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To think this is a bonkers opinion about childbirth

(344 Posts)
Reallyreallyreally1 Tue 12-Feb-19 08:05:44

So I had a baby boy 5 months ago and recently met up with some friends whose children are older. Haven’t seen them since the baby.

I generally don’t talk about the birth because no one really wants to know about someone else’s experience, but they did ask so I briefly told them (induction, back to back labour til fully dilated, pushing with episiotomy and forceps, emcs)

One of them said ‘so you’ve come away from that thinking that you know what it’s like to have a baby’. Wtf does that even mean? I said ‘I don’t get what you mean by that!’

She said ‘you’ve not given birth properly, you’ve not been in transition, you’ve only done the easy bit. So many women think they’ve given birth but they have no idea’.

I wasn’t sure what to say so we just changed the subject but it’s left a nasty taste in my mouth. Maybe she’s right and I’ve only had the easy bit (in which case I would hate to see the next bit!!) but surely no one really thinks like this about labour?
My other friend didn’t agree but didn’t necessarily disagree; she said that a section is the easy option but if your body can’t give birth properly then it’s not your fault grin

I’m not sure why I’m posting except to say- Aibu that this is not how normal people view childbirth?

Tobebythesea Tue 12-Feb-19 08:09:16

That person is not a friend. What a horrible thing to say.

Kitsandkids Tue 12-Feb-19 08:12:15

She sounds horrid. Of course you’ve given birth - your baby has been born so you must have done!

And it sounds like your birth was much harder than mine, where my baby did come out vaginally.

Ignore her, she’s an idiot.

SoyDora Tue 12-Feb-19 08:12:37

Err... no. They sound ridiculous.
And actually for me, actually pushing the baby out was the easy bit! The hard bit was the hours and hours of contractions leading up to it.

QuintadiMalago Tue 12-Feb-19 08:13:09

Your friend's attitude is disgraceful and shocking. I would definitely distance myself from her. Who the hell does she think she is to be so judgemental.

SoyDora Tue 12-Feb-19 08:13:21

(I also had relatively easy vaginal births so your experience sounds way harder than mine... hope you’re ok).

Pinchycrab Tue 12-Feb-19 08:14:14

Wow. She has issues.
Rude and horrible thing to say. I've had a natural birth and an elcs. Both were 'giving birth' ffs.

Chocwocdoodah Tue 12-Feb-19 08:15:10

Back to back labour, forceps etc does not sound like “the easy bit”!

How nasty of your friend to say that. This kind of birthing one-upmanship is pathetic. Ignore her. We have very little real control over how labour pans out. I’m guessing your friend had a drug free, natural labour and thinks she deserves a fucking medal for it. Good for her but this doesn’t make her experience any more real or valid than yours.

Toupholsterornot Tue 12-Feb-19 08:15:12

Yanbu. A c section is my worst night mare and I can imagine being a worse and harder experience and I admire all those who have one. I had 4 natural and ofcourse it's hard. It's hard in general bit I could walk about fine after. Not so much with a c section. Your friend is a dick

scaredofthecity Tue 12-Feb-19 08:15:38

Another who says pushing the baby out is the easy bit!

flowers it sounds like you had a rough time. Take no notice. Forceps and CS is about as hard as it gets.

NoArmaniNoPunani Tue 12-Feb-19 08:15:39

I didn't even get to go into labour. I developed HELLP syndrome, induction failed, straight to section. Your friend is a bellend.

DontBuyANewMumCashmere Tue 12-Feb-19 08:16:26

I had an extremely straight forward vaginal birth and I think your 'friend' is a mean bitch. You don't win a fucking award for pushing your baby out your fanny.

Actually the other friend is a bit mean too. Having a CS is not 'easier' as I could pick up my child, drive myself around etc straight away so I'd say you had by far the most traumatic birth and should be appluauded/supported, not criticised for not knowing what transition feels like. Ffs...

NotANotMan Tue 12-Feb-19 08:16:53

Your labour and birth sounds like it was incredibly hard work and tbh much harder than mine, which was a spontaneous vaginal delivery! I'm sorry your 'friend' is such a cow

RNBrie Tue 12-Feb-19 08:17:27

Honestly just ignore. She sounds deranged.

Maybe she had a terrible time, maybe she's just a massive bitch but it's not a normal response at all.

I don't think a c-section is an "easy" option at all. They bring with them all sorts of difficulties and complications, not least of which are judgemental bitches.

