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To have told 6yo the truth.

(465 Posts)
malm275 Sun 19-May-19 05:50:50

Sorry it's a party/invite kind of thread....

DD is celebrating her 6th birthday next week. Every party that she has had so far has been a massive family/friends event with at least 30+ children to cater for. This year things are a bit tighter financially so dd is having a small cinema party with 6 invited guests from school and a couple from out of school that we are particularly close to. Dd is delighted and so excited. And we are massively relieved I'm getting whinged at left,right and centre by the 'uninvited' but that's a different thread hmm
The one thing I asked dh to do this week was give the school invitations directly to parents and not give them to the teacher to hand out. Which he promptly did. Again, another thread Wouldn't necessarily be a huge problem but there is a girl at school, who will call herself dd's best friend, but actually is mean, pushy and very dominating over my daughter. And many other children School are aware and I have been trying to give my daughter the tools to deal with this kind of behaviour.
Long story short, she has been awful to dd this week about not being invited (she has never been invited to any of dd's parties anyway). Dd has left school in tears every day because this girl has been pressuring her each day for an invite, I know that I'm not bu to leave her out, dd doesn't want her there and I have given dd the option to just add her to the list, which was thankfully met with a very firm no, so I said we would just have to ride this one out and that dd didn't have to feel bad about her right decision. I floated the idea of inviting girl round for a play date to see if we could do some kind of relationship building but dd was unsure and I don't blame her, I don't really want this girl invading dd's safe space at home.
So anyway, this girl came out of school on Friday and asked me very loudly 'can I come to dd's party'. I replied 'no, sorry not this time'.
She asked why and I said 'because you are not very kind to dd'
Girl then burst into tears and ran off to her mum who gave me a filthy look as did half of the playground I went to go and talk to her but she walked off before I got there and I wasn't going to chase after her. I've always dealt with school with these matters they have asked me not to approach mum as they like to deal with things and have never even spoken to this girls mum as we are not normally on the playground for the same pick ups.
It's been on my mind all weekend. Girl obviously has some issues (not SEND as far as I know- but obviously I would never like to assume) and I try to be understanding of this but felt like I just wanted her to be told the truth about her behaviour for once and realise a consequence. Should I have just sugared the pill, said that it was a little party and not everyone could have an invite? That I couldn't afford it?
I work in a school and think that I am just getting so wound up with the constant pandering around some children and parents there that maybe I took out my frustration on this little girl.

malm275 Sun 19-May-19 05:53:10

Sorry for the very long sentence in the middle ... I comma'd instead of full stopping 🤦‍♀️

KatherineJaneway Sun 19-May-19 05:56:34

YANBU. She needs to learn that if she is nasty to others, there are consequences.

itscallednickingbentcoppers Sun 19-May-19 05:57:51

Ah tough one. I don't think YWBU really but that will have had an impact on that little girl and might knock her confidence in building friendships. She probably did need to be told the truth but there's being told in a gentle way by a loving parent or kind teacher and then the truth being blurted out unexpectedly in front of everyone by a random parent.

dashoflime Sun 19-May-19 06:02:41

I think YWBU, sorry.
At 6, consequences still have to be tied quite closely to the behaviour to make sense to the child.
So, if you were to witness her being unkind to your DD and said "That was very unkind. I think I'll have to seperate the two of you for now" that would be useful.
If you tell her shes "not very kind to DD" in a general sense, she can't really connect that with a specific behaviour or know how to change things.
It just feels like you did it to vent rather than to impart any kind of lesson.

saywhatwhatnow Sun 19-May-19 06:03:04

I tend to agree with pp in that YANBU to not invite her, but I tend to think you were a little U blurting it out in front of all the other parents and children. She is only 6 after all. I'm not one for pandering at all but think it could've been done a little more tactfully, however it's done and the school will deal with it from here I'm sure. At least she won't keep asking for an invite eh!?

boobirdblue Sun 19-May-19 06:05:37

6 is still young, I think you were a little UR.

The school probably asked you not to approach the parents because this type of thing happens...... parent wars. You said half the playground were giving you filthy looks.

What's the strategy in the school you work in?

HennyPennyHorror Sun 19-May-19 06:05:44

She's not kind because she's not been brought up well. Which is not her fault.

Her knowing that she's not very kind won't help her at this point. Only her parents can really do that.

I think YWBU. It would have been better to flannel it. "No not this time sorry" and no more.

malm275 Sun 19-May-19 06:09:17

Hmm, I think this is my issue. Not that I said it, but that it kind of blurted out without me thinking about it and that other parents heard (as this made it public rather than a private conversation, not because I'm bothered what they think of me - I also got a few pats on the back which actually made me feel worse)
I might try and phone mum today as I wanted to just talk to her right from the start of all this but also wanted to respect schools boundaries.

cake778 Sun 19-May-19 06:11:36

Probably not the best move, but everyone gets to the end of their tether. Doing it in the moment in fine (although I've also had filthy looks due to this).

