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To change primary schools for this?

(97 Posts)
Litttlepinkegg Wed 20-Mar-19 06:32:21

Dd in year one at school 1
she’s had been doing ok, she is friendly with lots of people, school has good reputation.
But class sizes are very big (32 in dd’s Case) and very uneven she is one of 10 girls. Despite ofsted outstanding school is not doing great , results declining. Dd complains that it’s noisy in class and hard to concentrate.
The boys are all quite lively and some strong characters. My dd has had issues with a couple of the boys. This week it’s esculated and in the last 3 days one boy has hurt her over 8 times, grabbing her, trying to punch her face, pinning her down.
She was hysterical when I picked her up from after school club.
Each occasion I’ve had to contact teacher. Yesterday when I called she said she flagged up to head but had forgot to call me.
Dd says she likes it but can be very upset by the time I’m picking her up wanting change class, leave school.
I feel like she’s got a bad year where the teachers are struggling to have any control. Dh thinks this with always be the case as it was the same last year and obviously this is her year until she goes secondary.
Do I bite the bullet now?
I’ve have 2 schools to visit that have said they could fit her in

Happygolucky009 Wed 20-Mar-19 07:44:38

Please move her, dc class was 32 mostly boys. Change of leadership after y1. We stayed as we really liked the secondary school it linked to.

But we didn't know how bad it was as eldest normalised it and learnt to adapt, bits came out more than 2 years later by whuch time 2nd child was settled in the school. The head has been largely ineffective, the staff turnover has been high, Ofsted rating was outstanding now requires improvement, the school have rejected the findings of the poor Ofsted report (I think Ofsted were very insightful!). Behavior is now on the floor, but most of the boys have now left, class size is 22 but this includes 2 sen and 2 with significant behavioral issues when together and now to add insult to injury we are unlikely to get a school place in the secondary, based upon this years allocations.

If you are having doubts follow your gut instinct!

MrsKCastle Wed 20-Mar-19 07:46:56

I'm curious as to why both classes in the year group are over the official infant class size. KS1 classes should be capped at 30, and while there are some circumstances where exceptions can be made, there are strict rules. It seems strange for a ks1 year group to have 4 children for whom exceptions are made. Particularly if, as you say, there are other schools in the area with spaces. Have the classes been the same size since the start of reception?

Boysey45 Wed 20-Mar-19 07:47:23

I'd move her ASAP, you cant be having her getting hurt, hows she going to learn anything?.
When I'd moved her I'd write to the initial school and say how concerned I was as well. Something needs doing, for all the others as well.

HexagonalBattenburg Wed 20-Mar-19 07:52:43

Wouldn't worry too much about results dropping - the junior school my kids' (infant) school feeds into has had a real drop in reading scores this last year - they're a cohort that have been challenging to get progress made since they arrived in nursery so while the resident league table watchers (egged on by the rival school who poaches pupils at any chance possible) have been freaking out - I've got faith in the governance and head there that it is just a very blip year.

I would consider moving her for the behaviour angle - if it's a difficult year group (and you do get some year groups where just the combination of personalities, planetary alignment and everything seem to coincide to make what would just normally be a few lively characters into an absolutely tricky as hell bunch to control) it's going to remain so for the entire time they're together - the boy-heavy part wouldn't worry me (one of my girls is in a very boy heavy class which works to our favour as they're less likely to be drawn into her nonsense when she starts acting up and will just tell her to quit it!), but the way they're interacting in combination together would do.

I moved mine at the end of their reception year - agonised over it as it was going to mean two moves during primary school (because we moved to an infant school) but to be honest, when I went to look around this school that happened to have spaces - I came out and cried because I just saw my kids fitting in there perfectly - and it was definitely the right decision for us... so much so that I later became a governor there. School is heading very rapidly toward an Outstanding rating (Ofsted are due back to reinspect to see if it gets it this year) - despite me paying fuck all attention to inspection reports when I did the school move.

Pallandro - Ofsted won't touch a complaint unless it's been through the school complaints process. I looked into it extensively when we moved (didn't dare rock the boat while we were there too much to be honest) and then we were in the situation where, as we were no longer a family at the school, and the school was an academy - they just bloody well ignored it anyway in the end (but the Head has been manoeuvred out anyway thankfully)

applesandpears33 Wed 20-Mar-19 07:54:15

If you are thinking of moving your daughter, then some other parents are probably thinking the same thing too. It is likely that as time goes on more and more girls will be withdrawn from that year group. I'd move your daughter now before the year group becomes even more boy heavy.