SockQueen Tue 12-Feb-19 08:18:06

Surely if you were fully dilated and pushing, you DID go through transition? And nobody sane thinks having your abdomen sliced open is the "easy" option, much less after hours of labour and a failed forceps attempt. Your "friends" are both stupid and unpleasant.

DrDiva Tue 12-Feb-19 08:18:56

I had same experience as noarmani. And yes, I have had the comments that I don’t know what birth really is. I also agree that your friend is no friend and is a complete shit. What is it with competitive birthing?

Jeezoh Tue 12-Feb-19 08:18:59

What a cow, no part of giving birth is easy and yours sound like it was less than serene! Plus it’s not a competition and believe me, you don’t get a prize just because your baby comes out the south entrance grin

misskatamari Tue 12-Feb-19 08:19:22

What a knob! I don't think I'd be bothering to see her again, what a horrible unnecessary thing to say

MarthasGinYard Tue 12-Feb-19 08:21:37

She sounds like a complete nausebox TBH.

I wouldn't even give her the satisfaction of thinking she'd annoyed me.

Reallyreallyreally1 Tue 12-Feb-19 08:22:24

I don’t want to make a big deal of my labour experience because although I did find it truly hideous I know many many women sadly have a tricky time of it. I mean even if it goes to plan it bloody hurts!

I don’t even know what transition is grin but I think this situation has made me see that these people are not really friends. I had quite a bad recovery and was back in hospital afterwards and had no word from them so it’s frankly bizarre to try and kick a friend about their labour.

It could well be that she’s got bad memories of her births and maybe it validated her to make hers seem more genuine and mine to be ‘not real’

GruciusMalfoy Tue 12-Feb-19 08:23:20

Your friend is incredibly rude, and stupid. If you got to the part where you needed forceps, then you had gone through transition. Even if you hadn't, you've still given birth FGS!

My labour sounds similar to yours, and I think it was sheer poor timing (doctors were all in surgery) that I avoided forceps, it was very close. I wouldn't wish an induced B2B labour on anyone.

PolarBearDisguisedAsAPenguin Tue 12-Feb-19 08:23:45

They both sound delightful! For some reason some women think pregnancy, labour and parenting is a competition. I find those women the best ones to avoid!

TORDEVAN Tue 12-Feb-19 08:23:51

Sounds like you did go through most of both ways! And ended up with a recovery of your bits and belly!

I had an emcs after 1 day of 5 contractions every 10 minutes. Following a 3 day attempt at induction. I made it to 2cm dilated. I don't think that was 'easy', I was exhausted.

hammeringinmyhead Tue 12-Feb-19 08:24:08

You did go through transition if you got to pushing, surely? And by that point for me it didn't really hurt any more. It was more like a big poo!

ChariotsofFish Tue 12-Feb-19 08:24:21

She sounds very odd. For starters if you reached the point of forceps, you did go through transition. I’ve had a vaginal birth and a caesarean and I’d choose the vaginal birth any day, caesareans are not the easy option.

Drogosnextwife Tue 12-Feb-19 08:25:06

I had 2 relatively easy vaginal births and your experience was obviously much .ore difficult than mine. She's a twat.

MeetJoeTurquoise Tue 12-Feb-19 08:25:22

It doesn't matter whether you pushed baby out or it was taken out by a surgeon, you gave birth.
And I defy anyone who's had a back to back labour to say it wasn't the worst pain in the world ever. It... was... grim.

GruciusMalfoy Tue 12-Feb-19 08:26:34

Transition is the part where you are moving from dilating to getting ready for pushing. If I remember right it can last from 8-10cm. It's generally thought the most painful part.

juneybean Tue 12-Feb-19 08:27:20

Gosh I haven't been through birth but I'm terrified of forceps! I think your friend is an idiot. Of course you've been through birth! It's not a competition!

BlindAssassin1 Tue 12-Feb-19 08:27:29

Why is the transition bit considered the apex? confused and what is this 'giving birth properly' business. Which ever way you do it, its all pretty rough.

Sounds like she has massive isssshhhhues. And the other one is a bit dim perhaps?

HeyDuggeesCakeBadge Tue 12-Feb-19 08:27:35

OP I've had similar comments as I had a CS (opted due to medical reasons) and the amount of times I've heard 'oooh but you've not really given birth' - well I had a fucking baby cut out of me so yeah, I've given birth.

Ignore. No one cares how they get here just that they get here safely.

Thisismyusernamefornow Tue 12-Feb-19 08:29:43

I think you "friend" has a few issues of her own.

Of course you gave birth. You have a baby to prove it.

Very strange.