Teddybear45 Sun 19-May-19 06:15:03

You did nothing wrong in calling it out. The girl is bullying your dd and her mum should have sorted this out the first time the school got involved. She didn’t, you did, and who cares if this knocks the girl’s confidence for a bit? At six regardless of whether she has SEN she shouldn’t bully. Don’t dilute the message by apologising to the mum — in fact if she raises it directly reiterate it. She isn’t nice to your dd and therefore won’t get an invite.

LellyMcKelly Sun 19-May-19 06:18:22

Don’t phone the mother. It won’t achieve anything. I don’t think you’ve done anything wrong. She was very rude asking for an invitation and your daughter doesn’t want her at the party because she’s unkind to her.

ANewDawn10 Sun 19-May-19 06:24:19

Yanbu. The girl learnt one thing. If shes nasty, there are consequences. Your dd learnt another thing, her mum will stand by her and she shouldn't accept anything that makes her unhappy.
If my child came home crying because of some mean little child , i wouldn't even feel bad to set her straight.

And don't contact the mother, you would end up apologising for her daughters behavior.

malm275 Sun 19-May-19 06:25:49

I wont phone. I'll give school a heads up on what's happened maybe and they can hopefully do some damage control.
I wonder if the girls mum spends her weekend worrying over how upset my daughter has been feeling? Sigh.

MaybeitsMaybelline Sun 19-May-19 06:30:02

Personally I would just leave it now. The school doesn’t need to be involved and the mum needs to discuss with her DD the reasons why this happened.

Let it drop, it will be forgotten by Tuesday.

Teddybear45 Sun 19-May-19 06:32:42

She doesn’t because she’s clearly a bad mum Op. a good mum would have corrected her dd’s behaviour when the school initially got involved.

Fundays12 Sun 19-May-19 06:37:14

I would leave it you maybe shouldn’t have blurted it out but someone (really her parents) needed to tell her that. My son has SEN needs I still do not allow him to bully other children as it’s unaccep behaviour. He has just turned 7 but knows other kids won’t play with him if he is nasty to them. As for the mum she was probably upset to hear this but it may make her think about her daughters behaviour and how it impacts not only on other kids but her own child (I.e no party invites).

NauseousMum Sun 19-May-19 06:38:03

Tough call. On the one hand she was very rude to keep harassing your daughter and given the school is involved her parents should have stopped it and not allowed her to approach. On the other, it's really the parents you need to tell as she will be copying their behaviour.

Leave it for now, it's said. Be prepared for next time and keep your dd away from her.

AlexaAmbidextra Sun 19-May-19 06:42:35

YABU with all the bloody crossing out. I never understand the point of this. Just write the words.

CrumpetyTea Sun 19-May-19 06:46:13

Fine not to invite her to the party ( assuming not a whole class/all the girls party) YABVU to have spoken like you did- she's only 6!
Its not clear what the school has done re the bullying - do they think its bullying? have they spoken to the other parent? it may have come as a bolt from the blue- both the girl and her mum may have no understanding of what she has done. It sounds like the girl think she is your daughter's friend so maybe she isn't being intentionally nasty.
Just because a child has bullied/been mean to your child doesn't mean you get to be mean back

OneInEight Sun 19-May-19 06:50:08

Fine not to invite her to the party. YABU and naive if you expect the non-invitation will improve the child's behaviour. My experience is that if a child is regularly excluded then their behaviour deteriorates rather than the reverse.

allthegoodusernameshavegone Sun 19-May-19 06:54:00

Yanbu, you have told her the truth, she needed to learn, the tears were probably out of shame and she will have probably learnt a lesson. When she is nicer to other DC she will enjoy the reward of getting invitations

Mummyoflittledragon Sun 19-May-19 06:56:38

She won’t have spent the weekend worrying about your dd. She will more likely have spent the weekend bitching about you and your dd. Be prepared for potential fall out.

Speak to your dd about talking to the teacher and the come clean with the teacher if the girl continues to harass her. Write a short email so the teacher sees it ASAP and is aware on Monday morning. This is too delicate to discuss in the playground.

You really should not have said what you did. If you wanted to make a statement, the best choice would have been to say something more neutral and along the lines of “Because dd didn’t invite you.” She’s 6. Of course a grown up telling her she’s horrible in general is going to be terribly hurtful and potentially damaging long term.

sandcastlemadewithshells Sun 19-May-19 07:03:57

I think there's nothing wrong with what OP did.
The girl was not nice to her dd and she doesn't want to invite her to the party. The girl asked OP why she wasn't invited, OP said because she wasn't very kind to her dd. What's wrong with that? Yes they are still young, but someone have to teach the child that you need to be nice to the others to be liked.
I think Op is totally reasonable, her priority is her dd's happiness, not other girl.

