to not permit this grandparent relationship?

[emilyk1991]

My DH and I have been married for nearly 4 years and started trying for a baby at the start of the year. We were extremely lucky and I'm due in September with twins!!

I'm an only child, both my parents are deceased. My DH is from a large family who live inthe south east, but he's always been a bit of a black sheep, in his words "not like the rest of my family", I've only met an uncle, aunt, his mum a few times plus been to a couple of family events in the last 4 years; we got married abroad so it was a tiny wedding of less than 10 close friends mostly. We don't live close enough to visit regularly (Manchester).

Here's the problem - his mum has had severe, sometimes-treated mental health issues for many years. She's not medicated currently AFAIK. She seems to be in spirals of getting sectioned, getting well enough to get discharged into "community housing", then getting into escalating trouble. We get calls, updates from his brother as her next of kin - sometimes she's threatened to kill her social workers, the next month it'll be that she's been arrested for being aggressive outside of a school to children, then she'll go back on her meds.. then get a police visit for sending hate mail to a neighbour who has left their bin out on the pavement for too long... some other stuff about harassing another neighbour came out (watching and making logs of when they arrive home/go out/aggressively blocking their visitors).. she's been cautioned for racial slurs against strangers and neighbours before, screaming in the middle of the street about them being terrorists, it's all so messy! She's also on some sort of watchlist at the local A&E because she turns up with minor complaints and abuses staff, one time she followed a nurse back to her car, and the police were called. Occasionally she gets given notice and has to move into alternative accommodation because neighbour complaints have been upheld - she normally lasts no longer than 18 months at one address, even when it's secure warden accommodation designed for mentally ill people. Bailiffs regularly appear to take goods that she's bought on credit and then stopped paying for. His dad is still around but they're separated, and doesn't really get involved with DH's mum aside from sometimes helping when she's been arrested/sectioned (e.g. feeding her pets, but that's about it).

My DH used to get involved in his mum's care, taking time off work to visit and help out, mediate with her carers, but it was taking a massive toll on his own mental wellbeing/finances (we can't afford for him to take emergency days off work to travel down, buy last minute train tickets etc). so about a year ago he stopped and pretty much withdrew from being involved with his mum at all.

My DH and I have had a long discussion about how to deal with our happy news and his family. We don't know if his mum will pull something odd like appearing at the hospital if she knows I'm in labour (I told him we don't have to tell his parents when it happens, we can tell them once we're out, don't worry). We don't know how to handle if she appears at our home - she's never visited.

My DH is now saying that he doesn't want our future DCs to have ANY relationship with his mum, in his words: "I don't want our children exposed to her influence, she's toxic". i'm mourning for my child having a healthy, beneficial grandparent relationship - there's going to be no one!

I've suggested we could agree to supervised, short (1hr) visits in a neutral location if we visit Brighton/his family in future, but he's saying he would prefer no contact. If his mum ever shows up where our DCs are, then to tell her directly that he doesn't think it's safe for them to be exposed to her, and ask her to leave.

AIBU to wonder what the right step here is? I'll support my DH 100% if this is his final decision but are we going to regret this? Is a broken grandparent relationship (closely supervised/monitored) better than nothing?

Sorry for this being so long

[Skincaresos]

I agree with your DH sadly. Much as you would love a stable, loving GP relationship, his mother is not going to be able to provide this. And I agree about not exposing them to a confusing and upsetting relationship

[Stargazer888]

Who takes care of his mum? And why can't your children have a relationship with his dad instead? Are their other grandchildren? How do his brothers and sisters manage the relationship?

[BeGoodTanya]

I don't know why you're so keen to explore a relationship it sounds as if you're all far better away from...?

[Thingsdogetbetter]

Support your dh! He's put up with a childhood of shite and does not want it for his dc.

Your desire to have a mythical child grandparents relationship does not trump his desire to protect his child and himself.

The only way your child will miss a relationship with a grandparent is if you make an issue of it.

A grandparent appearing and disappearing would be extremely confusing for a child.

