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AIBU to be at my complete and utter wits end with this situation?

(80 Posts)
BunchOfBalloons Sun 07-Apr-19 00:00:53

Hi, I hope this isn’t too long but I want to give as much detail as not to drip feed.

I live in a new build block of apartments on the 2nd floor (top) with my 2 young children. It is a rented property from a private landlord who owns my flat and the two beneath me. There are also 3 other flats in this block that are home owners. I have lived here for 2 and a half years and was the first person to reside in this flat from being built.

From what I can gather the two flats beneath me are part of an agreement with my landlord and social services with residents that are vulnerable adults. On the ground floor is a man who had a serious head injury and is very quiet and pleasant - keeps himself to himself. On the 1st floor beneath me is an 18 year old male with learning disabilities. My landlord explained to me that he has the mental age of a 12 year old. He moved in around Sept/Oct 2018.

The block of flats is directly opposite a large park with an area that caters to keeping youth off the streets and in a safe environment. Admittedly where I live is a rough area, on the outskirts of a large city. It is not unheard of for there to be regular assaults, knife crime etc. Many incidents of this nature have taken place at the park.

Ok to the problem - The lad below me (lets call him Sean) has ties with many of the teenagers that frequent this park. They are basically using him and his flat as a doss house. Every single day there is drama. There are groups of 8+ hanging around on the communal stairs, swinging off the bannisters, shouting, screaming, arguing, slamming doors so much that the block shakes, loud music until gone 3am, foul language, damage to the block, throwing stones at windows, the list is endless. Myself and my neighbour opposite (homeowner) have kept in touch with the issues and she contacted social services. I have spoken to my landlord numerous times who repeatedly just tells me to call the police and never turns up when this commotion is happening. Sean has a care worker that comes every day for a few hours, but as soon as she is gone the commotion begins. Its literally every day. It came to a head a fortnight ago when one bang too many sent me flying into a rage down the stairs to ask what the fuck was going on. I have never confronted any of them before this. I was laughed at and mocked by the 10+ group of teenagers, I managed to get them out of the block and went to talk to Sean by himself in his flat. Everything I said to him regarding the behaviours and issues went over his head, he just doesn’t understand. Everybody - the landlord, the carers even the police seem to be pacifying him. Nobody is taking into account the effect its having on everbody else that lives here.

I can’t live like this anymore, it’s making my life a misery. Unbeknownst to them, I am also classified as a vulnerable adult. I have a number of mental health disorders and this situation is excerberating them to a point where I have had the crisis team visiting me for the last 2 weeks. I can’t live like this anymore, I don’t have the funds to move house and the council knocked me off the housing register as I already have a roof over my head. I just dont know what to do, it’s making me more ill than I already am. My situation is very complex and too much to post on this one thread, but this home felt like an eventual place of safety after many very difficult years. I have C-PTSD and the bangs and shouting are triggering me on a daily basis - I feel like my safety and privacy has been taken away from me and I am constantly scared, angered and frustrated in my own home. My children get upset and nervous about coming home, it’s hell.

stayathomegardener Sun 07-Apr-19 00:07:58

I don't want to leave this unanswered. It sounds an intolerable situation.
But what to do...
Bumping for someone helpful.

Mammyloveswine Sun 07-Apr-19 00:10:28

That sounds horrendous.. have you contacted social services? They might a position to act more than the landlord as ipresume the vulnerable adult has an allocated social worker.

Dont give up op... you deserve so much better. Sorry i cant give too much advice.

devuskums Sun 07-Apr-19 00:12:17

I haven't got any advice apart from keep on at the vulnerable adults team and the police, keep a diary of all incidents, and contact neighborhood team at the council regarding the noise every time it happens. You have a right to quiet enjoyment in your own home, maybe you need to report it as a breach of the tenancy because of the noise/unwelcome visitors/dramas rather than because you are worried about the safety of the person (although I think your concerns are valid from what you have said). It sounds horrendous, you have my total sympathy. I have had problem neighbors in the past and know how horrible it is. I hope it gets sorted soon.

123bananas Sun 07-Apr-19 00:21:31

You need to speak to the local anti-social behaviour team at the council. They can draw together police, social services, housing and take representation from you as to the impact on your health and from your crisis support team if needed. He is vulnerable and this should be treated as an adult safeguarding issue in the same way as it would be a children's safeguarding issue if he were a 12 year old boy. The police have powers to enforce orders on some of these youth too, but if there is a risk to you and your children if you report from these youth they can make this known to housing/social services which may help you with emergency housing if it becomes unsafe.