Litttlepinkegg Wed 20-Mar-19 07:58:56

The queen bee syndrome seems to already be starting although dd seems unaware other mums have been upset by things. A couple got in on appeal the prior to reception starting and another boy joined before Xmas not sure what the story is there.

hoodiemum Wed 20-Mar-19 08:04:27

I'd think about moving her if other options seem good. Boy-heavy classes are tricky - often get worse as time goes on. Kids leave, new ones come, but the school has to allocate places according to strict criteria so can't attempt to even up the gender balance.

Kungfupanda67 Wed 20-Mar-19 08:06:38

My son’s in a yr q1 class like this, they seem to have put all of the loud, difficult, boisterous boys (my son being one of them) in the head of year’s class, along with a load of quiet, well behaved kids. I often wonder how much the well behaved kids are missing out on while they’re being over shadowed by all the loud boys

Pallando Wed 20-Mar-19 08:10:07

HB - Ofsted may well not do anything about a specific single concern raised, but if it's part of a pattern, or us viewed alongside falling results they may decide that they need to come in for an inspection. In any case, a child being attacked 8 times, being pinned down etc is pretty serious, and if the OP doesn't feel she can raise the issue with the governors she can raise an anonymous concern with Ofsted (which will at least be recorded).

averythinline Wed 20-Mar-19 08:12:52

you seem concerned about the 'excellent' past results of the school....they are irrelevant if it isn't working for your daughter....
and not that meaningful anyway...

go and look at the other schools - during a working day - more than once if they'll let you.....and see if you can see your daughter there...
small classes are not the be all of everything - and financially can mean less resources...

check if there is any effect on secondary if they run feeder school system in your area ...and you're planning to stay in teh area (although admissions systems can change)

she has a long time to go in primary - If you like the other schools move her...

ATrainSeat Wed 20-Mar-19 08:17:47

I taught a class like this. Absolutely move her. Although behaviour management was less of an issue, a small group were consistently disruptive and managing this took up a lot of my time. If there’s no head to back the teacher up, it will be even worse. Some of the kids is that class barely got a look in and I just felt awful about it but there was nothing I could do. I remember thinking if I ever have a child in a class like this, I’d move them. The class dynamics have such a huge impact.

LittleCandle Wed 20-Mar-19 08:45:56

Definitely move! I moved DD2 from our local school at the end of primary 5 (Scotland) because the school were doing nothing to help her with dyslexia and she was being stuck for another year with the shit job share teacher who was poor at the job but was too young to retire and they couldn't sack her. I moved DD2 to the local Catholic school and just didn't bother telling the other school she wasn't going back. That was a courtesy they didn't deserve and it was all the same local authority, so it didn't matter.

It was the making of DD2. She went from a class of 33 (it was a huge year, so 2 classes of 33) into a mixed P6/7 of 22. The whole ethos of the school was different and she was getting help with her dyslexia on the first day.

Later, after moving house when she was in secondary school, I moved her from the crap local school to one just a 20 minute train ride away for her Highers. So well worth it both times.

Litttlepinkegg Wed 20-Mar-19 18:35:25

Thank you all had to see the deputy head as boy hurt dd with a pen today in front of teacher which they put him in isolation for but he’s back tomo in class as normal 🤔

stopfuckingshoutingatme Wed 20-Mar-19 19:10:05

Visit the others and see how they feel
Those boisterous kids are going to get worse . Not better

tor8181 Wed 20-Mar-19 19:22:12

big class sizes failed mine at age 6,hes a end of july baby so youngest of the class,reception and y1(didnt do y1 as repeated reception) was ok but in y2 they put him straight in to a y2 class and not y1 they then put y2/y3 together and there was 45 kids in a class,as he had disabilities and couldnt read or write he was swallowed up and just left to play all day,he was non verbal at the time and i only found out in christmas term when he started speaking

as we are a small village in the welsh valleys there was no where else to go(next village ages away)so we home educate now

Litttlepinkegg Thu 21-Mar-19 07:07:42

I did raise the issue of unbalanced year and disruptive kids which went down like a lead balloon deputy head actually said kids will be excitible it’s in their nature when I said the teachers seemed more like referees. The only solution would be to put up and shut up or move schools.
Waiting on our preferred option calling us today to see my up viewing and the council are calling me back about another 3 schools I’m checking if they have space in year 1 group.

zingally Thu 21-Mar-19 07:46:09

Speaking as an infant school teacher myself... That class size is illegal. The limit is 30 for KS1 and Reception. The only exception would be for a child in the care system who has been placed in the area. They HAVE to be admitted, regardless of class size.