[FuckertyBoo]

Ah that’s so sad. But, I think your Dh is right. And who would know better than her own child what she might be like with her grandchildren? I feel dreadfully sorry for her, as her life sounds impossibly sad and chaotic. But, there are two little babies to be considered here and there is not a snowball’s chance in hell I would want my children having a relationship with her at the moment, or in the foreseeable.

[FuckertyBoo]

PS: my mum is dead, my dad is overseas and we rarely see my in-laws. It’s not how I envisaged parenthood either; I always imagined my own parents would be actively involved and that I’d have wonderful, warm in-laws who would also be a big part of my dcs’ life. That hasn’t been the case for us and it is a little sad, but also not the end of the world at all. In some ways, not having an interfering MIL living next door, a la everybody loves Raymond, suits me very well.

[mindutopia]

Your dh has to make the final call on this. He knows how toxic this has been for him as a child and it sounds like he is looking to protect your children from going through this. I think the only time it would be appropriate for you to overrule would be if he was the more permissive one and you had concerns about your children's safety. Basically, whoever feels the need to be the most cautious of the two of you should be respected.

Slightly different situation, but my dh and I chose for our children to have no contact with MIL (FIL has passed away) due to safety issues for a number of years. My dh was the one who actually had second thoughts about it and felt very guilty as he felt very sorry for his mum. The decision was made based on concerns about his MIL's partner who has a history of child sexual offenses (he is also abusive to MIL, which is why it's such a sad situation). I was the one who said absolutely no way, we must have NC. My dh supported me, even though he was sad about it.

It was absolutely the right decision and I don't think either of us have any regrets. In the end, the situation with MIL's partner has been dealt with, so we have been able to resume limited supervised contact. That has also been the right decision. Though it's unlikely, you never know if the situation will improve in the future if your MIL gets proper treatment and becomes stable. It could happen and you can have a discussion about building a relationship then. But no relationship is always better than a toxic one that will damage your children. I would trust your dh's judgement here.

[Crunchycrunchycrunchy]

I think your DH is right on this one.

i'm mourning for my child having a healthy, beneficial grandparent relationship - there's going to be no one!

I understand why you're feeling sad about this, but it doesn't sound like this relationship would be healthy or beneficial.

[MintyCedric]

I think you need to respect your DHs wishes tbh.

Both my parents lost their dad's as children and my nan's both died by the time I was 7 (and were quite elderly and not local). You babies won't miss what they haven't had and much better than the potential negative impact your MIL could have.

[Aquamarine1029]

Listen to your husband! He knows through bitter experience the best course of action.

[VioletJune90]

I think a grandparent relationship is lovely, but it is not a necessity. A child won't suffer without a grandparent. It seems like it would be better for your children to have no grandparent than it would to have this woman. I agree that you could let them see his dad if you're worried about it. There's no point letting (encouraging?) them to form a close relationship and get emotionally attached to someone so volatile, who could leave their life or turn on them (and you all) at any moment

[emilyk1991]

Who takes care of his mum? And why can't your children have a relationship with his dad instead? Are their other grandchildren? How do his brothers and sisters manage the relationship?

No one really has taken on the role of caring for his mum now that DH stopped travelling down when it was needed, about a year ago. It used to be DH was named as next of kin, attending meetings with her social worker( well... workers, she gets discharged then a new named social worker gets in contact after a few months normally when it's spiraled out of control again). He would come home from the south after 2-3 days extremely distressed and unable to really do anything - the mental health support she's been given over the years has been irregular, the diagnosis was a mix of personality disorders, and she hasn't been stable at taking her meds long enough to actually get it under control.
His brother is now nextof kin but works fulltime and does not get involved in person, despite living close by, he does the minimum like drop by a change of clothes when she's sectioned, but does not take on the care role that DH was fulfilling.

DH's dad keeps himself to himself - he feeds her pets but they've been separated (not legally divorced) for years, so lives his own life. he doesn't drive, neither do we, and he was in the military for years so DH has never been close to him at all - he describes him as an "absent dad".

There are other grandchildren, 4 of them in total (all young/primary age children) - another brother's children and DH's sister's two kids. They each say it's not ideal when I asked DH why they allow it and he won't... but they definitely allow DH's mum to visit, have unsupervised access, babysit - even after the nurse stalking incident where his mum isn't meant to turn up without warning to A&E - so if there was an accident whilst she babysits, i'm not sure what would happen if she turned up at A&E now?