Transpeaked Tue 12-Feb-19 08:30:06

What a lovely friend you have hmm

Ignore - she clearly has some sort of issue that’s not yours to worry about. If it helps in my experience pushing the baby out is the easiest part and your birth sounds a lot harder than mine we’re.

MysweetAudrina Tue 12-Feb-19 08:30:14

God I always feel the most sorry for women who go through labour and then have to get an emcs. It's like having the worst of both worlds. All that labour and a section. I was induced on my last 2 pregnancies and it was intense. So to be induced, go through labour and then have to have a section is traumatic. I can't imagine being envious or smug about someone elses birth experiences and if someone said something like that in my company I would be quick to put them in their place.

Butteredghost Tue 12-Feb-19 08:30:19

Yikes what a stupid thing to say!

And not that I want to waste time dissecting your friends stupid opinion, but transition is when you go from the first stage (dilating) to the second stage (pushing). You were in the pushing stage therefore you did experience transition!

In fact you experienced all forms of childbirth in one day - natural, instrumental and cs! If your friend only experienced one of these, surely she's the one that got off easy.

FindPrimeLorca Tue 12-Feb-19 08:30:42

I’ve had one EMCS and one forceps delivery and I do occasionally say that I haven’t “given birth” in the sense of pushing a baby out of my body - I’ve had babies removed from my body by obstetricians because my body sucks at that lay bit. But that’s my choice to describe it so and I certainly wouldn’t say I’d had the easy option, or make those comments to someone else who’d had those experiences. Your acquaintance sounds like a total bitch. If she’s otherwise lovely then perhaps I’d give her the benefit of suspecting PTSD, but my guess is she’s just vile.

CoraCoo Tue 12-Feb-19 08:32:01

It's a stupid thing to say because every mother is different and birth is different even to the same mother, so they really can't be compared, especially not on 'merit'.

I've given birth twice, the first was like yours and the second progressed more naturally. The first was EASILY the most traumatic and uncomfortable for me. So I rate what you've done!

MadameJosephine Tue 12-Feb-19 08:33:44

Your ‘friend’ is a nasty piece of work. After what you went through to give birth to your baby you deserve a bloody medal!

TestingTestingWonTooFree Tue 12-Feb-19 08:34:25

I didn't even get to go into labour. I developed HELLP syndrome, induction failed, straight to section. Your friend is a bellend.

This. I had a c section under GA because of HELLP syndrome and liked it so much I had planned sections for 2 and 3. God knows what your judgemental bitch frenemy would think of me. Thankfully I have no fucks to give.

Birth, however it happens, Is a means to an end. To be so hung up on the details of someone else’s process suggests a pretty empty life.

I think I’d message her and say something like “I’ve been thinking about what you said about my birth last time we met. I found what you said rude and hurtful. I don’t know what you were trying to gain by diminishing my experience”. Unless you had a fulsome apology I’d steer clear of her.

winsinbin Tue 12-Feb-19 08:35:05

She’s a silly cow.

For what it’s worth my first birth was also a nightmare and I hated every moment but my second (home) birth was amazing.

Seline Tue 12-Feb-19 08:36:04

I've only done the easy bit too. Never even pushed. I did have a huge hemmhorage that nearly killed me and a placental abruption that nearly killed my twins but yeah I never pushed a baby out my vag so it was easy!

Transpeaked Tue 12-Feb-19 08:36:26

Also, re: transition

You fully dilated and started pushing - transition is the time between the end of the second stage and the beginning of the third stage (pushing) as far as I remember. You went through ‘transition’ - though I can’t makr head nor tail of what her actual point is.

Angelicinnocent Tue 12-Feb-19 08:36:33

I had 39 hours of established labour followed by a terrible tear and a lot of stitches. Still think I had it easier than you. Ignore and enjoy your baby op.

VioletWillow Tue 12-Feb-19 08:36:55

That's a horrible friend right there. My first was a straightforward labour, easy as (apart from it being labour so hard work), second was exactly like yours, back to back labour (sheesh I wouldn't wish that on Trump), ended up having forceps- not easy at all- third was a section. The second and third, yeah they were worse by far than my first birth. The last stage is I think the easiest, although none of it is easy. In any case. However you give birth, it's difficult and you all came through safely and that is awesome. Your friends need to give their heads a wobble.