RubberTreePlant Sun 07-Apr-19 00:22:11

YANBU to be frantic.

Would you now qualify for health priority or health related points if you reapplied to the housing list? Do you have HCPs who would support you in that?

OldAndWornOut Sun 07-Apr-19 00:25:42

I would point out to the council, the landlord and so on that you yourself are a vulnerable person.
That will put you on an 'equal footing' in terms of your own needs being met.

NotWhatWhat Sun 07-Apr-19 00:32:05

You need to complain and complain and complain. Get your neighbours to complain as well. Write to the council environmental health team about the noise. Maybe record some sample noise so they can see what you are having to put up with. Complain to your landlord daily if need be.
The lad below you has every right to be housed but if he is not capable of living in such a way that he doesn't severely disturb his neighbours then he needs better supervision and support.

BunchOfBalloons Sun 07-Apr-19 00:36:41

Thank you for your replies. It just seems that the issue is passed from pillar to post. I am aware there was a meeting last week with a number of agencies including police and social services, but I do not know of the outcome as I was too ill too attend. My neighbour (homeowner) opposite is lovely, I think I may open up to her more about my personal situation and see if she can help support me further as I am so unwell at the moment I just can’t think straight or function properly.

BunchOfBalloons Sun 07-Apr-19 00:38:31

Its taken me all day to write this post, thank you for your help.

Driftingthoughlife Sun 07-Apr-19 00:40:16

Tell the crisis team you want an asbrac. It’s a multi agency response meeting in which the police, social services, housing etc meet and they are set targets.
The fact you and Sean are both vunerable you should get this no problem. Also if they are taking advantage of Sean because of his disability that also comes under hate crime and report via the true vision website. Your equality police officer should get involved then and you may be sign posted to a disability charity who can help. Many have hate crime projects that work with the police. If you live in the north west I can tell you which charity can help

DishingOutDone Sun 07-Apr-19 00:46:16

Drifting has it on the nail, the Crisis Team should be arranging this - what have they said? If they haven't helped you could make an appointment to see your MP to save you having to go to x different agencies if they are giving you the run around.

Marchinupandownagain Sun 07-Apr-19 00:46:35

" if he is not capable of living in such a way that he doesn't severely disturb his neighbours then he needs better supervision and support"

Victim-blamey comment alert. Also smacks of "why aren't they all in institutions away from 'normal folk'? ' crap that people are so fond of spouting whenever anyone with LD lives near them.

OP: He's being abused by the louts, if there was a meeting including both Police and SS it is almost certainly already under Adult Safeguarding, as it should be. You may not be advised unless he is willing for you to know as he is entitled to as much privacy as anyone else. Doesn't mean nothing is happening. But honestly if this was a non-LD person there might be the same issues - people have dodgy friends and contacts all over. I'm sure it's really hard but the answer if not, as some posters appear to want, just to put him away or have him watched 24/7.

OldAndWornOut Sun 07-Apr-19 00:51:21

It would depend on whether he is deemed to have capacity to decide for himself who he befriends.
I would say though, that unless you make a real fuss, nothing much is going to happen to sort out the problem.

I had similar with 2 girls who lived in the flat above me, and it was absolute hell, so you have my sympathies.

Crabbyandproudofit Sun 07-Apr-19 00:51:24

This is a dreadful situation for you to be in. I think you need to get onto Social Services about Sean because his vulnerability means he is unsafe with these teenagers taking advantage of him - mention Safeguarding because they will have procedures to follow.

For yourself, I would go back to the Council Housing Department because you have evidence that your mental health is being adversely affected, you are no longer adequately housed. You initially liked living there and felt comfortable, would you want to move if the current problems were resolved? If you think you could be happy there again you may want to involve Housing in reaching a solution rather than moving you?

sobeyondthehills Sun 07-Apr-19 00:54:33

We had something similar to this, the tennant downstairs was classed as vulnerable, in the end the police raided her house and it was closed off due to cuckooing, so next time you speak to someone mention that.

I will say we only moved in three weeks before this happened, but even we were fairly worried

Yabbers Sun 07-Apr-19 00:58:06

Victim-blamey comment alert. Also smacks of "why aren't they all in institutions away from 'normal folk'? ' crap that people are so fond of spouting whenever anyone with LD lives near them.