Ohtherewearethen Sun 19-May-19 07:05:20

To those saying that 'she's only 6, she's still so young' - which age do you deem appropriate for a child to be told their nasty behaviour is affecting others? When they're 7? 9? 13?
You weren't 'mean' to this ill mannered bully, you simply stated a fact - she wasn't invited to the party because she's been unkind to your daughter. Six is plenty old enough to know that being unkind hurts other people's feelings. There have been some serious failings somewhere if parents and school haven't taught her this yet.

mycatisblack Sun 19-May-19 07:09:41

Good grief, she's being mean to your DD and you're anxious about hurting this girl's feelings? Unclench and forget it. You're not responsible for her behaviour and it's good that she now knows there are consequences to being mean and she probably did needed telling.

Redwinestillfine Sun 19-May-19 07:10:07

I would have just said it's not a party just a few very close friends. If I were the dd's mum I would be furious with you. Yes she needs to learn consequences, but not like that. Tell school as you may well have a complaint coming your way.

Grumpos Sun 19-May-19 07:12:01

I don’t think you were unreasonable.
My DSD is 7, she knows full well when she’s been a brat / nasty / horrible.
I have had full conversations with her about how her friends have acted at school or how she has acted towards her sister etc.
They generally know what being nasty means. This little girl probably does as well, but clearly parents are not correcting the behaviour.
You’ve left it for the school to resolve and watched your child be upset for more than a few days (and previous times). It’s sad the little girl got upset after but kids always cry when they know they are wrong / guilty / been caught out etc.
They may not be old enough to understand the emotions behind these things but they bloody well know when they are being naughty! I don’t blame you - although I’d feel the same guilt as you after too. Difficult situation.

Thatnovembernight Sun 19-May-19 07:12:29

I wouldn’t phone the mother unless the is a particular friend of yours. If she approaches you then you could explain some of the problems your daughter has been having with hers but otherwise I’d leave it.

Itwouldtakemuchmorethanthis Sun 19-May-19 07:14:52

So a child who thinks your child is her bf, had to watch others be invited to a party, then you announced to the playground and all the other Mums that she wasn’t coming because she was unkind?shock
YABVVVVU. How utterly horrid. She’s 6 ffs.

Ask who you like to your party but don’t make other people’s children cry, and pass judgement on them at school. That poor child has spent a week wondering why her bf hasn’t invited her to her bday party and had all the surrounding whispering, and now will have it ongoing because parents and presumably children have been told she’s so unkind she can’t come to the party.sad

Every parent who’s child hasn’t been invited will be upset. Personally I wouldn’t be wanting mine to go if she’d been invited because I wouldn’t think you were very nice and I’d be distancing myself and my child. Who knows when you could decide she/we need a bit of public character assassination? This would be very unacceptable in my children’s school.

Scarydinosaurs Sun 19-May-19 07:17:43

Very different a child telling another child that they’ve hurt their feelings than an adult telling a child (who in that moment has done nothing wrong apart from asked a blunt question that we as adults find rude but a child wouldn’t understand) to what you did.

You’re the adult, she’s a child. You’ve modelled to her that you can be blunt and hurt other people’s feelings. You admit you took your frustrations out on her. I think YWBU. A simple ‘DD couldn’t invite everyone, I’m sorry you didn’t get an invite’ would have sufficed.

AndwhenyougetthereFoffsomemore Sun 19-May-19 07:22:27

I think your decision not to invite the child to dd's party is sensible and you are right to stick to your guns.

However telling anyone home truths in a public situation is pretty unpleasant, and unlikely to be effective, let alone a 6 year old. A white lie would have been substantially more appropriate - 'it's a small party so we can only invite a few people, sorry'. I would mention to school, and make it clear your comments were off the cuff/unplanned but I would not get in touch with the other parent at this stage.

Moomooboo Sun 19-May-19 07:23:45

You seriously were not unreasonable and whilst it may have felt unkind/rude to say - it was the right thing. As has been mentioned - you stood by your daughter and said probably what she had struggled to have the confidence to say.

She may be 6 and “too young” to connect the dots - but it’s not your job to connect the dots. Her mother should have intervened with her asking to come to the party and said something like: “there’s not enough space and you shouldn’t try and invite yourself...”.

Don’t try and call the mother - stand by your guns and what you said. Too many people seem to think these things should be sugar coated - but if you’re a bully at 6 and everything is sugar coated you’ll be a bully at 15 too....!!

AhoyDelBoy Sun 19-May-19 07:26:03

Tell school as you may well have a complaint coming your way.

A complaint about what? confused. Is it a ‘thing’ that parents can complain about other parents to the school? Jesus wept, don’t teachers and other school staff have enough to do? I can understand in extreme cases but really? The OP told the girl she wasn’t invited to the party “because you are not very kind to DD”. Big whoop. End of.