[KrazyKatlady]

I have no memories of any of my grandparents as they all died either before i was born, or when i was a baby. My parents had some older friends who were i guess sort of grandparent figures although they had their own grandchildren. As i child i never gave it much thought - you dont really miss what you never had.

[Crunchycrunchycrunchy]

They each say it's not ideal when I asked DH why they allow it and he won't... but they definitely allow DH's mum to visit, have unsupervised access, babysit

If they are comfortable leaving them unsupervised in the care of your MIL then that is their decision, albeit a questionable one, but this is yours and your DHs child. Your DH knows his Mum and knew what it was like to grow up around her. You don't have to follow the lead of anyone else, or even take what they are doing in to account.

[Lastdaysof2018]

I think your husband is right. He must have been on the receiving end of years of turmoil. I think it’s admirable that he has chosen to break the cycle for his/your children. Congratulations!

[Margot33]

Your husband really knows best in this situation. I feel sorry for him, he has had a miserable childhood. I wouldn't pursue any relationship with his mother. Otherwise you and your childrenare going to get sucked into a whirlwind of toxic energy.

[GreatDuckCookery6211]

OP you’re going to have enough on your plate without the added stress of coping with your MIL. Listen to your DH.

[diddl]

" Is a broken grandparent relationship (closely supervised/monitored) better than nothing?"

I wouldn't have thought so.

Seems sad that there's no relationship with your husband & his dad though.

[AlunWynsKnee]

Your DH is the expert on how it feels to be a child in the presence of this woman. Give him the credit for wanting to protect his dc and back him 100%.
You can be sad your dc won't have a lovely grandparent relationship but she can't do it. She sounds far too unwell.

[bloodywhitecat]

Please listen to your DH. I grew up with a similar mother and it took me years to be strong enough to protect myself from her so I think it is admirable that he has called time on the relationship. There is no lovely grandparent relationship to be had with her while she continues in this spiral.

[RosieposiePuddingandPi]

Unfortunately I very much agree with your DH and would support him in his decision.
My MIL has some reasonably complex MH issues that lead to her abusing neighbours, stalking people and generally being quite abusive and she kicked DH out not long after we started dating (he was about 23 and at uni). He tried quite hard to be part of her life and was constantly rejected, as she had done for his entire childhood and now she has gone NC with him.
We decided from early on that we wouldn't be attempting to give our DC a relationship with her and DH was very clear on that, even though it means not having a relationship with his dad either who is a lovely man but has chosen to support his wife.
It's sad and not how I thought my children's family relationships would be but we don't need her influence in their lives.

[sleepyhead]

You need to leave it up to your dh.

Your children won't care. It's not a relationship that people miss if they don't have it ime.

[TougheningUp]

Listen to your DH. He knows what she's like, he knows what it's like to live with her dysfunctions. Better no relationship with her at all than a damaging, frightening one.

If you worry that your children will need grandparents, there are plenty of lovely older people around who might appreciate regular visits and contact. But if you bring your children up surrounded by love and friendship and kindness and compassion, that will be enough.

[CielBleuEtNuages]

Reading the start of your OP I thought it'd be your DH pushing for contact and you not wanting to. If your DH doesn't want his DC around his mum, I'd be listening to him.

I had no grandparents and I didn't miss it at all.

[SuziQ10]

I don't think it would be a good idea to expose your DC to this situation until they are of an age where they are able to process it.

This is probably a very Victorian mindset, but there is a close relative in my family with severe mental health issues who has been in a care facility for many, many years as they pose a danger to themselves and potentially others. I hated thinking of this person as a child, I was very scared even though the family (my parents in particular) were caring and understanding of it. And were open about it. In my teens I was so afraid I was going to get this illness too. I almost waited for it, thinking it would be only a matter of time.
Really, I could have done it without knowing about it. It caused me a lot of pain. It was nice for the relative that the family were still in contact and supportive, but it was detrimental to my own wellbeing and I'd never ever inform my child of this relative or their condition. It's too much to process for a youngster and severe mental health is scary.