants]

Tricky. On paper, she's with her dad.


IRL, I'd stop contact and see if he pursues it further. If he does, push for supervised contact.

[Mxyzptlk]

Even if they are only playing, DD is so very much younger than both of them, it can't be very nice for her to do that for most of the visit.

I agree with stopping the visits.
Or at least arrange so that her dad only sees her after the football.

[Mxyzptlk]

It sounds like his mum, DD's gran, doesn't want to be bothered with her. That's not a good environment for her.

[Serin]

Trust your instincts OP. He clearly doesn't give a shit about her if he would rather be playing football. I would tell him that unless the situation changes immediately you will be insisting on supervised contact. I bet he wont even fight you.
I speak as someone who spent most of my childhood fighting off 2 "uncles" (married to my mums sisters) from the age of 7.

[Mummyoflittledragon]

I’d stop contact. You’d be better taking your dd to the church tea rooms or some such to meet friendly people, who will be interested in talking to her.

[BackforGood]

I think you are looking at this through the eyes of your bf's experience. There is no way most people would leap to the conclusion that uncles are going to do anything inappropriate, and I think that is an offensive way to look at things.
That said I don't really see the point of him having 'contact' for the day every week if he is not going to actually be there for most of the time - unless the Grandparents were keen as mustard to build a relationship with their grandchild.
Would it not work better if she went from when he finishes work on a Friday, until he heads out to football on Saturday?

[Mushypeasandchipstogo]

YANBU as previous posters have said, trust your instincts.

[hidinginthenightgarden]

This isn’t okay. How awful for your DD to be dumped on people who don’t care about her. It isn’t beneficial to her at all.
Just stop the arrangement.

[Alb1]

I think assuming they could be peadophiles because they are male is pretty awful of you, and what makes them potential perverts but not him? But I wouldn’t be happy with him having DD just to palm her off on someone else, and I’d probably stop visits on that basis. I can understand his mums point of view but it’s also a real shame she isn’t interested in spending time with her granddaughter. Sounds like your DD is better off without them in some ways.

[Johnjoeseph]

I have a three year old DD and I was squirming just reading your post OP, there is no way in hell I would allow that. Trust your instincts and put a stop to it.

It could very well be innocent but that's not a gamble worth taking. I would never let any male besides DH take my DD to the toilet - just no.

[bobstersmum]

Made my blood run cold reading this. Op. Stop the contact. If he wants to have her he needs her with him at all times. Since he obviously has such poor judgment though I'd say he could see her at mine.

[Aridane]

YABU

[bmbonanza]

Stop contact - he will have to go to court and explain why he wants to see her so much that he then leaves her with these people. Explain your concerns, dont mince your words or leave room for doubt. Keeping your child safe is the only real thing you should be worrying about.

[carly2803]

I wold not be happy about this either for 2 reasons

1 - being dumped on these uncles( i find that uncomfortable to sorry - i have a son and i wouldnt leave him in this situation either)

2 - her dad isnt spending time with her which isnt that the point of contact?!


either get her dad to pick her up on the way home from footballe or stop contact and let him take you tocourt - i can bet he wont!

[Rachelover40]

Speak to your ex about it, share your concerns. It might give him a wake up. I'm sure the two uncles will not do your daughter any harm (most don't), but her dad should spend more time with her.

Could you not change the day she goes to him so as not to clash with his football?

[hairyharrison]

No way would I would I let her go. What's the point of it? Why don't you get her father to pick her up from yours and go for a walk on Saturdays. I know it means you don't get a break but the play fighting gave me a sick feeling in my stomach and your daughter's safety is top priority. Also what 13 and 20 year old do you know would willingly innocently baby sit every Saturday?

[hairyharrison]

Why do people say most times it doesn't happen? More woman than not that I know have experienced CSA.

[downbutnotout2018]

Stop contact. This makes my stomach churn.

[chickenyhead]

I'd feel the same if it was aunts of those ages to be honest.

Let's not forget that they were all raised the same way as your ex and thus potentially have similar problems.

Trust whatever your instincts tell you. But she is very young and wont necessarily know that things are wrong.

[Aridane]

I would never let any male besides DH take my DD to the toilet - just no

How unutterably sad, the demonising of men as paedophiles

[Swatsup]

Is it you that doesn’t want to change it to a Sunday or him?

[Raphael34]

I may be biased by my own friends experiences here, but her circumstances was the same as your daughters. Her mother was neglectful though and left her with a father she’d only met a couple months before, in a house she knew he shared with his mother and two brothers that she didn’t know at all. She was made to share a room with her 20 year old uncle with learning difficulties, next door to his younger brother. They both raped her every week from the ages of 8-13. It only stopped when her younger sister was forced to stay there and she found out she was being raped too. IMO it doesn’t matter if it’s the dads decision to leave your child with strange and underage men with learning difficulties. The whole situation is just wrong, she barely knows her own father and shouldn’t be left with these strangers. It’s twisted that is someone reported you to ss for doing this you’d probably be investigated. But if you reported the father it would probably be dismissed. Your daughter needs safeguarding though