I wouldn’t get the school involved, what exactly are they going to do? Admonish the OP? confused. The girl asked, and was told, why she’s not invited to the party 🤷🏼‍♀️

Ohtherewearethen Sun 19-May-19 07:27:17

@itwouldtakemorethanthis - why do this girl's feelings trump the OP's daughter's feelings? I'd find it very difficult to fawn over my child's bully and make up excuses and lies as though there wasn't a problem with their terrible behaviour towards my child. Of course I wouldn't be nasty to the child either but no way would I let my child see me trying to placate their bully with apologies and pleasantries! I feel sorry for your children if you would put the feelings of a child who bullied them over their own.

IceCreamSoda99 Sun 19-May-19 07:33:38

Good on you OP, I work in a school too, children have got to learn consequences. 6 is not to young to reflect on actions but I agree she needs parents to now talk about why what happened did, though undoubtedly it fall to the teachers as you will have her parents like other posters saying "oh she's too young to understand" hmm. We talk to the nursery children about cause and effect. Also it's important your daughter sees that you don't pander to bullies, you are blunt with them.

PeakedTooEarly Sun 19-May-19 07:35:30

Someone had to tell the kid. It's clearly not going to be her own mother and the scholl sound ineffectual. The only way kids get to moderate their behaviour and learn social norms is by being told where they are going wrong.

dashoflime Sun 19-May-19 07:35:46

To those saying that 'she's only 6, she's still so young' - which age do you deem appropriate for a child to be told their nasty behaviour is affecting others? When they're 7? 9? 13?

I don't think a child is ever to young to be told how their behaviour has affected others. But for younger children the critisism needs to be very specific and it needs to be delivered as soon after the bad behavour as possible.

"That was an unkind thing to say. I bet little Julie feels really sad. If you keep behaving like that, people won't want to play with you"

Like that.

Not "Your unkind to little Julie and thats why your not coming to her birthday party" - some hours or days after the behaviour.

OnlyFoolsnMothers Sun 19-May-19 07:35:57

As an adult imagine how you’d feel being told this in public- and this was a 6year old! Fine not to invite but vv uncalled for with what you told her.
Also when I was at school me and two other girls were always falling out and complaining about one another, it wasn’t bullying. Without knowing the full ins and outs I’m not sure if this child is a bully or just a bit bossy.

MrsHormonal2019 Sun 19-May-19 07:36:08

It's your daughters birthday. She is your priority and who she wants to attend is her choice.
There is an ongoing issue with her a girl upsetting her at school so why on earth would said girl be invited anyway. I'd have done the exact same thing.
I don't pander to anyone, certainly people who upset my child regular and nothing is done about it

Propertywoes Sun 19-May-19 07:36:56

What an awful thing to do to a 6 year old child. You humiliated her in front of everyone. You could have taken her parent aside and spoken to her if you really had to.

Alsonification Sun 19-May-19 07:37:58

I think you were right to say what you did. After six years of age the child knows what she’s doing.

**I work in a school and think that I am just getting so wound up with the constant pandering around some children and parents

I also completely agree with the statement

Gruzinkerbell1 Sun 19-May-19 07:38:50

What ohtherewearethen said. With bells on. YWNBU. Don’t ring the mother, let it die now. And point out to your husband that this is exactly why you asked him to quietly give the invites to the parents and not the teacher. Useless man.

malm275 Sun 19-May-19 07:45:13

Thank you to everyone who has replied, I knew that feelings would be very different around this one, but it has been really useful to hear the reasoning behind each one and will help me decide my next steps. I will inform school just because I sense that this one will not go away and I'd like to give them a heads up.

I'n thinking that I do not feel bad that the girl has been given this message, (I feel bad that she has had to be given this message iyswim) but I do feel bad regarding the circumstance in which it happened.

I don't mean to drip feed but I should have added somewhere that mum is definitely aware of the situation between our dd's and has been told the same as I have by the school regarding contact. My daughter is not an isolated case where this girl is concerned.

Thank you to those who have reminded me how good it would have been for my daughter to get some back up! She has given this message to the girl several times over the week without any result so I'll focus on the positives for her.

DaisiesAreOurSilver Sun 19-May-19 07:46:10

Leave it. YWNBU to tell the girl how it is. Maybe she'll learn and begin to change her behaviour.

GreenDragon75 Sun 19-May-19 07:49:25

This is awful. I completely agree children need to be made aware of their behaviour and the impact on others but it’s not your place to humiliate and make her cry like this. Everyone seems to be calling the girls mother but do you not recognise what you did was bullying and incredibly mean.
School have said they are dealing with it and to leave it with them. How do you know they aren’t?
It makes me so sad to think that people think it’s okay to make a 6 year old cry. Don’t speak to the mum now but maybe a chat before it got to this may have been a good idea?

Itwouldtakemuchmorethanthis Sun 19-May-19 07:50:07

@Ohtherewearethen why do this girl's feelings trump the OP's daughter's feelings? They don’t, the OPs attempt to publicly correctthechild in front of her peers and other parents would have been horrible regardless how she felt.
Nobody is asking you to fawn over anyone hmm what OP did was very ill mannered regardless of the recipient. There would presumably have been many other children who knew they weren’t invited, beyond the focus of her attack.