Rubbish. It’s a valid point. If an adult with a mental age of 12 is housed in a situation where he is being abused and taken advantage of by people, then of course he should be given more support and supervision. That’s not victim blaming, that’s SS blaming. The problem is not that he is housed there, it is that he is housed there with inadequate support. It may well be that it is not appropriate for him to be living alone in that situation . That’s not his fault, it is not blaming him, it is concern he is being out in a vulnerable position.

madroid Sun 07-Apr-19 00:59:19

Ring the police and tell them the kids visiting are dealing drugs. They'll be all over you like a rash.

Sparklesocks Sun 07-Apr-19 01:01:38

Sounds really difficult OP, I don’t have much knowledge on the subject but I’m sure a lot of other posters will. Just wanted to say YANBU

BunchOfBalloons Sun 07-Apr-19 01:05:45

Crisis team were pretty useless tbh, I was put on sedative medication (yep great when I am the sole carer of two young children with zero support) and didnt even turn up for two appointments. My coping mechanism has always been to put on a ‘mask’ - I cant let my children outwardly see how frantic I am feeling inside, I try so hard not to let my mental health diagnoses affect them too, but it seems like because I am not projecting how ill I am nobody is taking me seriously. I have a number for a social worker that was assigned to me recently (case closed though) would it be worth talking to them regarding the situation too?

OldAndWornOut Sun 07-Apr-19 01:08:58

Yes, I think so.
As many people as you can, I would say, and keep a note of each conversation and their names.

Rainbowqueeen Sun 07-Apr-19 01:09:32

Would shelter be able to help? I’ve never had any dealings with them but they are the housing experts?

They may be able to tell you what should be happening and act as your advocate.
Good luck it sounds horrible

Driftingthoughlife Sun 07-Apr-19 01:13:10

Yep the social worker should also be able to refer to asbrac. You need this op as the police and housing will have to report what they are doing directly to this meeting every month. Environmental health are also usually there

isitfridayyet1 Sun 07-Apr-19 01:16:31

I'd contact the environmental health at the local council. We had a similar problem and after us completing a noise log, they came to install noise recording equipment.

If the noise is above a certain level the council can take action against the occupant. It may not sound nice but when the landlord and social services find out you've gone down the legal route i.e via the council they may start to pay attention!

RedHatsDoNotSuitMe Sun 07-Apr-19 01:53:16

Hi OP. Didn't want to read and run. flowers for you as this sounds totally horrible and you have my sympathy.

What I'm going to say has mostly been said above, but I'll add my bit anyway. My 'expertise' pah is with children under 11, so I'm not an expert at all, but my DH used to work in housing for a local authority, so:

Firstly, complain, complain, complain. Be as vocal as possible. DH always says that you deal with the gobby/noisy ones to shut them up/make them go away. So (as you've been advised upthread) complain to EVERYONE at your local council - housing, environmental health, social services. EVERY department you think might be relevant, complain to them. Be a pain in the arse. But don't whinge. So nothing "oh, oh, oh... this is so meeeaan". Keep it factual. On x date this happened at this time. The impact on me/my family was xxxx On Y date this happened at this time. The impact on me/my family was..... etc etc.

Second, copy in your local MP/counsellor.

Sorry, this should be 1st nor third.... Keep a diary. Record EVERYTHING. Make it factual. Dates/times/events or situations. Local authorities need facts to make things happen, so give them those facts with your diary. Scan/copy it and attach it to EVERY letter/email/tweet. Encourage neighbours to do the same. If you have witnesses (such as a friend over) get them to sign your written record as they then become an extra witness.

Agree with the PP who said speak to Shelter - they ARE the housing experts. Also speak to your CAB. AND your housing department. And if you've been under SS , speak to them as well.

Also, if your DC are under any kind of formal care (eg a nursery) speak to them and ask them to report if there are any concerns (eg, if any of your DC are tired due to disturbed sleep because of neighbour).

Keep in mind that your neighbour is super-vulnerable, and this isn't his fault. But there SHOULD be support services available to him because of his needs. Report to them as well.

It is (as pps have said) a safe guarding issue if a young and vulnerable adult is taken advantage of.

RedHatsDoNotSuitMe Sun 07-Apr-19 01:58:24

also, if you can bring yourself to; contact your local media (if you can stand to be in your local rag with a "sad" face)

Our elected representatives usually love a photo op,and nothing brings out the cameras like a local story!