AmIRightOrAMeringue Tue 12-Feb-19 08:37:25

WTF. WTAF . What à complete bitch . Apart from being wrong (nothing in your birth sounds easy, to me it sounded like you got the worst of both worlds as in knackered and cut from vaginal and recovery from section when you're starting out knackered). Even if that's what she believes it's just mean to say it - she is either trying to make you feel worse about your birth which is downright nasty, or make herself feel better about her own in a really horrible way. I can't believe anyone still thinks even a planned c section is easy, trying to recover from a major op while looking after a new born, often with high blood loss and complications.

I think I'd have to say something to correct them OP. Not because I'm confrontational (I'm not) but because she is factually wrong, is sections were the easy section doctors would push them for eeveryone. And if she said it to the wrong person then it could trigger or worsen someone's pnd. She needs to know how it feels to be on the receiving end of comments like that. If I left it I'd just be seething every time I spoke to her.

I don't think it matters if you lose her as a friend tbh she sounds like she will be a nightmare comparing your babies and anyone that bottle feeds / purees / doesn't Co sleep etc won't be doing it 'properly'

origamiunicorn Tue 12-Feb-19 08:37:41

Sorry your friend isn't a friend, I wouldn't want a friend like that. "So you’ve come away from that thinking that you know what it’s like to have a baby" shock What a nasty weird comment. Why is she so concerned about other people's birth experiences and whether they fit her notion of a "valid" birth. I don't have children do not idea what "transition is but you've had a baby, you've given birth. What normal person cares how. She seems like a bitch and hard work. She wouldn't be my friend after that comment.

oldmum22 Tue 12-Feb-19 08:37:58

Oh dear , I didn't realise it was a competition ! Ignore this "friend", she has issues and just want s to put you down and big herself up . Complete and utter twaddle !!!!

GummyGoddess Tue 12-Feb-19 08:37:58

Definitely pushing is the easy bit as you can do something with the contractions.

Your friend sounds horrible, ignore but preferably get rid.

PyongyangKipperbang Tue 12-Feb-19 08:38:40

Send her this...

Dictionary result for birth
noun: birth; plural noun: births

the emergence of a baby or other young from the body of its mother; the start of life as a physically separate being.

And then then this....

Dictionary result for arsehole
nounvulgar slang•British
noun: arsehole; plural noun: arseholes

a person's anus.
a stupid, irritating, or contemptible person.
"he's a total arsehole"

Jackshouse Tue 12-Feb-19 08:40:33

Fuck me. It sounds like you experienced most of the worst possible outcomes of labour. But I would not say to my friend who has an ‘easy, quick’ labour that she did not k ow what it was like to have a baby.

SaturdayNext Tue 12-Feb-19 08:41:00

Your labour sounds very much like one of mine, except that I didn't end up with a section. If anything, the point where I actually gave birth was the "easy bit". If anyone had told me that that was an easy labour at the time, I suspect I might have hit them.

RedForShort Tue 12-Feb-19 08:41:12

Some people love being able to refer to something dramatic they have expedience. She sounds like an insecure woman, who wants to believe she had an incredible difficult experience giving birth. (At a guess because it makes her feel special, gets her attention or get admiration.) Your doing pretty much what she did but having a traumatic intervention at the end is a threat to her being Number One in terrible time. Easier for her to dismiss your experience.

Had the same as you, high forceps and emsc. It's disturbing to both your body and mind!! I've had 'friend' say I didnt have a shocking time as her, and I was lying that a nurse had her arms under my armpit pulling my back up the bed as the doctor pulled at the other end with the forceps. It freaking hurt and I don't think it was easy if memory serves me well. shudders.

MissMalice Tue 12-Feb-19 08:43:57

I find women that hold these views so strange. I’ve had four “normal” births and I’ve always thought that was easier than anything you’ve listed or a c-section (being major abdominal surgery, you know).

Transition is hard but not that hard - I just feel like I’ve had enough want to get up and go home - it’s an irrational thing like I can just decide not to go through with the birth. And it’s also a good sign because it means it’s nearly time to push.

I agree with others - friends don’t say things like that. I’ll bet she’s insecure about her own experience for some reason. It sounds to me like you had the hardest version of a vaginal birth and the hardest version of a c-sec (except perhaps an emergency general anaesthetic).

DorotheaHomeAlone Tue 12-Feb-19 08:44:58

YABU. Did no one tell you childbirth is a competition? Every painful intervention and indignity you go through you also lose points! Fun.

The only way to win is to have a quick, but not too quick, ‘natural’, pain relief free waterbirth. You must produce a perfect, unblemished, correct gender baby and look glowing in the after photos. Anything else and you lose.