Of course I wouldn't be nasty to the child it was nasty.

I feel sorry for your children if you would put the feelings of a child who bullied them over their own. was this necessary? It’s a really nasty thing to say to me. Would you like me to tell you I feel sorry for your children because of your thoughts?

diddl Sun 19-May-19 07:51:31

I think that ywnbu.

Not your fault that she put you on the spot.

It was pretty cheeky that she asked but then to go on to ask why!

Why does this girl think that she is your daughter's best friend?

Have you already spoken to the school about how she behaves towards your daughter?

rainbowstardrops Sun 19-May-19 07:52:01

I work in a school and think that I am just getting so wound up with the constant pandering around some children and parents

I don't think you were unreasonable at all

Angelil Sun 19-May-19 07:59:41

I wonder if the girls mum spends her weekend worrying over how upset my daughter has been feeling?

Not bloody likely.

Propertywoes Sun 19-May-19 08:01:07

Id say you're a worse bully than the 6 year old.

themiddlestair Sun 19-May-19 08:01:32

To those saying that 'she's only 6, she's still so young' - which age do you deem appropriate for a child to be told their nasty behaviour is affecting others? When they're 7? 9? 13?

She has to be old and mature enough to understand what is being said to her. SHe'd have to be mature enough to reflect back on her past behaviour, referred to out of context, and understand that it was nasty. Just suddenly, out of context, being told ' you are unkind' (and in the context this meant - and we don't like you). OP has already said this girl regards her daughter as her best friend and that this girl has issues.

She sounds like a little girl who is struggling to understand how to constructively socialise with others. All your comment did OP, was make her feel bad about herself because her 'friend' doesn't like her after all' without her even understanding why, let alone have the tools to deal with it.

Some posters here are expecting a six year old, and a struggling six year old at that, to have the emotional and rational maturity of an adult.

Children are not small adults - they are children.

AJPTaylor Sun 19-May-19 08:06:47

I did something similar altho my dd was 8 or 9. And the other child had ruined her previous 2 parties. I do not regret it.

MyYe Sun 19-May-19 08:07:23

I don't think you were unreasonable.

Long story short, she has been awful to dd this week about not being invited (she has never been invited to any of dd's parties anyway). Dd has left school in tears every day because this girl has been pressuring her each day for an invite

Hopefully she'll now stop harrasing your daughter for an invite and sending her home in tears every day.

Fiveredbricks Sun 19-May-19 08:10:02

In the bigger picture OP you didn't do anything wrong. Own it. The girl is not nice and it's not your job to pander to that behaviour or worry about how the outcomes od her behaviour affect her. That is for her mother and father to worry about.

You keep doing you and let your daughter live her life how she wants to without influences from poorly parented and behaved children. You're doing a good thing by teaching her to stand up for herself and stand her ground, and that what she wants for herself is important. Because it is.

Anyone who says ywbu to the other girl needs to give their head a wobble, frankly. You were firm and honest and not cruel or nasty. It is not your concern to manage her feelings.

Fiveredbricks Sun 19-May-19 08:11:02

@themiddlestair and that is the responsibility of her parents to manage that and educate her on that. No one elses. Get a fucking grip.

ThumbWitchesAbroad Sun 19-May-19 08:12:59

What a load of crap - "Op is worse bully than 6yo" - bollocks!

All she said was "you're not very kind to my DD" - that's factual, it's not namecalling, it's not rude - it's a statement of fact and a reason why the child hasn't been invited. I doubt she was crying over the reason, just crying because she didn't get her own way and didn't get the invitation she'd been badgering for.

Yes, doubtless it would have been better if half the playground hadn't heard it, but it would have also been better if the mother of said child had reined her DD in and told her to leave it.

Agree entirely that you put this in the hands of the school, if there is anything to "deal with" - do not contact the mother. And I agree that it's highly unlikely that the other mother is thinking about anything to do with your DD's feelings, she's far more likely to be bitching about you to her DD than anything else. If she was the sort to worry about another child's feelings, she would have apologised for her DD's behaviour, not given you dirty looks.

themiddlestair Sun 19-May-19 08:13:19

that is the responsibility of her parents to manage that and educate her on that. No one elses. Get a fucking grip

Yes, just like it was your parent's responsibility to manage and educate you to how to have respectful dialogue with people you disagree with.

EnglishRose13 Sun 19-May-19 08:15:00

I don't think you're wrong not to invite the unkind child, but I think telling a 6 year old the reason, in front of everyone at school, was pretty cruel!

FudgeBrownie2019 Sun 19-May-19 08:23:14

She sounds like a little girl who is struggling to understand how to constructively socialise with others.

This is absolutely right, but unless her family pull her up and teach her those skills, other parents like OP are going to spend the next ten years trying to protect their own DC from her. Which is grossly unfair.