Shinesweetfreedom Sun 07-Apr-19 02:49:27

Try Shelter.They have been marvellous for a case I directed to them

clairemcnam Sun 07-Apr-19 03:14:16

This is so awful. The difficulty will be if he is deemed to have capacity to choose his own friends, then nothing will be done. I know services do respond when drug dealers take over vulnerable peoples flats, but it does not sound as if that is happening here.
You need someone on your side with power to change this. If your MP or local councillor is particularly good they may be able to sort it. So I would try them. Agree with trying Shelter. Might also be worth trying youth services. Youth services may not see it as their problem, but you might be lucky and there might be someone who will take on sorting this out.
Do you phone the police when it happens? If not start to do so, every single time. Even if they never come out. Reports are often used in multi agency meetings to agree problem hotspots they are going to tackle. Even better if other people will report it to the police as well.
Ultimately though, you may have to move home.

clairemcnam Sun 07-Apr-19 03:22:02

And contact your local anti social behaviour team and tell them what is happening and tell them you are a vulnerable adult with young children. It is their job to sort out situations like this.

DuffBeer Sun 07-Apr-19 08:51:53

This sounds horrendous. Nobody should have to live like this and Sean's 'entitlement' to live independently should not be to the detriment of many other people living in close proximity.

Personally, I would get in contact with your MP. They generally listen to their constituents and do take action (well, our local MP is very proactive).

I really hope this gets sorted.

PlainSpeakingStraightTalking Sun 07-Apr-19 09:07:44

Ok to the problem - The lad below me (lets call him Sean) has ties with many of the teenagers that frequent this park

Social services every time. He is a vulnerable young person and he is being taken advantage of.

101. SS. LA Safeguarding - every single day.

PlainSpeakingStraightTalking Sun 07-Apr-19 09:09:14

@redhats also, if you can bring yourself to; contact your local media (if you can stand to be in your local rag with a "sad" face) because shaming a person with LD and vulnerabilities such a humane thing to do … not to mention all his mates in the park with know who you are ….

longwayoff Sun 07-Apr-19 09:32:07

Balloons, sounds hideous. In my experience, institutions will pass a problem around, nobody takes any action until something goes wrong, then its someone else's fault etc. I suggest you get some individual legal advice and remind your landlord in the strongest terms that they need to take action or you will sue them for x, y and z. This is usually effective in helping them concentrate on finding a solution. Best wishes.

worldsbestprocrastinator Sun 07-Apr-19 09:42:10

Everything everyone else has said! Oh OP, I really feel for you.
Has the safeguarding team been involved? You can report the situation directly to them, and they then decide whether to take it further. Multi-agency working is absolutely key here. And definitely contact your MP. I work in a related field, and it can be quite amazing how suddenly previously unresolvable issues are dealt with once an MP has shown some interest.
I feel for you, and also for Sean. This is in now say victim blaming. It's trying to keep him safe too thanksthanksthanks

worldsbestprocrastinator Sun 07-Apr-19 09:43:03

"No way" victim blaming that should say.

ToEarlyForDecorations Sun 07-Apr-19 09:47:08

because shaming a person with LD and vulnerabilities such a humane thing to do … not to mention all his mates in the park with know who you are

OK, just leave it until there is a murder (of *Sean) or a serious fire in his flat or the stairwell etc.

ToEarlyForDecorations Sun 07-Apr-19 09:50:15

It sounds like *Sean is or could be being exploited somehow. Getting involved is not shaming the person. This word, 'shaming' can drop out of fashion as soon as it likes. It just takes the place of, 'intervention' from a few years ago.

hatgirl Sun 07-Apr-19 10:01:44

This sort of situation is exactly the type of thing that should be referred to ASBRAC (although I'm not sure this exists nationwide).

In your shoes I would find out who your police community liaison officer is (you can usually find this out online by visiting your police force's website and contact them directly rather than using 101. They have a remit to have their nose to the ground regarding local crime and antisocial behaviour issues and are more likely to take an interest than a randomly assigned PC. Once you have made contact with them make it clear you want it dealing with as a persistent ASB issue against vulnerable adults (you and Sean).

Secondly, Sean must have either been assessed as having the mental capacity to understand and agree to a tenancy agreement, or if he hasn't then it should have gone through the court of protection to agree for it to be signed by someone else on his behalf. Even the most basic easy read tenancy agreements for people with LD always include a section about anti social behaviour (your situation is an extremely common problem sadly) and as people have identified if this is happening to Sean he either needs more support to protect himself or if he is a willing participant then he is subject to the same rules as everyone else regarding antisocial behaviour and tenancy agreements.