Honestly though, I hoped for a natural birth but had to be induced, laboured unsuccessfully for hours and finished with an emcs. By the time they wheeled me into theatre I just felt relief that we would both survive, that the pain was over and that I’d avoided badly damaging my nethers.

I never think about it now apart from when I see smug boasting posts about ‘natural’ births on FB. Then I smile, shrug and think those women don’t appreciate how it’s only luck that made that even possible.

Enjoy your baby. Steer clear of these mean girls in future.

LightDrizzle Tue 12-Feb-19 08:46:30

That was a really horrible thing to say to a woman. It’s also utter bollocks but honestly I think that’s fairly irrelevant. I can’t imagine she’s a nice woman, and her/their lack of interest after the birth just confirm that.

thecatsthecats Tue 12-Feb-19 08:46:38

Ah well, at least you've had it confirmed that they're twats.

I would vomit in my mouth if I had to hang around with such smug-mummy-martyrs. (Ok, I do have a friend like this - who I haven't seen much since she had her first child because this sort of thing is ALL SHE SAYS)

Baby2namehelp Tue 12-Feb-19 08:46:44

Jesus would some people actually prefer women still die in childbirth? I’m glad you and your child are okay OP, next time just say well if it wasn’t a emcs then I would be dead. Stop them in their tracks.

littlepeas Tue 12-Feb-19 08:50:28

Stupid, horrible bitch. Her, not you, obviously. She wouldn't be my friend anymore.

MyBreadIsEggy Tue 12-Feb-19 08:53:22

She’s a weapons grade knob and definitely not a friend. angry

I’m another one who thinks that actually pushing the baby out is the easiest and least painful part of labour - you did the worst bit! The endless hours of contractions that feel like they are ripping your whole body apart confused

Tink88 Tue 12-Feb-19 08:53:46

This must be more common than I thought. My hairdresser asked how everything went I said oh I ended up with an emergency c section. She replied oh so you haven’t given birth then. When I do it I want to make sure it’s properly otherwise you won’t feel close to your baby hmm

Loyaultemelie Tue 12-Feb-19 08:55:40

As someone who has had both an emcs and a vaginal birth she's talking out her arse! I would go to great lengths (and did!) to avoid another section but at the end of the day it's the outcome that is important

Myimaginarycathasfleas Tue 12-Feb-19 08:57:54

Cannot bear oneupmanship amongst mothers. Sadly, you'll come across it a lot. There will be the early walkers/talkers/readers, brightest (and most misunderstood) child in the group/class, etc etc. Some mothers really get off on this stuff. Oh, and I forgot Competitive Breastfeeding!

I had my DC thirty odd years ago and it was the same then.

Ditch this person and find some nicer friends.

Purplecatshopaholic Tue 12-Feb-19 08:58:34

She is not a friend! She is an idiot with issues. Ditch!

Tawdrylocalbrouhaha Tue 12-Feb-19 09:00:02

She's nuts. If they got a baby out of there somehow, then you've had a baby.

I have wondered if this is something people say to console themselves for a banjaxed pelvic floor?

MaggieAndHopey Tue 12-Feb-19 09:00:20

I honestly didn't believe that women like this really exist. The fucking 'easy bit'!!! Back to back, forceps, EMCS? I have been lucky enough to have two relatively straighforward births and from my perspective, the pushing WAS the easy bit. At least I had something to focus on and could get involved, finally, in what was happening to my body.

I would struggle to let this go, if I were you - I would at least want an opportunity to put her straight. Apart from anything else, it takes a real arsehole to be dismissive when someone is talking about their experience of childbirth - a momentous time in any woman's life, whatever happened.

Bigonesmallone3 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:00:27

By the sounds of things uv had a harder birth than standard..

Ignore it!

HicDraconis Tue 12-Feb-19 09:01:39

You have given birth properly otherwise where did the 5 month old come from? You have also been through transition as you were fullly dilated and pushing. The only thing you haven’t experienced is crowning (emergence of head from vagina) but I suspect the pain of forceps followed by surgery more than makes up for that!

Why do people in this day and age think that you have to experience pain and a vaginal delivery to give birth “properly”?! Who are they to decide what’s proper and what isn’t?! Wind the clock back a century and giving birth “properly” meant dying for a lot of women. I’ll take the improper option, thanks.

(1 induction, 1 spontaneous onset. Epidural both times, slept through the contracting/dilating/transition bit and woke up when I felt I needed to push. Easy. Probably not “proper” but who gives a monkeys.)

Roomba Tue 12-Feb-19 09:04:05

Why do people say stupid crap like this?