Not teaching your DC to just be kind, warm people is doing them a huge disservice.

stucknoue Sun 19-May-19 08:25:22

Telling the truth is sometimes blunt and the girl was wrong to demand an invitation from you in the first place. In retrospect yes you could have handled it better but you were put on the spot

PeakedTooEarly Sun 19-May-19 08:26:30

Had the mother of this 6yo already got a grip of the situation this would not have occurred. A large percentage of the blame for this lies there.

Sometimes things are said in the moment. OP is uncomfortable about how it happened and that is obvious from her post. It was an emotional situation not helped by the useless husband having failed in his tiny little task. I don't think OP can be blamed for answering the way she did in the moment. We have all done it. The 6yo doesn't have the ability to deal with this but she could have if others around her that are already aware she has the tendency to bully, showed her the error of her ways prior to this event. She has been let down but mostly not by the OP.

60secondfacetimer Sun 19-May-19 08:29:01

The OP was annoyed and upset this child had been upsetting her child all week and then the cheeky child had the balls to ask why she wasn't invited. Yes it may not of been the best thing to say to a 6 year old but with everything that had gone on I most likely would of said the same thing.

RantyAnty Sun 19-May-19 08:29:27

Not sure why you had to give out 6 invitations at the school. Couldn't you have rang up the mums and invited or emailed them? That probably would have prevented a lot of the drama about the party.

Xyzzzzz Sun 19-May-19 08:31:59

I don’t think you were unreasonable not intentionally as it just slipped out.

if the school are involved surely they’d have explained to the child that her behaviour is not nice with other children and her parents Would be picking this up? Maybe she ran off in tears as she finally understood the impact of her behaviour. I know she’s only 6 but doesn’t mean that she lacks awareness.

giddyyup Sun 19-May-19 08:32:01

All those saying OP is unreasonable and a bully herself were probably the school bully back in their day.

OP good on you. I'd do the same.

Quartz2208 Sun 19-May-19 08:32:14

OH OP I think the problem is you know you said it in a momentary loss of control and that is never the best way of handling things.

As this thread has shown there will be differences in opinion and everyone saw you which has created a difficult environment for you and your daughter (even if you said the truth) and that the mother will not let this go (if she is anything like the mother of the girl who did it to my DD I definitely feel for you).

So the right or wrong of what you do is immaterial now I think you need to focus on damage limitation and how to handle the fallout because I think you suspect there will be some

cookiechomper Sun 19-May-19 08:33:48

You were wrong to do this. I'd advise letting the school deal with it instead of arguing with a 6 year old. It's not your place to pull this child up on her behaviour, it's the school and her parents. So even though you were put on the spot you should have said something else or walked away.

YouJustDoYou Sun 19-May-19 08:34:09

Ok, I was like that 6 year old. I was (and am) on the spectrum, but no one ever, ever, taught me what was right and what was wrong and how the things I said could hurt people's feelings. As a result, it took me many years when I was far older to learn how to act and talk to people appropriately. I wish an adult would've told it to me straight. As it was, they would just shoot me filthy looks and keep their children away from me, but no one ever actually explained to me why.

I think it was a bit harsh, but...personally, I wish someone had also been harsh to me.

swingofthings Sun 19-May-19 08:37:58

Considering we can't gather the tone of voice with written words it's hard to say. There's a massive difference between saying 'I know you want to be close friend with DD,but sometimes you are not very nice to her. I'm sure you don't mean to, but it makes DD sad, that's why she decided not to invite you this time' and say it with a smile and kind eyes, and giving her the evil eye and tell her with a very harsh tone 'because you are man to her and she doesn't like you'.

Babynut1 Sun 19-May-19 08:40:16

Too much pandering to little sods going on these days. Fair play to you op. Maybe now she’ll think twice about asking again.
The reason she went off in tears was probably more to do with the fact you said no, not because of the reason.

Beautiful3 Sun 19-May-19 08:41:56

You were being unreasonable, she is only six. I would have said, "because dd chose her friends and there's no room for any more. Sorry sweetie, see you tomorrow".

Ferii Sun 19-May-19 08:43:11

YANBU. You weren't nasty you were just truthful. The child asked why she couldn't come and you gave her a truthful answer in an easy to understand, age appropriate way. You weren't being mean, just honest. Hopefully she learns from it that there are consequences to how she treats other ppl. You also said "no sorry not this time" which leaves the door open for her to attend in future if she modifies her behaviour. I think your response was good and since the school has asked you not to approach the other mother directly there's nothing more you can do.

Inniu Sun 19-May-19 08:46:07

Leaving the child out of the party is fine but publicly humiliating a small child may have made you feel better but it unlikely to be effective in improving her behavior.

bevelino Sun 19-May-19 08:50:17

I don’t think OP was unreasonable but other parents may not have known the history between the two children and are likely to wonder why OP had upset a child.

I am all for bullies being called out and when my 4 dds (including triplets) started school, dh and I put a lot of work in with them to minimise them being bullied or being the bullies.

