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Is there no depths PIP will go to...

(103 Posts)
Home77 Sun 24-Mar-19 11:45:20

Saw this today, shocking. Pip called a lady a 'lying bitch' in her appeal submission. Kind of confirms the DWP attitude really. Horrible.

Sexist as well...

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/22/dwp-document-refers-to-benefit-claimant-as-lying-bitch?CMP=share_btn_tw&fbclid=IwAR2OcNV34F2dyDS7S15k_aw9nEIMLVii6gfKNN-sskR40sPJJxC9hGuldmo

TheQueef Sun 24-Mar-19 11:48:31

I'm amazed no one lost their job.
They sent copies calling her a lying bitch to the tribunal as well as berself.

SwimmingKaren Sun 24-Mar-19 11:50:44

That’s shocking. But how can you be a full time carer for somebody else while being so disabled you qualify for PIP yourself? That doesn’t make sense.

ThatFalseEquivalenceTho Sun 24-Mar-19 11:52:17

@SwimmingKaren probably because she was no fucking choice but to be his carer.

Barrenfieldoffucks Sun 24-Mar-19 11:52:37

People can work full time and still get PIP

TheQueef Sun 24-Mar-19 11:53:38

Disabled people can be carers, most times there's no choice.
Lots of disabled couples care for each other.
Also pip is an IN work benefit.

SwimmingKaren Sun 24-Mar-19 11:56:33

Thanks, was lost for a second then! I suppose if you’re in a couple it means carrying out basic care tasks between you depending on who is able. Hmm wonder how DWP will explain their way out of this one. shock

Home77 Sun 24-Mar-19 11:57:19

There can be different criteria. For example the mobility part about being unable to walk...well that could apply if the person was in a wheelchair but they could possibly also care for another- depending on the care needs. It's not simple.

Even if they felt there were discrepancies they could have pointed that out for the appeals without the need to call the person a lying bitch.

killpop Sun 24-Mar-19 11:58:32

What even is a "mid rate carers allowance component"? I thought CA was a standard amount - minus any deductions for overlap.

Home77 Sun 24-Mar-19 12:02:50

Yes, that's right (carers') could they meant the person cared for gets the standard ('mid") rate PIP?!?

Tomtontom Sun 24-Mar-19 12:03:21

You wouldn't receive carers allowance if the other person only received the mobility element.

The decision maker raises a valid point. If you claim you can't (for example) cook a meal, then you shouldn't be claiming CA for cooking etc for somebody else. There are valid cases, but CA claims go largely unchecked, and there are definitely some that take the piss.

The issue here though is that the language shows just what DWP staff think of claimants. People with disabilities are treated like crap by this government.

TheQueef Sun 24-Mar-19 12:04:34

Hard to hide the contempt in this case.

sashh Sun 24-Mar-19 12:05:24

I'm amazed no one lost their job.

They never do, they are not even disciplined.

I had to appeal for PIP, I wrote a long letter that included the cost for hand controls I pay for my car.

The assessor wrote back saying that if I can drive then I can walk because driving needs you to use your feet.

I mean for FFS he only had to actually read the letter.

That’s shocking. But how can you be a full time carer for somebody else while being so disabled you qualify for PIP yourself? That doesn’t make sense.

If you were diagnosed with terminal cancer would you stop being a parent?

Home77 Sun 24-Mar-19 12:07:01

Bit if you read the link it is not about cooking it seems to be about the mobility element, arguing that the person can drive...it doesn't even make sense..

SwimmingKaren Sun 24-Mar-19 12:11:39

If you were diagnosed with terminal cancer would you stop being a parent?

Well of course not. But if I was so ill I couldn’t cook for myself then by extension I then also couldn’t cook for my children and would need outside help which is what I was querying and other posters cleared up re: rates for mobility etc.

Home77 Sun 24-Mar-19 12:15:41

Here's the link to the Rightsnet discussion on it.

www.rightsnet.org.uk/forums/viewthread/14271

Says they have seen similar in other papers also!- and it is not good for DWP when they go to appeal either.