The easy bit? Ha! I went around for months after my first c section telling anyone who would listen 'Don't believe anyone who tells you a caesarian is the easy, less painful option. Yes, it's less painful than vaginal birth at the moment the baby actually arrives. But christ, it's bloody painful afterwards, for weeks at least. Definitely not the easy option!'. I was traumatised by it, frankly. And I never even went into labour so in theory I had the easiest delivery available.

There's not much you can do though except ignore, laugh and point out why she's wrong and stupid, or break ties with this woman.

Threewheeler1 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:05:32

Congratulations OP on baby. You have successfully brought a life into this world, despite your friend thinking that you conjured up a baby out of thin air grin
That's idiotic, untrue and hurtful of your friend. She sounds like a patronising, self-righteous pita.
You had a similar birth to mine with DS1 by the sounds of it. Too late for the emcs though, despite me begging. But the back to back labour was the most agonising thing I've ever experienced. 27 hours of it before they gave me an epidural.
DS2 I had no pain relief (too late) and it was obviously painful but by far the worst birth was DS1 and that labour. And subsequent recovery took months. I still get back pain now, over 13 years later.
Tell you friend to poke her narrow minded views on childbirth up her bum grin

Crazybunnylady123 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:05:37

As long as you have a healthy baby it doesn’t matter how she came into the world. You did everything, you carried for nine months and you got your baby out safe and sound.
We are lucky to have medical help when we need it.
Ignore you so called friend, enjoy your beautiful baby. You have done well! Have some flowers flowers.

XmasPostmanBos Tue 12-Feb-19 09:06:50

Imagine what her weird opinions on everything else related to parenting will be and find some new mum friends.

databreachname Tue 12-Feb-19 09:07:06

What is it with some women who seem to want to compete for the most pain they were in and insist their birth was harder than anyone's. If this woman was presented with a magic pill that would have magic'd her baby into life with no need to give birth at all, she still probably wouldn't have taken it, just so she could get a badge of honour for being in paaaain. Pathetic!

She is not a friend.

Xiaoxiong Tue 12-Feb-19 09:07:23

Your "friends" are both knobs - either dim and clueless, or actively rude and undermining and mean. Saying your body couldn't give birth "properly"!?? Fuck that!!

Find new friends and ditch the pair of them, this is only the start - next it'll be competitive one-upmanship about feeding bottle or breast, when to start solids, purées or BLW, cosleeping or CIO, hitting milestones, growth/weight, faux concern about what size clothes your baby is in compared to theirs. And then later on, it'll be about childcare, how much their DHs do with the kids, what school their kids are going to, what book band are they on, what times table are they learning now etc etc. It will never end with such a pair of judgemental twats.

ShowOfHands Tue 12-Feb-19 09:09:11

I had a crash cs after 8hrs at fully dilated, failed ventouse, failed manual rotation, cs was done with forceps as dd was stuck and I haemorrhaged, dd was injured.

I have been told by several people that a cs was "the easy option" and I'm not as magnanimous as you because I had PTSD and pnd so I cried, shouted and hated myself for years. My SIL was one of the sneery fuckers who went on to have an emcs with her 7th and then went very quiet on the subject.

It is contemptible to treat women this way

clairestandish Tue 12-Feb-19 09:13:10

She sounds awful.
I hate any kind of comparison and putting one mode of birth as ‘easier’ than the other. Vaginal birth and cesearean birth can be hard/traumatic. They are both ‘giving birth’ though regardless.

Iownmanyleatherboundbooks Tue 12-Feb-19 09:13:32

As others have said you had been through transition, had you not?

I actually think it sounds like you had the worst and hardest of both.

She sounds mental & nasty. I would distance, then drop. other one not much better.

Reallyreallyreally1 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:15:28

Showofhands no wonder you had ptsd. You poor thing! I also had a failed manual rotation but didn’t realise at the time that’s what they were attempting. All such a blur.

I’m disappointed that other cs mums have been told that they don’t really know what birth is like. It’s a different scenario but it is still birth.

Sensitive information below about child loss, scroll past if it’s too upsetting

My cousin lost her dd right after birth but she had laboured a breech baby and delivered her vaginally. She is an absolute hero but she’s had people tell her that she doesn’t really know what having a baby is like because she didn’t have to breastfeed afterwards/have skin to skin/ look after a new baby when tired.
So I should realise really that some people are just absolute dicks.

Threewheeler1 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:16:01

It is contemptible to treat women this way
Well said!