For what it's worth your landlord is probably receiving a higher rate of housing benefit for providing accommodation specifically for someone requiring 'care and support' (supported living) which may explain why he isn't in a hurry to give notice.

Equally the Sean's of this world do have to live somewhere, and thankfully there are some very understanding landlords out there. It doesn't change the fact though that you shouldn't have to live like this.

wizzywig Sun 07-Apr-19 10:05:35

Sorry i havent read the thread. Isnt this called cuckooing? The police and ss need to be involved

SaveKevin Sun 07-Apr-19 10:15:19

Yes it’s cuckooing, my police force take it really seriously. Your being let down op (as is Sean).
I don’t know what the answer is (well I do, they move Sean away to slightly more supported living so he’s not so convenient for his ‘friends’).

Every hint of them call the police, but I know this isn’t solving your mental health. flowers you need to protect yourself, the logical thing seems to be your case worker pressures Sean to do something. But I know it’s really not that simple.

NotWhatWhat Sun 07-Apr-19 10:18:41


^ Victim-blamey comment alert. Also smacks of "why aren't they all in institutions away from 'normal folk'? ' crap that people are so fond of spouting whenever anyone with LD lives near them.^

Wow, your comment to my post suggesting 'Sean' needs more supervision and support is really rude and incorrect. I didn't mention anything about putting people with LD in institutions or anything remotely similar. You've completely made that up.

WifOfBif Sun 07-Apr-19 10:22:04

I work with vulnerable adults exactly like this.

He is being exploited and potentially putting himself at risk. Report to SS via the MASH team (google contact details) every single day if you need to.

MiniEggAddiction Sun 07-Apr-19 10:31:50

That sounds awful. It sounds like this vulnerable adult shouldn't be living independently. He needs to be in some kind of sheltered accommodation. I think you need professional advice - have you contacted shelter? Do the police attend when you'll them? Can you make the focus the fact that a vulnerable adult is having his house occupied by teenagers instead of the noise issues? God I'm not surprised your mental health is suffering.

DaphneduM Sun 07-Apr-19 10:33:25

Sympathies here - carry on reporting it - Sean is a vulnerable adult and Social Services are not effectively safeguarding him. Definitely write to your MP too. No-one is a winner here - sounds like the various agencies need a serious nudge to get it sorted.

JaneEyre07 Sun 07-Apr-19 10:36:12

This poor lad is being taken advantage of, pure and simple. They're not his friends, they're using his flat. And that can't go on.

Next time it happens, video what's going on with your phone. Record the time and date on it. And then send to SS and Environmental Health. And repeat as necessary. And get as many as the other NDN's on board as possible, tell them it's making you very unwell and you aren't being listened to. The more voices, the better.

It's not remotely comparable but we had a NDN who was making our lives an utter misery by lighting bonfires most days. In the end I stood in our bedroom videoing it with my phone and proving that my garden was absolutely covered with smoke and I couldn't use my garden or have any doors/windows open. The council were a lot more helpful when I sent them an array of videos.

hatgirl Sun 07-Apr-19 10:40:24

Whilst I agree it's potentially a safeguarding issue in reality there isn't a huge amount social services can do without the support of other agencies such as community police, housing support workers, NHS positive behaviour support etc. That's why ASBRAC if it exists in the OPs area is far more likely to have a positive impact as it pulls all the different agencies together.

As the OP says, he does have support for parts of the day but the kids just wait until they leave. You could argue that his support could be increased but what if 'Sean' doesn't want what is effectively a bodyguard in his flat all day? Its highly likely social services are already aware of the situation but short of suggesting to Sean that he doesn't let them in or he's putting his tenancy at risk, or increasing his support (unlikely due to extremely tight budgets) they can't essentially make Sean not associate with people he sees as friends.

The landlord also isn't an LD specialist and his 'assessment' that Sean has the mental age of 12 may be far off the mark - Sean may actually be reasonably capable if he is living in a flat on his own with minimal support.

endofthelinefinally Sun 07-Apr-19 10:40:51

Ot sounds as though Sean should be in shared, supported accommodation. He is being targeted and exploited in his current situation.
I agree that asking other residents to get together and contact all the appropriate people.

squee123 Sun 07-Apr-19 10:41:10

Does your landlord own the freehold? If not find out who the freeholder is and encourage the homeowners to report it to them as the landlords leasehold may well have conditions that are being breached

hatgirl Sun 07-Apr-19 10:46:05

Having read the OPs posts again it appears that there has already been a meeting recently with police/social services etc.