It MIGHT be worth looking around, with a view to moving your daughter. However, I would quietly discuss this with school first. It may be that they hadn't realised how often your child is getting bothered. Just bare in mind however, that another school might not necessarily be any better in that regard.

If you do decide to move her, Yr1 is a good time to do it. She's still little, friendship groups are still very fluid, and she'll quickly make friends else where. You just need to make the move decisively and quickly. Don't leave it up to her. Tell her you're moving her, and do it. She's far too little for the pressure of an "it's up to you... Do you want to move schools?" talk. And don't mention the fact that the move is down to the problems in her class, otherwise all she'll get is the message that "mummy will always sort out all my problems with other people", which, even though she's still little, isn't really a message that will do her any good in the long term.

crimsonlake Thu 21-Mar-19 07:46:26

This is a bit like moving house, you never know what your neighbours are going to be like. You can move schools and could encounter the same problems, class size may grow and it can only take 1 child to ruin a lovely class. That child may already be there or may arrive after your daughter. I work as a supply teacher and have seen it all. If the teacher is dealing with behaviour issues all day that really eats in to teaching and learning time and your child is really missing out. I had to be very strict with a class yesterday, every sentence I spoke at least 5 children were attempting to interrupt me. The class teacher was giving out marbles to each child every time she was not interrupted as a reward. I could not teach them anything if I spent my time doing that, children should not be rewarded for actually following the class rules, it is getting ridiculous.

Litttlepinkegg Sat 23-Mar-19 19:46:14

Thank you all I’m looking around a school on Monday.
Dd is adamant she will not be changing school I’ve glossed over it with her but she’s caught the tail end of a couple of conversations so she knows it could possibly happen.
If this school on Monday turns out to be a better option I have a friend with dd in the same year group who has offered to host a party for dd to meet her new class mates in advance so I’m hoping that reassures dd if it does look like it’s the best option.
We also have parents evening on Monday night so it will be an interesting day.

Litttlepinkegg Sat 23-Mar-19 19:46:43

Informative day rather

Isleepinahedgefund Sat 23-Mar-19 20:03:14

The issue here is not the other children but the lack of management of behaviour in the classroom. The deputy head’s reaction would sway me towards moving schools.

Of course you won’t know what the new school is really like until you get there.

Funny, the yr 1 in my school is very boy heavy too, 120 intake and still 10 girls to 20 boys in each class. They can’t help who comes through the door of cours, but they can manage things appropriately. They changed the classes around when current yr 1 moved up from reception, in part because of special needs INA provision requirements but also took the opportunity to move some of the kids away from each other where it was clear there was an issue. First time they’ve ever done it and It’s worked really well, definitely less problems all round now.

FizzyGreenWater Sat 23-Mar-19 20:07:38

Move her!!!

She's hardly started in year 1, it just isn't worth sticking it out for the sake of existing friendships - they are just not a consideration at that age. It doesn't sound like a good year group however and that DOES matter - I've definitely noticed that different year groups have a 'vibe' which as often as not does carry through. My childrens' year groups are all very different and always have been.

RavenousBabyButterfly Sat 23-Mar-19 20:26:58

Move her. Some year groups can be a nightmare while others in the same school are ok. It doesn't sound like the school is handling the behaviour well either. If they haven't got a grip on it in Y1 heaven help them by the time they hit Y4 and start developing an attitude!

SofaSurfer20 Sat 23-Mar-19 20:31:59

Go in and lose your shit. My DD is in yr1 and something happened with one of the boys in the year above, little twat, and I kicked off at school. It's sorted now and DD is back to loving school

ballsdeep Sat 23-Mar-19 20:59:37

32 - 35 to a class is the norm here with Jo additional support.
My son was in a class with 22 rowdy, boisterous boys and it was hell. The majority were disruptive and fed off each other. If I could I'd move your child because through primary it never ever got better. In fact as they got older the worse they became

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