Purplegecko Sun 19-May-19 08:50:58

@Babynut1 I agree.

I don't know about anyone else maybe we all led very different childhoods but when I was growing up, all the adults parented all the kids. If an adult saw us being mean to one another, regardless of their relation to us, we were told off and told to sort it out.
It's a conscious choice to be nasty. "Oh she's only 6" 6 year olds aren't stupid. When do you want to deal with her bullying? When she's 7? 10? 16?
If she didn't want the consequences that come from being mean, she shouldn't have been mean. Someone had to do it, the mother clearly isn't as you say OP, your DD isn't the only one to have had an issue with this child.

CatkinToadflax Sun 19-May-19 08:54:41

In your OP you said that your DD usually has big parties of 30+ children and friends, but that this child has never been invited. This strikes me as really quite mean. If the child is aware that she is never invited to your DD’s parties then I can kind of see why she’s so keen to attend this one. She thinks she’s your DD’s best friend, and if her unkindness has never been properly addressed then maybe she believes her behaviour is appropriate? Is she the child who always gets left out of everyone’s parties, by any chance? This always happened to my autistic DS and it’s absolutely horrible. I’m not trying to excuse the child’s behaviour at all but you’ve never invited her to any of your DD’s large parties....isn’t that quite mean?

diddl Sun 19-May-19 08:54:43

" "because dd chose her friends and there's no room for any more. Sorry sweetie, see you tomorrow"."


But how is that any better-telling her that she's not considered a friend?

I agree with a pp-it was probably because she was told no.

DarklyDreamingDexter Sun 19-May-19 08:54:57

I think you handled it well and were truthful without being nasty. 6 is old enough to learn that actions have consequences. You didn't lose control, you said you 'aren't kind' to DD. (Not 'you're a horrible, bully' or something.) Maybe she'll actually think about what she's doing to DD?

StoorieHoose Sun 19-May-19 08:55:32

If the child's mother was close enough to hear the OP she was close enough to hear her child ask why she wasn't invited to a party! I would be so embarrassed to hear my child like that and would have hoiked my daughter away apologising to the OP before the OP had a chance to reply.

malm275 Sun 19-May-19 08:58:25

Bevelino This is exactly what I've been trying to do as well ... to give my daughter the tools to be resilient to this kind of behaviour and also, to have a little understanding about why it's happening... Maybe that's why I'm so annoyed that I cracked!

I'm really appreciating every response and I guess if there is one thing I'd like to say in my defence it's that... please don't think that I intentionally set out to hurt this child. It was spur of the moment. If I was like that then believe me, something would have been said before now! I have friends that wouldn't think twice about saying things like this and I don't always agree with them and would tell them otherwise.

Inniu Sun 19-May-19 08:59:09

Oh gosh, I had missed the bit about never having invited her to any of the larger parties. That not very nice.

malm275 Sun 19-May-19 09:00:26

Inniu... yes but that bit is probably not relevant as they have only known each other for the 2 school years, and I have never done a party where all of the children have been invited and one left out iyswim 🙈

DarklyDreamingDexter Sun 19-May-19 09:00:34

You didn't crack! I think you were very measured and fair in what you said to the nasty little madame!

Reallyevilmuffin Sun 19-May-19 09:05:36

I think what you did was completely appropriate. If I was told mine weren't invited because of being unkind I would back up the parent saying that and be having words.

Ivestoppedreadingthenews Sun 19-May-19 09:08:48

I think it was a bit unkind actually. At 6yrs she won’t necessarily know how to be kind to your daughter. Certainly my 5 year old is still developing in this which means I’m frequently intervening between siblings to point out how to phrase something in a kinder way.

It would have been better if you’d said something like “Sorry abc, I’ve said no this time. I’ve noticed that sometimes when you and DD are playing DD feels a bit sad. I think you might need a bit more practice at how to play together without anyone getting sad. I’m sure they’ll be other chances to play together.”

Contraceptionismyfriend Sun 19-May-19 09:12:53

YANBu what did her mother expect allowing her demon child to accost you in the play ground?
Did she think every moron would pander to her bitchy behaviour.

I'd give zero shits and if the school brought it up I'd just look at them blankly and say she asked a question and I answered.

Ferii Sun 19-May-19 09:14:25

"because dd chose her friends and there's no room for any more. Sorry sweetie, see you tomorrow".

Wow saying this is in my opinion the worst possible response. For one it possibly sounds like a really bitchy, snidy thing depending on tone nit most importantly you would be shifting the blame from the nasty child to your DD. It's not your DD's fault that the child isn't invited so why should she shoulder the blame?! We teach children from very early about being kind so this won't be a new concept for the nasty child.

outvoid Sun 19-May-19 09:16:36

I think you were a tad harsh and it would’ve been much kinder to just explain it was a smaller party with only six children because that’s the truth really... It’s not as if it’s her usual big party and you’ve just excluded this girl because she’s mean, it is because it’s a smaller gathering this year.