Sounds like things are already moving in the right direction then OP. It's unlikely that the outcome of this meeting will be shared with you in detail, and you may not see an immediate change but hopefully there are now plans in place that will start to alleviate some of the difficulties you are having.

Livelovebehappy Sun 07-Apr-19 10:46:34

Horrible situation. Why the hell its deemed to be okay to let someone with a mental age of 12 live independently is mind boggling. Would society allow a 12 year old to live on their own?? He’s obviously going to be a target for teens to take advantage, and it is putting him at danger of physical/financial abuse. At the very least he should be in a warden controlled environment where he would be far safer. OP you need to document every single incident in a diary and present to your local council for relevant social services team to investigate. I had a friend many years ago who had to resort to this when a vulnerable adult lived next door to her who would knock on her door at all hours and scare her half to death. Horrible situation for you to be in, even if you didn’t have MH problems yourself.

marfisa Sun 07-Apr-19 10:50:21

Yes, this is cuckooing and the police need to take it seriously!

Best of luck to you, OP, it sounds awful.

Livelovebehappy Sun 07-Apr-19 10:51:59

Also, as PP has said, contact your MP. I’ve had to do that once and if you have a good one they will be a good source to escalate this. Even threaten taking it to your local press if no action is taken.

juneau Sun 07-Apr-19 10:52:43

I'm really shocked that an 18-year-old with the mental age ofa 12-year-old has been given his own flat. Surely he's a really obvious target for those wanting to take advantage - local rough youths with nothing better to do, even drug dealers/cuckooing. I would report every single incident to the landlord, SS and police 101 and for any incident where you fear for your safety 999. All calls are logged, so a record of your concerns will quickly build up. It sounds like a horrible, scary and very stressful situation for anyone to be living in, let alone someone with MH problems and PTSD. I hope you're able to get some action take on this OP. This young man needs to be housed in a block with other vulnerable adults with care workers on site making sure that no one is taking advantage of him.

Boysey45 Sun 07-Apr-19 10:56:28

Definitely go to see your M.P they will sort it out and not be fobbed off. Agencies do listen and sort things out more when an M.P is involved.

HerewardTheWoke Sun 07-Apr-19 10:58:33

Go to your local councillors and MP. It's completely unacceptable that you are having to wait so long for a resolution to this.

hatgirl Sun 07-Apr-19 10:59:25

livelove it's only the landlord's assessment that he has the mental ability of a 12 year old - and it's pretty meaningless because even actual 12 year olds have a wide variation in what they are emotionally capable of dealing with.

This man isn't 12, he is an adult, an adult who despite having a Learning Disability has presumably been assessed as being able to live reasonably independently, and has made the choice to do so.

It's extremely unlikely being in a warden controlled flat would make much difference. If Sean said he wanted those people in his flat then a warden wouldn't have the right to stop him having who he wanted in his flat.

Anyway, it sounds like the appropriate authorities are already aware and are attempting to deal with it.

rosinavera Sun 07-Apr-19 11:05:02

I'm staggered that the Crisis Team aren't helping you with this. Can you get an appointment with Citizens Advice - I've always found them so helpful to me in the past. Big hug for you OP xx

SnowyAlpsandPeaks Sun 07-Apr-19 11:09:39

Would contacting MIND help? I needed their help with benefits when I first became unwell and was assigned a mental health support worker who came out and helped me with more than benefits in the end. They were fantastic. Could they advocate on your behalf in meetings etc?

EffYouSeeKaye Sun 07-Apr-19 11:10:56

Victim-blamey comment alert. Also smacks of "why aren't they all in institutions away from 'normal folk'? ' crap that people are so fond of spouting whenever anyone with LD lives near them.

No it wasn’t. The poster clearly said Sean needed more support and supervision.

It is cuckooing, as other have said. Good advice upthread, I’m sorry you’re in this situation but you can get help. Flag your own vulnerability, request (insist on) a multi-agency meeting and keep calling out this ‘cuckooing’ of Sean’s accommodation. Best of luck to you, op flowers

speakout Sun 07-Apr-19 11:13:43

OP I am sorry you are in this difficult situation.

There are two options really.