My sister had some horrendous complications with infection after her emcs. It took forever to heal and the whole experience put her off having anymore children.
I can't get my head around your friends OP. Imagine saying that to another woman! Their views are bizarre and completely inaccurate.

Reallyreallyreally1 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:16:11

Also thanks for telling me I have been in transition grin grin now I feel dopey for not knowing what that was!

Elfinablender Tue 12-Feb-19 09:18:25

Actually, I've heard someone say this before - long before I had kids. And I remember thinking it was madness then.

I've had three easy vaginal births. I found the pain intense but that's all it was, pain. It was temporary and I didn't learn anything profound from it.

When people sell pain and suffering as the path to glorified concepts of mothering they are attempting to make you complicit in their own misogyny.

Sleeplikeasloth Tue 12-Feb-19 09:19:13

Urgh, it's not a competition, and if it was, you'd be right up there anyway, as you experienced some of the most difficult bits of birth - and ended up having to recover from both forceps and emcs!!

Am ELCS can be a very low pain option (not 100% pain free but it wasn't far off for me) but recovery for everyone is different and, crucially, its like night and day compared with an emergency section after a long and stressful labour!

Your friends sound awful.

user1471426142 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:23:57

What an idiot. You sound like you had an awful time of it. It’s not a bloody competition and there is no ‘correct’ way to give birth and you certainly did not have an easy option. I’m sure you’d have rather had a lovely quick uncomplicated birth.

Also she’s wrong. If you were fully dilated then you did go though transition (which is going from 7-10cm). Quite frankly having an instrumental and an emergency section is probably about the worse experience you could have recovery wise.

Babdoc Tue 12-Feb-19 09:24:23

I sincerely hope this ignorant, offensive, bitchy woman is now an EX friend, OP!
Oh, and if they did give out medals for endurance in childbirth, you’d be up there on the podium. Have a hug.

SchadenfreudePersonified Tue 12-Feb-19 09:30:00

I've done it both ways - emergency caesarian first time round, then a natural vaginal birth.

Each had it's pros and cons, but I'd far rather have a vaginal birth - took much less time to recover from, and I think my baby was less distressed and easier to settle, too - could have just been his personality, but I think the combination of his stress during labour, my anxiety, and being "pluck'd untimely from the womb" made for a baby that was very difficult to get into a routine.

buffysummers4 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:30:13

I have never heard anyone say anything like that. Almost everyone in my antenatal classes (NHS) had sections for various reasons. Find some proper friends! I've had an emergency and elective section and nobody has said anything along those lines. Even if people had some misguided views about sections what kind of person actually expresses that to someone who has just had one??

DeadButDelicious Tue 12-Feb-19 09:30:50

Blimey, with friends like these eh? I had a completely elective section due to a previous traumatic birth that left me with PTSD, no way was I ever putting myself through vaginal birth again. If anyone ever tries to tell me that I didn't 'give birth' to DD I take great pleasure in agreeing with them and saying that I had her extracted. I find it takes the wind out of their sales somewhat. Bloody judgemental arseholes. You're well rid by the sound of it. You don't need 'friends' like that.

Gumbo Tue 12-Feb-19 09:32:15

I knew someone who had this view - only she was the person who - like you - had ended up with an EMCS after a long labour that failed to progress! She honestly felt that she'd 'failed' and 'hadn't given birth properly' - despite ending up with a beautiful healthy baby. sad

I have no idea why some people think this way, it's a very unhealthy attitude.

Shinyletsbebadguys Tue 12-Feb-19 09:33:42

What a ridiculous friend

Good for you OK for seeing through her that she's not your friends

I had two emcs, one with ds1 because of severe GD and one where I developed Hellp syndrome which hit with the worst pain I have ever felt whilst on a scan table that resulted in ds2 being born very early spending 7 weeks in nicu and me spending two in intensive care ,my vile Exmil as bad as she is heard a single comment about me "not giving birth properly " from a friend of hers and instantly threw the friend out of her house and ended a 20 year friendship

The women is and was Batshit but even she knew better than to entertain that bollocks

You have birth if a baby came out of your body that's the beginning and end of it , at whatever stage in whatever way and whatever happened afterwards you have birth

OurChristmasMiracle Tue 12-Feb-19 09:40:21

OP I had a vaginal birth and your birth sounds much more physically and emotionally traumatic than mine!!

I would never think a c section is the easy way out- fgs it’s major surgery. I haven’t seen many women up and walking normally 2 hours after a c section like I was after my vagibal birth and that’s because it’s a massive trauma for the body.