SwimmingKaren Sun 24-Mar-19 12:17:48

It makes them look terrible. I can’t see there is anything they can say to excuse those comments tbh.

Home77 Sun 24-Mar-19 12:17:48

One of the advisors commenting on an appeal where the DWP sent a PO (presenting officer). Sounds, em, interesting-

"Both tribunals were equally appalled but, rightly, focused on the facts of the case albeit that the credibility of their case was damaged irretrievably. My recall (we’re going back close to a decade ago here) was that one case had a PO and one did not. The one with the PO was priceless. They had clearly picked up the papers that day as part of their “I’ve only got one case I’ve been told to represent on but it’s Friday so I’m going to stay here; pick up the odd case and do the crossword” strategy. I’m awful on eye contact/body language but even I could see them casually flicking through the papers at the outset and the sudden freeze when they spotted it."

clairemcnam Sun 24-Mar-19 12:22:47

The language is terrible.
But I too do not understand how you can claim PIP and carers allowance. Carers allowance means you need to be caring at least 35 hours a week. Yes you can need help with basic tasks and be able to do a bit to help someone else. But 35 hours a week caring minimum is a significant amount of caring.

Maddy32 Sun 24-Mar-19 12:24:46

Excuse me. My son has been very ill and hospitalised many times but at last got PIP last year. He needs to work for his mental state and to support his children but PIP now gives him the means to have a day off work etc if it all becomes too much. And PLEASE NOTE, if you work at all there is no other benefit you can get. What a struggle it was. We had to go to a tribunal after 18 months of rejection by the DWP and he was awarded an amazing benefit. DWP are dreadful.

clairemcnam Sun 24-Mar-19 12:26:27

It is very rare to get PIP if you work and are claiming because of mental health problems.

Flowerfae Sun 24-Mar-19 12:30:37

I was told to apply for DLA for having epilepsy (didn't think there was much point but tried anyway) a man came out to do an assessment and made a comment about keeping his eye on his coat in case we stole anything LOL

PerkingFaintly Sun 24-Mar-19 12:34:08

The article in the OP states what the Carers' Allowance is for:

“In this lying bitches [sic] case she is receiving the mid-rate carers [sic] allowance component for providing day time supervision to another disabled person. The tribunal may wish to explore this further,” the official writes.

Supervision is usually for people who can't stay safe or eg remember to do basic tasks without another person to guide or remind them (at least in PIP, IIUC).

So it wouldn't be at all surprising to have a couple where he is physically strong but suffering from dementia and needs the almost constant presence of another person (Carer's Allowance), and she is mentally fine but has a physical issue which limits her mobility or her ability to chop veg, heft pans, do up buttons or bathe (PIP for mobility and/or personal care).

SinkGirl Sun 24-Mar-19 12:34:22

That’s shocking. But how can you be a full time carer for somebody else while being so disabled you qualify for PIP yourself? That doesn’t make sense.

Are you kidding?

I have severe endometriosis, adenomyosis, ME, and a diagnosis of fibromyalgia although it seems at present that’s a misdiagnosis and it may actually be something neurological.

I also have twin toddlers - one has ASD, the other has ASD, a visual impairment, brain damage and a condition causing hypoglycaemia. Also waiting on test results for adrenal insufficiency.

I have no choice but to care for them - there’s no one else that can do it. You have no idea how unwell I make myself doing the things that I need, but I have no option. My health was poor before pregnancy but nothing like this - I’ve gone way downhill, didn’t expect to have twins, and definitely didn’t expect to have twins with disabilities.

I’m not sure what people think they would do if their child or partner were disabled and they became disabled themselves?

DishingOutDone Sun 24-Mar-19 12:42:42

Hmm wonder how DWP will explain their way out of this one - well, they don't have to do they? What do you think might compel them to act? Even when highlighted here, discussion has focused on the fact that actually, they might have a point.

They could have written this woman is a fucking cunt and nothing would happen. That's why the person who wrote it was confident that they could.

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