1. You try to fix the problems around you.
2. You move.

I understand you don't have the finances to move, but realistically can you change your environment?

Other posters have come ou with very good, sensible plans and ideas but in my experience ( and I have lived in a rough area) it won't be changed by pne person, or even a few.
Persitent troublemakers will be moved on, individual problems solved, only to be replaced bu others of the same.
You could spend a lifetime fighting, contacting social services, police etc, and still the problems remain.

In you position I would throw everything possible into trying to move. For your sake, for you children's sake.
Move town, relocate, there are some wonderful places in the UK, There may be places close to where you are living now.
Could you sell or rent your property and find work elsewhere?

I don't mean to sound glib, but life is short and we have to make things happen sometimes.

EffYouSeeKaye Sun 07-Apr-19 11:16:36

Op is a tenant, she doesn’t own her flat, speakout

Tinysarah1985 Sun 07-Apr-19 11:17:33

Have you contaced the police? It sounds very muck like cuckoo-ing. Where a vulnerable person is taken advantage of and others use their house/money etc

Reaah Sun 07-Apr-19 11:19:58

Can you invite the case worker up to yours, after visiting theneighbour, so they can witness the behaviour for themselves?

Or can you get video evidence to show police/care worker.

hatgirl Sun 07-Apr-19 11:22:42

I can't speak for the OPs crisis team rosa but certainly in my area the crisis team are so stretched they can't even appropriately respond to actual crisis situations - recently the earliest I could get a call back about someone suicidal on a Friday night was Monday afternoon. That's just a call back and not even an actual response. They certainly don't have the resources to be supporting people with long term housing/ antisocial behaviour issues.

youngestisapsycho Sun 07-Apr-19 11:32:25

How is someone with a mental age of a 12 yr old allowed to live alone?

Gazelda Sun 07-Apr-19 11:32:33

As a point of interest, i know that in some areas there are courses being run for people who have learning disabilities, helping them to recognise these sort of friendships as exploitative, and giving them support to extricate themselves from unsafe friendships.

The community police officer and social care team should know if there are any such courses around (possibly run by mencap). In 100% certain they funding could be found to run such courses if an agency were prepared to lead on organising.

OP, get back in touch with the social worker team and ask them to help you resolve this. It sounds intolerable and you shouldn't have yo live like this.

Nor should Sean be left vulnerable to these people.

BunchOfBalloons Sun 07-Apr-19 11:44:32

Thank you all for your advice, there is a wealth of valuable information on here that I will take on board. Have bought a notepad to use as a diary in which I am going to record the daily events. Will try and get some video/sound footage but am wary because this gang are so intimidating. My lovely neighbour opposite is also at her wits end with the situation and determined to get somewhere with it, so I am popping over tomorrow to show her this thread and hopefully get a plan sorted together. I am going to make a list today of all the numbers to call and start tomorrow.

Thank you again.

hatgirl Sun 07-Apr-19 11:48:42

How is someone with a mental age of a 12 yr old allowed to live alone?

See above. Because they are an adult, and not actually 12. They also have daily support, which sounds like they need support to keep things going but not 24 hours a day.

Plus a 'mental age' of 12 would actually indicate a mild rather than a moderate or severe learning disability and some Local Authorities set the criteria of access to their LD services at the moderate level. Most 12 year olds are able to grasp the concept of right and wrong.

People with LD aren't some kind of subspecies needing to be controlled and protected, they are capable of having dodgy mates and making bad decisions like the rest of us. I'm not for one moment saying this lad isn't vulnerable (most 18 year olds with LD I know continue living with parents until they are a bit older just like NT 28 year olds - the fact he's in supported living at 18 suggests he's probably got other stuff going on as well). But shutting him away somewhere to keep him safe and solve the problem isn't the answer.

Fluffycloudland77 Sun 07-Apr-19 11:49:42

I think you both need to make official complaints every single day.

Make them all dread your phone calls. It’s not easy but it’s what dh does when he wants results and it does work.

You have to be such a nuisance it affects their working life.

BunchOfBalloons Sun 07-Apr-19 11:53:00

My landlord also owns many properties in the area, I have already asked him a couple of days ago to please consider me if a suitable property becomes available as I want to move. He tried to kick me out last summer (whole other story) as I assume he wanted all 3 flats for these care purposes. Turns out he had done many things illegally regarding my tenancy and he didn’t have a leg to stand on once confronted so he allowed me to remain. Ideally it would be better to move away from this landlord too, but money is an issue.