Jamiefraserskilt Tue 12-Feb-19 09:41:35

This is more common than you think. One lady in my anti natal group told me I was not a true mother having not gone through natural childbirth and was very disappointed I stopped bf at 12 weeks. I had an elective due to breech presentation and chose to do this after horrendous mini labour during previous miscarriage. My baby's wellbeing was more important than mine. Cs is not an easy option. I had two with post surgery infections and issues. She later went on to have an emergency section because she refused scans and wanted a twin home birth. Baby 1 was breech, cord dropped and she was asleep during the birth due to GA. Did that make her any less of a mother? No.

grumiosmum Tue 12-Feb-19 09:42:04

Giving birth is not a badge of honour for who suffered the most. FFS.


Sounds like another woman trying to bring other women down. Too many for one morning! I must do some work now ...

sparkles87 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:43:18

I had a birth very similar to yours.. if anyone said that to me then I'd let rip.. I'd of given anything for a natural birth rather than have my lady parts cut open and my baby dragged out with forceps.. giving birth naturally is the 'easy way' if there even is such a thing.. it's nature.. we're all encourage to do it that way as that's the most natural and easiest to recover from... this woman is obviously extremely ignorant! No one deserves an opinion on anyone else's birth experience..

OpalIridescence Tue 12-Feb-19 09:43:39

Back to back and forceps for 1st. C section for 2nd.

All Labours are different, the only non variable here is that your friend is a total arsehole.

AngelaStorm73 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:44:41

I've had similar births to yours but the forceps worked. That does not make me "more of a mother" that makes me incredibly lucky. I have never had to have a CS and honestly that worries me much more than going through transition again (and I transition badly). My only hope for next delivery (pregnant now) is that I don't have to have a CS. Because I would actually rather have my vagina cut open and sewn back together but be able to lift the baby afterwards. I used to (naively, stupidly) think that CS were easier. But I know people who have had them and there recovery is so much harder. Sounds like you had the worst of everything @Reallyreallyreally1 I'm amazed you managed not to shout at them.

StoppinBy Tue 12-Feb-19 09:44:58

I think if someone said that to me I would walk away from them forever.

I had a three day 'prelabour' of continuous unrelenting contractions, mainly in my back, day and night with my first, 4cm dilation, induction with no further dilation and a c/s, my second I had 24 hours of the same followed by a c/s. Don't tell me I didn't have a baby, a lot of women I know who have had a vaginal birth went through a hell of a lot less and didn't get left with pain of a major surgery to boot.

One of my friends went in to labour then fell asleep and woke up at 10cm dilated before having a peaceful water birth.... one lucky lady lol. Another friend went in to labour, had half hour of labour then pushed her baby out, no tearing and went home a few hours later... another lucky lady IMO.

Everyone's experience is different, don't let your friend make you believe you don't know what birth is about.

AntiStuff Tue 12-Feb-19 09:47:20

Get some new friends. Preferably ones that don't have such a fragile sense of their own self worth that they have to play top trumps on giving birth. Having a baby's head emerge from your vagina doesn't make you a superior being.

You'll look back on this in a few years and laugh, trust me, but to say that to a new mother is pretty fucking twatty.

Your experience actually sounds really quite tough, and I hope that if you feel you need to go back over it at any point you can arrange a 'birth reflections' meeting/debrief with the hospital, I found mine very helpful.

YouBoggleMyMind Tue 12-Feb-19 09:48:56

Well she sounds like a knob hmm

zzzzz Tue 12-Feb-19 09:49:44

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AngelaStorm73 Tue 12-Feb-19 09:50:07

Shocked somebody said that to your cousin @Reallyreallyreally1
Unfortunately I have heard people (other mothers) be very negative about the experiences of women who have lost babies. Saying they are weird/morbid if they bring up still born baby or baby who died shortly after birth. Or that women who miscarry/stillbirth/baby dies aren't "real" mothers
Likewise if you don't breastfeed you don't "know what it feels like to bond with baby"
And the vitriol I've heard about step mothers who can't have or haven't had their own but have raised their husband/partners kids and even adopted mothers or those who used a surrogate is absolutely shocking.

havingtochangeusernameagain Tue 12-Feb-19 09:51:31

I was similar to you OP but the forceps worked and I avoided the c-section. Surely giving birth any old how is "becoming a mother" (and you've put up with 9 months of pregnancy and the discomfort that comes with that).

Why do some women validate themselves by the sort of birth? It's very odd and very self-indulgent. Plus the fact it's not about the birth, it's about the way you bring up the child after that.

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