She is a six year old. I get that she’s mean to your DD and to other DC too but you ultimately have to remember, she’s six. I am a little aghast at her Mother just standing back listening to her DD demanding to come the party though...

PerfectPeony2 Sun 19-May-19 09:23:16

I can’t imagine ever taking to a 6 year old like that and making her cry. I think that’s horrible. You could have just said ‘No I’m sorry’. She’s just a child, it’s not her fault and the school are dealing with it.

If I was one of the other parents I would judge you.

Mummyoflittledragon Sun 19-May-19 09:24:47

All those saying soap is unreasonable and a bully herself were probably the school bully back in their day. DFOD

I’m sorry you were treated like that and were very confused. However this was your parents’ / care givers’ job, not op’s.

It did occur to me that the child may have additional needs. It isn’t always obvious when children do. A boy at dds school has been made to feel really crap. I know he has issues, possibly additional needs as well. I do feel sorry for him even though he’s not helped with his reputation and his mother hasn’t handled things well. He needs kindness, not ostracising. He plays up more because of his reputation imo. My dd and her friends have been asked if they will play with him during their breaks. She’s a kind girl and has agreed - they also can have time alone. They’re yr6.

Oliversmumsarmy Sun 19-May-19 09:27:30

I don’t think you were BU. The girl asked and you replied.

She can whinge all she likes but someone had to tell her and if the school was “dealing with it”, the fact this girl was still asking for an invite and bullying your dd then the way they were “dealing with it” was ineffectual.

I in one sentence you have probably done more for that girls future than all the pussy footing round the bullying.

You have just pointed out to her actions have consequences which is something she should have been taught before now.

EggAndButter Sun 19-May-19 09:27:35

Whilst a harsh lesson, this girl has just learnt something very important. When your u badger people into giving you something you want but they dint want to give you (eg a party invite)m you take the risk to get a harsh answer from a pissed of person (adult or child btw).

And yes it’s harsh but then so was she by being on your dd’s back and then yours to get what she wanted.

My first thought is that she isn’t used to be told NO and that insisting a bit more gets her what she wants at home.
Followed by the fact she is a little bully in the making and having someone standing up to her is actually doing her a lot of good.

diddl Sun 19-May-19 09:28:03

" I am a little aghast at her Mother just standing back listening to her DD demanding to come the party though..."

Well that's the whole cause of it isn't it?

Not only did she ask, even though she never has been before-she then put Op on the spot by asking why?

TooManyPaws Sun 19-May-19 09:28:19

Of course she needs to understand consequences. The only reason she was crying was because she's not been pandered to and hasn't had her way. I learned consequences at nursery. No wonder she's causing problems with other children, more than just your daughter. One sharp reminder from an adult isn't going to harm her for life. I'm dealing with mental health fall-out from childhood emotional abuse but none of it comes from justified pulling up about behaviour by adults.

Langrish Sun 19-May-19 09:32:03

We’ve all felt like saying these things but at 6 you ought to have said it to her mother, not to her. Too late to do that now so you’ll just have to ride it out.
You can tell school but really, it’s not their responsibility to sort out.

Waveysnail Sun 19-May-19 09:32:08

Crikey it's a tough one. It gets frustrating constantly having your child upset due to another child and no progress seeming to be made in school. Iv also been on the other side when a parent approached me about my childs behaviour, unfortunately I was in a bad place and she ambushed me in the playground at pick up (highly anxious time for me anyway). I ended up cutting her off and telling her to speak to the school. Walked around the corner and burst into tears - sometimes contacting the parent isn't the best thing (my kids do have mild sen)

Bluntness100 Sun 19-May-19 09:32:35

How old is this little girl. Five, six?

No I would not have said it to a small child of this age, I'd have addressed it with the mother. And I don't believe anyone who is neuro typical just blurts something out in this scenario and has no control over what they say to small children.

EggAndButter Sun 19-May-19 09:35:16

Well the issue is that you can’t assume that every child who is misbehaving has some SEN/SN. Some of them if not most of them aren’t.

The school was supposed to deal with that. They clearly haven’t. Not in that very specific situation, not before with other issues with the OP’s dd and not with other children either.
The parents of that little girl haven’t dealt with it, eg by stopping her as soon as they saw her asking AGAIN on the playground.

So then what? Is the OP suppose to just stand back and not say anything ever? What would it teach her dd? That when someone is mean/rude, you just accept it and just try to deflect but never ever attack the problem head first?

If it had been one of my own dcs (one of has SN btw) and they had been behaving like this, I would have told them exactly what the OP said. You are not invited because you have been mean/unkind to the child. They need to learn the consequences of their behaviour.

Sarahandco Sun 19-May-19 09:36:11

Yes you were unreasonable.

She thinks your daughter is her best friend, are you sure this girl is the bully? are either children bullies or is it a case of she wants to be your daughters' friend and as a result is annoying your daughter, which is a different thing.

I feel for that girl to be honest.

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