BoneyBackJefferson Sun 07-Apr-19 11:58:22

if you can bring yourself to; contact your local media (if you can stand to be in your local rag with a "sad" face) because shaming a person with LD and vulnerabilities such a humane thing to do … not to mention all his mates in the park with know who you are

Do you really think that his "mates" in quotes because they are not really his "mates" will take kindly to your suggestion?

The OP is between a rock and a hard place, and as always the care in the community system is letting everybody down other than the scum that are taking advantage of "Sean".

endofthelinefinally Sun 07-Apr-19 12:03:58

I know a young man who is living in a shared house with others of similar age. One of the rooms in the shared house is occupied by their support worker. They all have just the right level of independence but there is a housemate there to keep tabs on everything. I think this kind of set up is much better and prevents the kind of exploitation that is happening in the OP's situation.

KittyInTheCradle Sun 07-Apr-19 12:11:24

I agree, it sounds like Sean is being taken advantage of by these teenagers. It's a safeguarding issue.

There could be more to it, they could be taking his money or his stuff or doing things in his flat that he's not happy with. Sadly this happens a lot to vulnerable adults sad

KittyInTheCradle Sun 07-Apr-19 12:13:20

It sounds like he probably has a social worker, who will need to look at this and see what can be done to help

LakieLady Sun 07-Apr-19 12:15:50

Agree that this is cuckooing, a safeguarding issue and that an ASBRAC is required.

I work for an HA that provides the sort of support your neighbour seems to get, OP. About 10 years ago, they were pressurised to house a young man with an LD, despite reservations that his support needs were too high for our particular project.

The situation became almost identical to the one you describe: young people from all over the area were using his flat as a party house, he was buying booze and weed for them because he enjoyed their company and thought they were his friends. Adult social care refused to accept that he was inappropriately placed and housing were always on our case, because of all the noise nuisance and ASB.

It all came to a head when we raised a financial abuse safeguarding, because he was spending all his money on entertaining his friends. While this was being looked into, the police got involved when some of his friends blew up the post box outside, and they convened an ASBRAC.

The young man was rehoused into accommodation where there was a much higher level of support, and we never got accused of cherry-picking our clients again.

qazxc Sun 07-Apr-19 12:22:49

Complain, complain, complain.
Record and report every instance. You almost have to become a nuisance for people to act nowadays.
I had a family member like Sean, and he had to be moved in the end. It was hard as he thought that the people using him where his friends/giving him booze and weed. In the end a facebook page full of bullying photos and videos of him was the tipping point, this included a video of them setting his hair on fire when he was asleep on the couch. But even now he still thinks it was "banter" and that they were his mates.

hatgirl Sun 07-Apr-19 12:24:37

It's also extraordinarily expensive endoftheline which means that councils with extremely stretched budgets are being forced to move away from that kind of model unless the person's needs requires them to have someone present 24 hours a day they will more likely have someone popping in to support a few times a day like Sean.

Even on minimum wage 24 hour support is £197 a day (£1379 a week, or £71722 a year).

How many 12 year olds would realistically need someone with them 24 hours a day? Most 12-18 year olds would be capable of making themselves basic meals, having a wash, changing their clothes, getting themselves a drink, getting a bus into town, managing basic finances, understanding consequences etc. They might need reminding with some stuff and some support with other stuff but they aren't completely helpless.

OP it sounds like a really shit situation flowers

clairemcnam Sun 07-Apr-19 12:30:40

I too suspect the only way this will change is if Sean is moved away. Because he sees these teenagers as his friends.
And legally adults with LD are allowed to make bad decisions, just as adults without LDs are allowed to.

OldAndWornOut Sun 07-Apr-19 14:34:07

I think there is a readiness to put people into situations which they sometimes aren't able to cope with, and I have come across it in my work with a housing charity.
A young man was befriended by a group of older teens.

When they tired of him, he became obsessed with one of them and ended up being charged with an offence.

His mum had continually told his social worker that it was too much to expect him to manage with just visiting support, but they brushed her aside as it ticked boxes to say that he was living an age appropriate, independent life.

Tatiannatomasina Sun 07-Apr-19 14:44:03

Call the police and tell them under the anti social behaviour act you want them to consider a closure order on your neighbours flat. Do not back down, keep pushing them to take steps to either remove the tenant or have the flat closed and boarded. Please read up about it this legislation can help you.

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